What should a pet be allowed to do in Everquest?

With the upcoming changes to pet base hp/AC for 96-100 pets, reduction in power for EM focus items (starting with EM8), and the Aegis changes that have long been discussed... it is apparent that SOE believes that pets are too powerful in today's game. Regardless of your opinion on that topic, it has been discussed ad nauseum and is not my intent for this thread. Instead I would like to focus on the question in the thread topic.

I have an EM18 pet (highest current pet focus in game), with every single pet AA there is. I am a single account owner, which means my entire game focus is on my sole character and my pet. In the group game, what should I be able to do with my pet?

Joe Schmo has an EM17 pet, with every single pet AA there is. Joe is a box magician, which means Joe's owner is dealing with his primary character as well as the mage box... meaning that both characters (but especially the magician in dealing with this thread) are not being utilized to its full effectiveness. In the group game, what should Joe Schmo be able to do with his pet?

Suzy Q has an EM13 pet (highest current group pet focus), with every single pet AA there is. She is a single account owner. In the group game, what should she be able to do with her pet?

Bobby Z has an EM12 pet, with maybe 1/2-2/3 of every single pet AA there is. Bobby is a single account owner. In the group game, what should he be able to do with his pet?

Sally B has an EM12 pet, with maybe 1/2-2/3 of every single pet AA there is. Sally is a magician box, one of two boxes the account owner has. In the group game, what should she be able to do with her pet?

There are many other scenarios and situations out there, of course.... but I feel the above are the most commonplance in today's EQ. Curious to know what players and EQ Developers feel are the answers to these questions.

Like I mentioned, I am the first one (EM18, all pet AA, single account focus). I feel I should be able to handle any trash mob in RoF and SoF, and the majority of any RoF and SoF named. I am raid geared, I am 100% focused on playing my character, and I have the talents/skills/abilities as a 500+ days /played magician to be able to do so. If you disagree with that assertation, comment below...

Other than fewer days played, we are in the same boat and I agree 100%.

You feel like you should be able to handle most names in the top tier of "group" content, then why call it group content and not solo content?

I have always thought that named in group content should require a group to kill.

I don't think the majority of current content named should be able to be beaten by the efforts of a single player and their merc regardless of their class. The starting point for any tuning either from a content side or a player power side should begin with this named will most likely kill any single player and their merc and then scale down from a peak of EM18 and max AA of I have to get lucky or get someone to help to kill this named as you have lower EM or missing some AA.

I just can't get over the whole argument for these nerfs being based on "It's easier for my guild to pet tank EW, thus nerf pets". It's not easier to use a pet tank. We've one-tanked EW just about every time we've done it, and it wasn't a pet.

I can only assume those who think pet tank is better on EW raid have not yet figured out that if you face his butt to the raid, and fight on top of corpses, you take a lot more damage. Turn his face to the raid, don't fight him on top of corpses, and your healers should be able to keep your tank alive without issue.

Added bonus, you can do a lot more DPS and the fight isn't an hour long, if you don't use that pet.

These pet changes have 0 impact on raid pets. These pet changes are a 100% nerf to group and solo only. How no one at SoE has caught that yet, is a mystery. But fear not, they will catch it, and nerf pets again. And again.

All because of people who are bad at their class, and like to post as if they are an authority on every topic.

Pet shouldn't be able to tank as well as an average geared tank, they should be on par with a poorly geared tank at best.
Trash yes with merc, named no way.

Than by that theory a tank should only be able to dps as good as a poorly geared and played dps player. Its only fair right?

Amorcen

I'd say that mage pets being able to tank is the thing that makes them special. I wouldn't change it at all, even if they can tank some named/raid mobs. The other pet classes are kiters and/or slowers, but for mages having a tanking pet is how it should be. It's silly to change it at this point in the game.

Amor, you analogy is pretty broken considering you are comparing player vs player, rather than pet vs player. However, to broaden it out somewhat. In general a tank class should not dps as well as a dps class. I think pretty much everyone would agree with that general sentiment.

All group content tankable by mercs should be tankable by pets, except for mobs with special abilities such as jump, aggro latch, gravity pull, of which there are enough already in Everquest.

Any less and the principle behind the mage class is worthless.

This entire line of discussion is going to end up no where, did the changes stop mages from tanking current content?

If no, then the change means little other then less overall power but doesn't change what a mage can do.

I'm on test with a guildmate that is a 100 mage em13 and he is in t3 doing just fine with the earth pet still, mages didn't lose the ability to solo content.

Isn't that the case?

I was on test last night and there were very few people in t3, practically no one is doing t3 on test because no one knows where the phs are, so it's too early to say that.

The argument about the nerf was more about was it necessary? Was it implemented in a way to stop the problem that was being whined about so much without affecting solo and group casters? The answer to both of those is no. Regardless of whether or not the nerf changed very much it was lazy, poorly implemented, and affected people not actually participating in the problem to begin with.

What does last night have to do with what I'm saying? My guildmate is in Chelsith Reborn right now with his mage doing fine.

@Sinestra:

I don't really care to comment on the nerf specifically, the main question is does it prevent mages from soloing and doing group content? Right now I'm saying that it isn't stopping mages on test, it did drop some of their power however it didn't bottom them out and take away their ability to solo.

As a raiding mage, I agree. However I think most would agree that boosting tanks would be the best way to accomplish this, as group geared/ minimal AA tanks are horribly lacking right now. Seriously, tanks need help, and bringing mages down to their level will only hurt the group game further.

To quote the human torch, Flame on!

Actually the main question was what you thought should be capable by a pet class, the questions I asked were a reflection of your opinion that it doesn't seem to have changed enough to be a bother.

Fully agree with the above post.
+1

Which is exactly what I answered, mages can solo just fine still. Mages are still able to accomplish in RoF what most solo people would need either a cleric and dps or tank to accomplish.

It was a nerf. Parsed it out and pets take more incomming DMG and do less of other abilities while tanking.

It was not a major nerf by any means, it is the second nerf in 3 to 4 weeks pets have received though. It was also not Magician pets only, which are the culprits in raid tanking. It also does nothing for raid tanking and it will be felt by groupers.

That is what most people are not understanding. This will change nothing in the raid game. When SOE realizes that, what do you think they will do? Well the simplest answer is nerf something else on pets or nerf their AC/HP values even further. Which again will not work unless its to the point of removing 2/4 to 3/4s of their HPs and at that point there will be no Mages left to tune for.