Please reverse this unfair damage throttling for non-T1 and T2 DD classes.

Dear developers,

with the Renewal of Ro addon you seem to have introduced damage output throttling for all non-T1/T2 DD classes, especially on all heroic and raid nameds.

• Nothing has been published about this game mechanic, but it is massively noticeable.

Please reconsider and rescind this.

• For 18 years you could do something every day in the game with the group and the raid. Since Renewal of Ro, you've been sitting around in the game for 6 out of 7 days, hoping that a T1/T2 DD will come online so you can maybe complete your weeklies. Playing normal to have fun, enjoying them progress and gear is completely left out, the fun is left out.
• Because without T1 and/or T2 DD's you can no longer dispute content. It starts with T1 heroics. Groups with fewer than 6 players are practically no longer possible. You can still do something solo and that's about it. This will break the entire game.
• A lot of people are leaving the game right now for this very reason.
• Quite apart from the fact that it is absolutely unfair that, for example, despite better stats, i.e. more critical bonus, more potency, more fervor and the corresponding overcap stats, as well as the same resolve, with the same abilites in a better quality level, Deals less damage than the T1/T2 DD's with the same abilities. Good to noticeable at ascensions abilities, if the T1/T2 DD does from the double up to 5 times more damage with the same abilites. Ascensions were never intended to be subordinate to the base character class. But it seems that there was now a damage output throttling.
• We play this game to play it and not to sit around until you get a group with the best possible setup, which takes more than 90% of the total game time.
• The problem that predominates in this addon is that without T1/T2 DDs in the group, which then also have to have the right ratio of critical bonus to critical bonus overcap gear, absolutely nothing can be done. You just sit there pointless.

Of course, this does not affect the people who have been walking around in such "optimal groups" for years anyway. But these are not the bulk of players.

So please reverse this unfair damage throttling for non-T1 and T2 DD classes.

Furthermore, please continue to think about the currently far too high amounts of necessary crafting resources for the short-time adornments and other needed consumeables, that are absolutely necessary in the meantime.

Thanks
best regards
Ingerimm

Welcome to Daybreaks vision of EQ2, piss on the casuals, cater to the elite few.

Thanks for the memory. That was so much fun.

Maybe Caith should have a look on the balancing table and the real output.

I do not think some things happening atm are really working as intended

Its been heading for this since POM was introduced, there is no way they can reverse the mess thats been created. I'm guessing its profitable for them?
I dont see how, but logically the profit has to be there somewhere, otherwise you would have to be an idiot to be that shortsighted.

Maybe its all part of a master plan to ... um??,
I dont know

Yes and It’s gotta be profitable because nothing else makes sense.

There's always Hanlon's razor.

I'd like to see some proof of your claims that you're seeing the same abilities hit for wildly different amounts at the same tier of spell and same stat levels for different classes. It is far more likely you're unaware of the buffs/etc that the DPS class is getting as opposed to your non DPS class, rather than some invisible damage throttle - I'm certainly not seeing mine hitting for far less than 'T1/T2 DD' classes, and you can't argue that a Guardian wouldn't have this imaginary throttle.

The big damage limiter this expansion is Crit Bonus. It's fairly easy to get lots of Crit Chance and Crit Bonue, but hard to get enough CB Overcap.

Take a look at the stats discussion thread.

Oh, the other limiter is the Familiar randomly unsummoning itself... Check to make sure it's up!

That's the way you say it, but this has nothing to do with my topic, Sigrdrifa.

What is meant is that I, for example, as a tank or healer or supporter, can no longer cause damage compared to a T1/T2 DD. Even if you're in combat and a full party with around 36,500 crit bonus each and around 1150 fervor and 1,050,000 potency, as long as you're not a T1 or T2 DD, you're doing a lot less DPS. Despite equal or better stats than the T1 and T2 DD's.

You can only reach these values with all possible runes + cb group bufff runes as 2x "field medic" + shorttime additions + painlinks. Therefore it is also a problem if the group consists of less than 6 people, because then these group buffs + painlinks are missing. This then makes groups with fewer people almost impossible.

At the moment, T1 and T2 DDs (with balanced CB and CBOC stats), as a single character in a group as a whole, do 2 to 5 times the dps of the entire rest (5 people) of the whole group combined.

• DD's are DD's, they should do a little more damage. e.g. double a tank, that's ok. But not 5 times more than the rest of the entire group, that's utopian.

And this is exactly what creates the problem. Since this DPS is also necessary to kill the encounters in a reasonable amount of time, or to counteract the scripts such as spawning adds.

There just aren't enough DD's available, especially since more dps always makes things easier, of course the already stronger groups take more DD's than just one to be even faster.

And if the DDs have their stuff, they log out, unlike the necessary tanks who always ran with several groups until everyone had their stuff. Most DD's just have a different game mentality, that's why they play DD's and not healers and tanks.

The game balancing system before Renewal of Ro was a thousand times better than the current one.

The whole thing is exacerbated by the infinitely high amounts of resources required for the absolutly necessary consumables as painlinks and shortime adornments, thorn potions, snacks, eat and drink, energy inverters and so on and also by the 1 prime stat per gear pice of the equipment.

In prior expacs, I could use my monk and do enough dps to make a non-standard group viable to complete the zone in a moderately timely fashion. That is definitely not the case now (regardless of gear/stats).

Heroic mobs just have a ton of hp right now. While I understand that this is to limit bypassing the scripts, it creates issues where you can't get content done unless you have exactly the right folks online.

Tanks, healers, and support classes aren't SUPPOSED to do damage like a T1 or T2 DPS.

Looks like they are scripting people out of the game

I don't disagree. OTOH, I'd say tanks shouldn't be outparsing healers when it comes to healing parse, but that's happening as well. I think it's safe to say that, in some respects, this game is so far out of whack, it's the Titanic steaming full speed ahead towards the ice berg. And the dev crew are the band on this ship.

That's not quite true!

Each character class has to make a certain amount of damage, especially when it comes to challenge content.

Why should a bad T1 DD do more damage than a good tank or good healer or good supporter? The class alone should never decide that you automatically take a place in the DPS.

With the same state of equipment and the same playful skills, the DD should have a DPS advantage, that's right. But as already noted, a small DPS advantage and not the 5 times damage from the entire rest of the group.

On the whole thing there must be a balance between the classes, so that with "somewhat" more time, a resulting sense should be achievable. Unless you want to exclude all players from the game, of course, who do not have optimal groups.

This is exactly what the separate Ascension classes were introduced in the game in the end in order to compensate for the DPS, for DPS weak classes, regardless of their basic character class. On the other hand ascension classes are completely seperate classes, them had nothing to do with the base character class and this should be stay so. At the moment this seems the opposite.

There can be no balanced amount of each class in one game. Especially not, after this has existed for more than 18 years and the creating of new characters with other character classes, to the current status, takes years.

The more optimal groups form, the more players from other classes remain who can no longer do anything in the game except solo content. An MMORPG is about group game and not about solo content.

At the moment, the optimal group looks so that it consists of three T1/T2 DD's, a supporter, a healer and a tank.

This alone reverses the entire original EQ2 game mechanics.

The good thing about EQ2 has always been that you can achieve everything with playful skills, script knowledge and a corresponding degree of patience and this with the most various group setups.

Even not optimal groups had the opportunity to achieve almost everything. This was an advantage and not a disadvantage of the game, which is now destroyed very quickly.

Most of the still present players love the diversity of EQ2 and not an absolute class delimitation for the most perfect as possible groups with the maximum DPS. But of course there is also a small amount of elite players who prefer this, only these are very few and not the mass of the players who should decide.

These few are not the one who keeps the entire game running, but it is the mass of the player base that does this.

Once again, I'd like to see you provide *any* evidence that two players with the same stats casting the same spell at the same tier are seeing it hit for massively different amounts just due to being different classes.

Ascensions don't bridge the gap because, unless you have upgraded the few 21-25 DD spells, your abilities are all well outleveled. Lower tier abilities nearly all do reduced damage to higher tier enemies.

All that aside, anybody thats not a summoner or ranger has to admit its pretty annoying, at best, to do heroic content without one of those classes.

Swashy can at least merc adds, but theyre not a whole lot better than a zerk or SK ST.

Assassins are just pitiful when comparing dps output and group utility they offer.

I'd argue the brunt of his post stands. The same spell, different class thing im dubious about.

A mediocre t1 shouldn't be 70%+ of the groups dps.

One of the problems was that, eg. an T1 DD as eg. etheralist does with weaker stats, a lot more damage with the same ascension spells, as eg. "Levinbolt III" or "Implosion" ticks was up to 5 times higher with this Renewal of Ro addon, as from non T1/T2 DD classes. So the damage output of non T1 / T2 DD classes seems be directly trimmed / throttled down. The same seems to count for class abilities but them you can't compare between diffrent classes.

Wouldn't that be semi hilarious? Some sort of class based damage reduction. Could be fun to inadvertently prove here and the devs not respond to mechanics being shown to not work according to pre established rules theyve set for years?

I wonder if that's the first time theyve done that....

In the end, it doesn't even matter what exactly it is.

• Personally, I would assume class-specific damage reduction on the encounters, but it can depend on other things as well.
  [If you visit the old, eg. last addon content, the problem seems do not exist, at least not noticeably, but compared to before, you have 3-4 times the amount of critical bonus there. So hard to say.]

The problems that need to be addressed are:

1. That without T1 / T2 DD's you can't do senseful group instances anymore.
2. That you can no longer senseful do group instances with less than 6 group members.
3. The fact that you can only make successful progress with raids if you use as many as three T1/T2 DDs in each group, so this is where the problem comes in as well.