I hate it to be right but like i sayed LU24 has nerved Lanets to uselessnes

was meaning an average corse it hits for higher and lower and yes its less usefull on raids it does NOT stop CA if its suposed its not working properly atm. it only stops auto atk and 2.8 secs of stoped auto atack does not realte to much of anything on a raid mob considering it can still hit you with the big spells and CA.
and 15k will only be stoped in lil less then 3 sec from a raid mob if your tank has crap gear or the mob CA with the exception of myabe some endgame deathtoll mobs i havent seen 1 raid mob debuffed that can pump out 15k autoatk in under 3 seconds
Message Edited by ravenscale on 06-22-2006 05:09 PM

If it were any more than it is in terms of control effects it would be too powerful. I never hit for less than 700 with Lanet's, due to Verliens. I hit all over the map with it before (though admittedly I did get a lot of nice hits). It is NOT supposed to stop CAs... just autoattack. But the thing is, whether or not the mob hits with a CA... it WILL hit with autoattack. This stops the autoattack portion. That CAN be enough to save a MT running the ragged edge of healing. Let me be clear: Your MT WILL take less damage in the time that Lanet's is landed, because the mob always autoattacks, whether it is using a CA or not.
It does less damage. You'll only really notice that on raids, since most other encounters are too short. But even there, you're not even talking about 2% less DPS. =/

That all said... I'm not gonna try to convince you. Really. =) If you don't like it, you *don't* have to use it. I realize that you lost something you enjoyed to use, and I'm very sorry about that. I too wish they had chosen to give us another art rather than change the existing one (though I would have preferred it be on disease in any event), but the existing one is worse than the old one in precisely *one* way, and better in a whole lotta others. More people gain by this change than lose. It's not justification; it's just the way it is.

EDIT: clarification.
Message Edited by Godstalk on 06-22-2006 05:19 PM

lol i dont want this to become endless banter with you cause normally i agree woith alot you say yes its still hass its usess and as far as the 600 is the acerage of the spell meaning its dmg range not in or debuffs hits for more then that for me as well just implieing its spell range as far as loss od dps is FAR more then 2% my master2 tops out spell range(again not what it actully hits for) at 745 asuming it hits at that high end in a 1 min raid fight you have 24.8 dps off it ald stylye for me was 1320 wich in a 1 min raid fight is 66 dps... wich most main raid mobs last 1min+
on a side note i do like it for soloing lol made heroics a mess of alot easier 8) but sence i primarly raid i do not like the change over all

Has anyone parsed epic fights, and then afterwards gone back and looked at the damage percenteges? If you do, you'll see that the large majority of damage most (i said most, this gets me out of trouble when people talk about singualr encounters) epic mobs do is auto-attack. Now that having been said, 2.3 secs of no auto-attack is friggin awesome. I'm not about to say if u don't agree with me, you don't know how to play your class, but this is a huge boon if u think about it logically. And as far as the immunity goes after the effect hits....communicate with the other daze using members of your raid....work out a schedule....

Heck -any- less damage is damage that doesn't need to be blocked or healed. For just the little bit, it can make the difference.

Agreed. And then when u toss an occasional heal, and you match that up with having percussion up(despite the fact that it breaks my farking stealth), the healers in my grp love me

There is no point to working out a schedule. A single enchanter, who's daze lasts a full second longer than our own, is capable of keeping a mob either dazed or immune to daze the entire fight, they don't need our help to keep something dazed. Even a single dirge can almost do that, with a 5 second space in which the mob can be dazed. I'm just happy the damage part still hits even if the mob is immune to daze. Because 90% of the time on the raids I've been on the mob is either dazed or immune, even without me.
You could even argue that my daze prevents the enchanter from using there daze, which lasts longer and therefore prevents more damage.
Daze seems nice if you only look at dirges, but when you look at the bigger picture it looks a little more blah.
Message Edited by Kahna on 06-23-2006 06:36 PM

There is even more of no point to work out a schedule as your daze should not affect epics at all.

Our daze does indeed effect epics, sorry chanters but you aren't the only ones.

Not sure what you're seeing Dak... or how. My root works guaranteed every time I use it (haven't really on a raid though). My Daze works *guaranteed and parsed* every time I use it solo/group... and I have used this on raids, though it's harder for me to take the time to parse it here.

What level versions in those spell lines are you using Dakwa. It could possibly be a bug with lower vesions? Also, your on a PvP server right? You talking against mobs or other players?

I lvled 50 just before the LU, and have not lvled since (mostly doing raids now, as soloing is out). So mine is pre-50, I think that is Lvl 45? This one Vis is on BB so not a pvp server.
On the PVP server, I have a lvl 32 Dirge, that can daze anyone out there and watch them auto attak at will, and root and run up and attack without issues. So on both Dirges I have removed the songs, and they are doing better with pleanty of protection, which before was never an isse. On PVP this is a major issue as the guild I am in has a bounty (my dirge included in the top ten) and now he is an easy target when not protected.
Sheesh I made a dirge there because I felt they would do good and this was my favorite class. Now so freaken gimped.

I made a dirge just after LU 24 on Venekor (main was a troub there) and love all of the dirge changes for pvp. Daze really does a number on tanks/melee dps, especially in long fights (er... I know not an issue at higher levels, but they do last at lower levels) where power is in short supply and spamming CAs isn't an option.
The bow change, needless to say, is priceless in pvp...
I also like both for pve as well, as I solo a lot and feel more powerful because of the changes...
Definately beats being a troub right now, that's for sure.

Regarding the root, I'd be interested in knowing if the first shot failed. My experience has been if the first shot fails then Sapping Shot is pretty much a wipe and the target doesn't get hit with the root. Since I never used the bow spell before LU24 my skill currently sucks and I miss about 50-60 percent of the time at lvl 34 in EL.

But if I hit it right the first time, the target is rooted and unless it's a caster I get in 3 debuffs and can start Lanet's before the critter is in my face.

As for Lanet's, I don't keep track of my combat logs well enough to know if it is really doing me any good. But it's more DPS so I cast it anyway.

So far, with the exception of when I used to solo 4-5 lvls higher, I seldom miss 53 and below, now resists are a different subject of course, adn this si what I am basing my views here on. So far with the root, on every successful root (where there is no "resisted" raised above the target) it has had seldom worked and when it did, any buff or attack broke it immediately 100% of the time, but still these were the few cases where it worked, and other times whjen it supposedly worked the target had no restrictions in movement.
Lanent's, at least you don't have to worry about the spell hitting, so only one chance to miss, and that is resist. When there is no resist, the target has no hinderence in movement, auto attack, or any effect, and usually moves faster(?) an no first hit from the opponent is under 1500 damage.
Lie I have said before the two seem to actually benefit the opponent more than my Dirge, so have dropped them from my use and now doing better, as long as I don't go over 50-51 2downs. I cannot even solo 50-51 evens any more let alone where I was.
This nurf has severely gimped my main Dirge.

I'm really puzzled by this since so far your the only one I know that has this problem. Is there anyway we can get a look at your combat logs when it is bugging like this? Maybe we can figure something out from them.

I know there is a way to copy your combat chat screen, but I have yet to be able to do so. I wanted to do this the first time someone said there was no way I could solo 4-5 lvls above me. I cannot get anythiing on the screnes to copy without doing a screne shot and that limits what is seen. And from experience, I know going to the GM's is a waste of time, as they always havce some excuse for not being able to help.
Message Edited by Dakwa on 06-28-2006 05:03 AM

If you type /log before the fight, it should output everything to a log file in the log/server folder in your EQ2 directory. Much easier than screen shots.

/log will turn logging back off again.

ty did not know that.