Focused Feedback - Mages

Discussion in 'Mages' started by Xelgad, Nov 14, 2014.

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  1. Ranga Active Member

    Gem of the MInd.

    I include it here because it can only be used by chanters. It has a return (so far) less than Mutagenic Shred and is a clicky. In it's current form, I am not even sure I'll keep it even though it costs a fortune to make. Certainly atm the cost is not worth the return. Recast is too long also. If it were a minute instead of 3 it might be worth it.

    Temporal Mimicry

    Does not crit. Seems strange for a prestige endline.
  2. Wreakinn Member


    Xelgad, there are some very good posts here. I hope you're actually reading what people are saying because some of this stuff has been broken for yyyeeeaaaarrrssss now. I have played a conjuror for a looooong time and have seen no effort to change the things that quite frankly, you guys are aware of by now. I will give you points for trying if this is finally an attempt to change those things.

    There is one that particularly bugs me in your favor, however: Planar Motion isn't broken, people. It mitigates all damage. Bolded for a reason, but quite honestly not going to say what, as I'm afraid the reason I like the spell so much is that it's not working as intended in our favor.

    1. As others have said: so many trees are WILDLY outdated, with stats that are 100% irrelevant. I focus on the AA lines, but there are points here that apply to spells in general:

    1. 5% pot for Teamwork? Wheeee. Cabalist's Aura is a little weak too.
    2. Magician's Aptitude is a joke, and always has been.
    3. Plus 4 int for Possess Minion? Meh
    4. Wild Channeling, Theurgistic Prowess, Minion's Channeling: pointless, but have to spend points.
    1. Petrify is stupidly underpowered because of its huge cast time and high cooldown.
    2. As mentioned, Plane Shift is a joke now, and after reading some of the posts, I wonder why I even cast it. The 5 points spent here are useless.
    3. Flameshield damage is quite paltry.
    4. Sacrifice is a little underpowered, not going to spend 5 points to bump it up.
    5. Hydromancer is one of the most stupid AA's in the whole game - seriously, no one has even tried to use this for over 5 years. Incredibly underpowered and useless.
    6. As with Petrify: Fire Seed is a joke. Why would I spend AA points in it?
    7. You can cap Enh: V Skin and M Intervention easily enough, so those AA's are 100% useless now. Same with Heal Servant.
    1. Minion's Crit: 100% outdated
    2. Pet Weapon Mastery buffs: decent for fire pet, useless for melee pets
    3. Elem Pact: 100% outdated
    4. Offensive Onslaught: this is getting a separate section so that I can use a lot of capital letters
    5. Ancient Calling and Focused Disciple: no one has ever used these.
    1. Ability Mod gain is way outdated
    2. Used Minion's Intent years ago; it sucked and I never bothered again. Is it good now? taunt values have been increased (for the record, I LOVE Discreet Employer), so maybe....but I doubt it
    3. Energy Clash will never ever be used, because you lose too much by not going Soulburn
    4. Servant's Intervention is now pretty useless with the excellent new line from AoM. If you're dying hard enough for 2 death saves, you probably shouldn't be there anyway. See also: giving up dps from SB
    1. The left side of the line is far too underpowered; would be surprised if anyone ever even bothered to try it
    2. Planar Dampening needs love, way too low of a chance to hit. Mystical Leadership: outdated
    1. Ancient Fury line is wildly underpowered.
    2. Resist Break: seriously, why? Ridiculously low chance to ever work.
    3. Endline is severely underwhelming.
    4. Trak Essence line is useless compared to the other lines
    5. I love the middle trees. Good job!
    2. Agg stance on pets is broken, you have known this for years, and yet no one does anything about it. Is this thread supposed to indicate you're actually going to finally look at it? Why does Off Onslaught even exist?

    3. Weak pets in general (NOT the fire pet, its damage is very nice). I don't care about the skin on the 97 Earth pet. I am disappointed you released a wimpy, broken version of it, however. Earth pet is rarely needed when I can just go Daeron and fire pet. Why should I use it? Why should I ever use the Air?

    Hydro? Don't make me laugh.

    4. You guys did a LOT of good things with the expac. I was probably the first to do the sig quest (discoed on my server, anyway) and I loved the challenge of that encounter. I remain skeptical that some of these things will change, however...

    Beee, Laiina and Kazz like this.
  3. Gnomad_Madgon Active Member


    Offensive Debuff
    • Dismay - An impairment that decreases the enemies offensive abilities
    • Effects - Decreases Crushing, Piercing, Slashing and Ranged of target by X
    This is the only offensive debuff Illusionist get and I am fairly certain it has zero impact.

    Proposed change = After using Detect Weakness on a few mobs while playing my Ranger I would say a good replacement for the weapon skill reduction would be either Accuracy and/or Strikethrough. Perhaps the spell itself can reduce Accuracy, and one of the AA lines can add Strikethrough reduction to the spell, just a thought.

    Illusionist Tree - Enhanced Dismay 3% increase reduction per point
    Shadow Tree - Disappointing Offense 5% increased reduction per point

    Gnomad - Crushbone
    Celrath and Yukinoh like this.
  4. Laserbeak Member

    AGREED AGREED AGREED. And IMHO necro's need the most help out of all mages.... Like Whats the actualy formula to Lifeburn.. because me taking max health... increases my lifeburn...But getting DG casted on me... makes lifeburn less...? Is it truely based of stamina? and Is it eventually going to be modified somehow by potency? I mean lifeburn is pretty useless unless you've equiped the rod of ruin.. got all the stamina/max health you can...and even then its SCAREY to cast.

    Undead Horde:
    Maybe a slight reduction of undead horde? clip a minute or 45 seconds off? Like something... awakened grave and blighted horde are on the same time as communnion yet dont even hold a candle to communion...not even close do I Agree on a linked encouter...undead horde.. will ****.. yes.. but on everything else.. even undead horde cant hold to communion...sad :(

    now I havent played a necro in a long time ... so there may have been changes im unaware of....been so busy getting the sin ready to raid I havent had any time on the Necro... SO if anything doesnt apply just ignore it...

    I truly loved playing a necro.. but in the end of the day... the buffs were much better on a warlock..(which I went to) even with the small maxhealth debuff necro's get.
    Kaizar likes this.
  5. ruthless619 Member

    1. I agree with this.
    2. Agree as well.
    3. No way should a pet be able to tank heroics. Sorry your asking for too much here.
    Shared Autoattack stats with our pets will help fix alot of issues... Also forces us to have different gear builds for melee pets.
    4. Agree with this.
    5. Agree to an extent. Double its Damage and let it be affected by crit bonus/pot.
    6. No opinion on this spell IMO just remove it from our spell book.
    7. 20% boost in damage should be good.
    8 150% agree with this.
    9. Make it castable out of combat and increase Immunity to 6 sec.
    10. I agree but this can make us overpowered also in one shot, be careful what you wish for.
  6. Anunnaki Active Member

    How do you figure this will make us OP?
    Wreakinn and Kazz like this.
  7. Laiina Well-Known Member

    I think that the Shards being almost totally useless is one of my main pet peeves. People don't even bother to ask for them anymore, because using one is not even enough to cast some of the higher power using spells.

    Many have mentioned some of the more useless early AA's, such as summon food/drink and a few others. As far as the scout pet goes, dump it and give us decorative only Penguin pet or something...
    Wreakinn likes this.
  8. Laiina Well-Known Member

    Agree 100% that Fire Seed and Flame Shield are nearly useless. Why not just combine them into some somewhat useful buff that you can cast on two people/pets/mercs whatever with about 3-4x the current damage
    Wreakinn likes this.
  9. Wreakinn Member

    3. No way should a pet be able to tank heroics. Sorry your asking for too much here.

    Based on what? Your opinion, because you secretly long for the days of EQ1? Pets have been able to tank heroics forever now, just not very well for harder mobs (champs, 102+ mobs). I've used the earth pet as a tank in pugs. They could use a little more power for those of us who like to solo, however, because they do not do as well as top tier mercs + a fire pet - still too squishy. They (and the air pet) are 100% irrelevant.

    Please leave the "I want everything nerfed back to EQ1-style difficulty" at the door unless you know what you're talking about, thanks.
  10. Akina_Storms Active Member

    Back in DoF days, near 9 years ago, i've tank all group donjons with my earth pet, a fury and 4 wizards (or warlocks)...
    very fun to do
    I'd die to do this sort of things nowadays.
  11. Celrath Member

    Many of my thoughts on the Conjuror class have been posted so I will not reiterate most of them here other than to say that I heavily agree.

    I would like to see the offensive stance changed to flat out give the pet a bonus to its base damage as well as a decrease to its hate gain. In doing this it would make the offensive stance truly offensive. However this bonus to its base damage MUST be consistent with the damage that we gain in defensive stance and must be able to scale in the same way that the defensive stance has for so long.

    In return for changing the offensive stance in such a way, the defensive stance could be reworked to give the pet a damage reduction buff as opposed to more hp. Once again provided that WE DO NOT LOSE ANY DPS BY THESE POTENTIAL CHANGES, I think this would be a good way forward.
    Gnomad_Madgon likes this.
  12. Vexrm Member

    Illusionist Mana Regen

    You knew this was coming. I'm getting it in before the deadline. Illusionists are designed to lessen the amount of mana spent per spell. That's all great. HOWEVER....

    1) Spells cost 500 mana or less. Mana pools are pushing a million now. By mid expansion I expect them to be much higher. This means reducing spell cost doesn't have a huge impact.

    2) None of our reducers work on any ability that takes a percent base of some ones mana.

    3) Mirage Mastery is currently returning about 800 mana per hit.

    4) There's an increase in things that take away percent mana.

    Combine that all together and if we are in a mana drain fight or some one uses the Humming Geode of Vivacious Power or a poorly timed Mana burn and I can't get some ones power back up. I can get one person with mana flow, or life burn to get the groups power up, but our basic tools aren't useful in any situation they are needed.
  13. Kraeref Well-Known Member

    You have coercers for manafeed.
  14. Vexrm Member

    You are correct.

    However, once upon a time Illies were there for mana and coercers were there for DPS.

    If there's a continuation of "Lose % mana per second" buffs and actives, it would be nice for the illies who are designed to lower mana drain to be able to lower that as well.

    I am not asking for one button to top people off. I'm asking for the mechanics they said they want the illy to focus on to work in these situations.
  15. arturos Active Member

    yes the abilities that the illy has to keep their group topped off are just not strong enough in the topping off department. I am constantly having to cover feed.

    As for necros needing loving? really? hrm i have had the luck to watch a twitch feed or two or three of guilds that are raiding current content where the necro is not only topping the parse but by a 1.5 to 2 mil margin. Yes there were wizzys and locks and rangers in those raids as well. No not a burst topping temporarily on the top of the parse i mean consistently throughout the named fight.. oh ya didnt see em cast lifeburn LULZ. Now i just wish they would open up their AA windows.. i must know......
  16. Enigma Active Member

    Arturos you must have been watching low end raiding guilds doing perhaps easy mode current content..Necros are not top of the dps charts its assassin's/sorcerer's/conj's then rangers.
  17. arturos Active Member

    true its not one of the Russian guilds but at least one of the guilds is in the top 20 the other one is in the top three on my server.. I have been around a while I know the difference between a scrub casual guild and a real raid guild. Heck even back in the day sciomar used to tell me that life burn was a crutch for scrub necros that don't know the real rotation... And if you know that name then that should lend some credibility to my statements.. Would complete stat sharing with pets and summoners be a buff you darn right it would be. It might be a little too much though and i am willing to bet that the sorcs will scream bloody murder when our dps goes to a true 50/50 with the pet...

    Oh and if you want specific fights one was the inquisitor in COB the rest were in highhold and bbay.. does that spell it out for you enough enigma?

    The reason i am not naming names is that i am grateful for the chance to view how the big boys play these are not public channels..
  18. slica Active Member

  19. Olli New Member

    id like coercers to have the same as mage or scout where swd/wdb and even double cast are given to us, our auto up to same, you want us as melee give us reason to be melee, buffs redone so we are useful in a group again, our hate transfer actually mean something again and pl even more worth putting on a player, our help with wards increased, ev group wide would be awesome. Let us actually be a useful and needed utility class again. Please give love equal to both coercer and illie instead of one being uber the other crap we deserve equal love....
  20. Cleaner Active Member

    I will say this I am torn, For years my main was a wizard, then i started playing my Warlock again with COE as my secondary Main, now im looking back at my crusty coercer. Ehh , My Wizzard is Doing outstanding i can get much higher parses, both toons have the same gear but with the new crit system on a fiery blast i can almost double my warlocks chain.

    On the Warlock ,This may need to be confirm its more of a suspicion at the moment, but it seems to me (From staring at ACT in confusion) Some of my warlocks spells do not EVER land a special crit. i am working on a list of spells to keep monitoring them and see if i can ever get one of them to hit. i even spec'ed into the forced Crit spec to see if its hitting, one thing that REALLY irritates me is Eternal damnation is not upgrading with spell upgrade / another thing Dark Aggravation is a broke joke (No SDA) / and the new prestige so far are BLEH . No real enhancements here at other than stat inflations that help in small increments.

    Wizard :) im liking this so far, the stat inflation is amazing i hit 12mil with "- basic crafted and last xpac potent gear-" (4 mil over the lock that used to stay above me last xpac) Now i didn't raid much on the wizzy last xpac because my warlock was more powerful they wanted it instead.
    The new Critical system is 10x's better than FC for a wizard hands down. one thing i looked at was if Crit Chance once over 1200 you can go beastmode. when i get some of the green gemed , or raid gear , who knows what ill be doing. (waves by to the lock).

    Now my Coercer is SOO much fun to play, and with the new mimicry spell omg is it fun and i am relevent to the raid as actual competative dps , and if timed right with concorto and TW wow i actually topped a parse off of a wizzards FB actually beat the wizzards dps with his own spell rotation. he blamed it on lag though HEHE.

    My Necro is OP all the way i can single target outparse the wizard and warlock without breaking a sweat, i can also fight them for the tops spots on AOE fights....yeah they hate me, i can break 6mil with trash gear (TOV) on, no buffs, but he is just sooo boring to play i fall asleep pushing the same 5-6 buttons over and over on these long fights. he can parse without effort. i assume the purpose was to make them effiecient to Rez, flux but good luck getting them to be "utility" when needed lol ive grouped with a couple of other necro's they will parse push over rez everytime.

    ****Now if they just upgrade the Troubadour's UT (help the warlock keep up) definitely spell buffs and debuffs , They definitely need a "song" that gives them a big boost!***
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