Stamina, HPs and character creation.

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by oldemangamer, Mar 14, 2019.

  1. oldemangamer Augur

    I have been looking around on the web and saw something that said 1 sta=8.75 hps.

    I'm not sure if that is accurate or if it varies from class to class.

    I'm wondering if someone who is in the know can comment on this.

    It seems like a couple of hundred hps wouldn't be worth much at high levels because mobs hit so hard, but on the other hand I see so many guides saying put points into stamina at creation.

  2. Krezzy Augur

    HP bonus varies by class and level, with tank classes (especially Warriors) getting the most benefit. The general idea is that raid gear will bring you to the cap eventually, so do what makes sense early on. Make sure your Agi is at least 75.
  3. sumnayin2 Augur

    Most people won't be maxing anything for at least 6 months. If you plan on needing HP then go stamina. Of course this only applies to Mangler.
  4. Roxas MM Augur

    sta is the most important stat for everyone. If you run out of hps, you're not doing anything.
    PathToEternity likes this.
  5. Machentoo Augur

    For melee and tank classes, you can max every stat other than stamina by Velious. Stamina is the last one that's important to reach cap, due to buffs available to the other melee stats. So, at lot of guides recommend stamina for this reason.
  6. oldemangamer Augur

    Thank you all.
    Fallfyres likes this.
  7. Wulfhere Augur

    At low levels, the important stat is Agility >= 75 because of the AC penalty below that. I always make sure to have at leave 80 base Agility because otherwise the last 25% of your HP are wasted and ineffective because your Agility drops below 75. You can't run, can't escape a mob. You're taking max crunchie hits and you're quickly dead.

    Second might be Strength enough to carry all that heavy armor and weapons and loot. Being over burdened also means you cannot run from a mob.
    oldemangamer likes this.
  8. Koshk Augur

    ^This. Different classes get different HP returns from Stamina.

    People sometimes recommend putting points into Stamina, because there's few better options. For example, let's say you're a Magician or Wizard. Stats like strength, dexterity, agility, wisdom, and charisma don't really help you. Intelligence does. But you're likely to max that with caster gear. Leaving stamina as the only stat that helps...a little.

    You are correct. Dumping 10-30 points into stamina is only going to result in a few hundred hitpoints at most.

    But sometimes, that's still better than your other Statistic options.
    oldemangamer likes this.
  9. niente Developer

    The HP you get from 1 point of STA depends on your class and level.
    If you have over 255 STA you get 50% of the value (i.e. consider 256 STA to be 255.5 STA, or 300 STA to be 277.5 STA).

    A level 1 WAR gets 8.3% of their STA as HP.
    A level 1 MNK gets 7.1% of their STA as HP.
    A level 1 WIZ gets 6.7% of their STA as HP.

    A level 50 WAR gets 500% of their STA as HP.
    A level 50 MNK gets 425% of their STA as HP.
    A level 50 WIZ gets 400% of their STA as HP.

    At max level these percentages basically double. Ranking between classes varies by level.

    After that we add % HP buffs, + HP buffs.
    Then we get a HSTA bonus (HSTA * 10).
    Nniki, Fanra, snailish and 8 others like this.
  10. oldemangamer Augur

    Thanks for those insightful and super informative posts guys.
    I had never heard this before. I knew about the minimum 75 part, but never heard someone suggest making Agi 80. I know when you do get low hps you start getting crushed but didn't realize there was a way to avoid it.

    Did you think of this on your own or read it somewhere?
  11. Wulfhere Augur

    This is very old lore from circa 1999. Players observed the AC penalty on starting characters like dwarves and erudites compared to say wood elves and trolls, for example. We also noticed that at about 30% HP, you character starts to loose Agility as you approach death.

    So if you are at low HP and your base AGI is 75, you are now in the penalty. For low Agility characters, you effectively only have about 75% of your Hitpoints as fully vital before you become very vulnerable and effectively snared. This has always been a problem for low level or naked characters before worn gear and improved stats give you all the cushion you need.

    I choose base 80 AGI as a minimum during character creation as a low point to provide some cushion from the penalty. Higher is better, and over apx 110 agility or so keeps you above 75 even at near zero hitpoints.

    Some races are more vulnerable at creation, e.g. dwarf, to the AGI penalty then others. The default assignment for a dwarf paladin puts all points into, yep, Stamina to 115, leaving Agility at 70. This is a terrible default and handicap for at least levels 1 to 20, depending on server type and gear available. The survive-ability between a low level dwarf paladin with base 70 AGI vs base 80 (10 points invested via advanced button) is dramatic, simply due to the penalty.
  12. Protagonist Tank

    Thank you. Could you provide the % numbers for Knights as well, please?
  13. niente Developer

    Look in the Resources folder in your EQ directory
    Nniki, snailish, Protagonist and 2 others like this.
  14. Trox2010 Augur

    Without knowing exactly what I am looking at, but I would venture to guess that Knights are 8% at level 1 and 480% at level 50.

    There is nothing in the file that says who is exactly who (from what I can tell), but based on the info niente provided, and assuming knights get the second best HP ratio I would say those are correct.
    Protagonist likes this.
  15. sumnayin2 Augur

    Agility helps everyone..not getting hit is good for any class. Obviously for raiding and surviving AoEs and such pure HP is the best, but everyone gets aggro at some point running through a zone or in a group.
  16. oldemangamer Augur

    I have observed this in the past, I remember losing AGI when my hit points got low. Tonight though I was testing this out and didn't see it happening to my characters. I wonder if they removed this mechanic from the game?
  17. taliefer Augur

    Fallfyres likes this.
  18. HoodenShuklak Augur

    For raid geared players, agility is the hardest to cap up through Luclin, and after that its all maxxed.
  19. Xyroff-cazic. Director of Sarcasm

    TL;DR: You are correct!

    Boring explanation of the data but maybe mildly interesting:

    In EverQuest each class is indexed by a specific bitfield. The bitfields values are:

    1 - Warrior
    2 - Cleric
    4 - Paladin
    8 - Ranger
    16 - Shadow Knight
    32 - Druid
    64 - Monk
    128 - Bard
    256 - Rogue
    512 - Shaman
    1024 - Necromancer
    2048 - Wizard
    4096 - Magician
    8192 - Enchanter
    16384 - Beastlord
    32768 - Berserker

    These values are used in EQ for basically anything class specific. If a piece of gear is magician only, the usable classes value for that item will be assigned as 4096. If it's usable by both magician and wizard, you add the two values together and it will be assigned as 6144. If it's usable by all silk casters then the value is assigned as 15360.

    The Resources folder references classes by the order of their bitfields. However it doesn't display their actual bitfield value; it just references them in order.

    So the classes in order by the basedata's indexing:

    1) Warrior
    2) Cleric
    3) Paladin
    4) Ranger
    5) Shadow Knight
    6) Druid
    7) Monk
    8) Bard
    9) Rogue
    10) Shaman
    11) Necromancer
    12) Wizard
    13) Magician
    14) Enchanter
    15) Beastlord
    16) Berserker

    So each data set in the basedata file is indexed first by level, then by class. So the first line is


    which refers to a level 1 warrior.

    The second line is


    which refers to a level 1 cleric, etc.

    I don't know what all the basedata values mean, but we can infer (as you did) from niente's post that the 8th value in each set corresponds to the % of HP a character gains from their base STA. For knights at level 1 and 50 we have this

    Paladin: 1^3^24^15^15^2^5^.08^.075^.075^
    Shadow Knight: 1^5^24^15^15^2^5^.08^.075^.075^
    Paladin: 50^3^1440^900^900^7^13^4.8^4.5^4.5^
    Shadow Knight: 50^5^1440^900^900^7^13^4.8^4.5^4.5^

    where the 8th value is .08 at level 1 and 4.8 at level 50, meaning as you suggested, knights are getting 8% of their base STA as HP at level 1 and 480% at level 50.
    Trox2010 likes this.
  20. Protagonist Tank

    Now I'm curious what data some of these files represent.