Hey Tankers, So I playing a SK, and I understand a little about the aggro system, keep yours higher than everyone else. What confuses me is that sometimes I see the aggro meter go WAY above 100, say when a merc is on burn. So i was under the impression that Terror line exceeded the 100 Cap, but I almost never go above 100. So i guess I am basically asking how it's supposed to work, is 100 max?
Think of it like this, the agro meter is showing your % of who currently has agro on the mob. If somone goes over 100, they are about to get agro unless the tank does something to go back over them.
If the mob is stunned and some one pulls aggro, the meter will rise way above 100. Once stub fades, it will go back to normal, either to the tank or the guy burning. Pet taunts will also jack around with the meter.
Yeah, if you are tanking, the highest you can get is 100%. When someone else goes over 100%, the mob will turn on them, they will become the new 100%, and you will reduce to whatever percentage of their aggro you have on the mob. If someone has over 100% aggro, and the mob doesn't attack them, then there is something physically stopping the mob from doing so. 9 times out of 10 this has something to do with a pet being highest aggro but unable to tank due to pet aggro rules. Other considerations include stun, root, and tank aggro discs which keep the mob targeted on them no matter what. You can see it lots of times in Plane of War where the mob aggro rules cause you to be unable to take aggro even if you are over 999%.
From what I've seen on the aggro meter: It takes 104% to take aggro from someone. Taunt will get you 100-103% if it succeeds. As mentioned by others, when the mob is stunned, or a pet is on it, the aggro bar can go wonky and show a percentage much higher than 100.
Taunting and turning a mob aren't based on percentages. A successful taunt gives you hate equal to the person at the top of aggro list, plus one. Turning a mob takes four points more than the person holding aggro.
104 on the hate meter gets you aggro. 100 on the hate meter fills the whole bar. Not based on percentages?
The aggro meter is just for your UI. Mobs use actual hate points. Taunt puts you top of aggro, plus one point. To turn a mob requires being four points higher than the current person with aggro. Four points of hate, not four percent.
Well, I'm curious. How was that determined? The four points part, cause I'm pretty sure that 2 tanks, having attack off and no other abilities running will be able to turn the mob between them with just Taunt.
If simply using taunt will turn a mob, with no other aggro, then that would be a change since the old days. It's quite easy to set up tests for this sort of thing. The easiest way to do it is to use low level characters that have little to no double attack and riposte skill, because it's easier to control variables. If you cause a known amount of hate on the mob (say, 8 swings worth), then one can test the same eight swings with a second character. At that point, you want a way to add three points of hate (best way is to use an old weapon with three damage and no damage bonus). Despite having a higher aggro percentage on your UI meter, the mob shouldn't turn. The last time I ran these tests, it took four successful taunts to turn the mob (3 points of hate is a near-negligible amount, and basically any action you can take will cause that - kick or bash could be used if you don't want to wait for a weapon swing).
It seems that many are talking about pets causing the wonky agro numbers, and I think it's incorrectly assumed by some that 'normal' pets are the ones causing it. It is not. The agro/deagro pets are the ones that make the agro meter go completely nuts. Rogue deagro and tank agro pets, particularly. Rogue pets are even banned on our raids, because of the havoc they cause. 'Normal' pets do create a great amount of agro and can out agro tanks (particularly because they do not have spell casting subtlety) but it's quite predictable and easily controlled by the pet's master using 'summon companion' AA frequently to fade the pet. It's the non-normal pets that cause the real craziness in the agro meter.
Pets with taunt on or burning will go higher then 100% (acts like the npc is rooted) Short duration pets at first always taunted like servants . Now they just do insane hate amounts to steal hate from normal pets which is why you see them instead of normal pets and now most mages know to chain summon the normal pet while it is burning. Root will give false high % if someone is closer then you . Unbroken will give false High %'s if you don't taunt after using it or take the top of the list in some other manner. Tanks have always been able to flop aggro back and fourth with nothing but taunt has always been +1 over the person in front of you gives you top of the hatelist. You can test this in say wk 1 raid by hitting normal ae taunt on a wave and stealing hate from every other tank unless they taunt it back or do something else with high hate right away. Also some npc types like say undead have an innate chance to ignore some of the hate list rules. Ie taking more taunts to take hate from another player. Level also has an effect. And intial aggro also has an effect. Even though most thing that mechanic is gone it is not.
I, Brael, and the SK community would disagree with the statement that Top of Hate List +1 will turn a mob. I do know that AE taunt works differently, to where it is effective, but I have never mained a warrior so I don't know the exact mechanics of how much hate it gives (I'm sure it's on TSW). The easiest way to see if the mechanic has changed would be to run a low level tank class to a newbie zone; establish aggro on one character, and then spam taunt on the other (with nothing else turned on) - last time I ran this test, I noticed my taunting character would not take aggro until the fourth successful taunt, despite obviously being higher on the aggro list. Undead, plants, and animals each have their own unique aggro rules. Undead, for example, prefer targets close to them. To my knowledge, no one has really been able to parse out anything meaningful, but it's based on dev posed back up by anecdotal evidence; it'd be difficult to parse since it's (likely) not a constant with hidden variables.
Regular area taunt is a no fail area of effect normal taunt so just +1 on the hate list. Enhanced ae taunt is different. Who was the first to aggro the npc the player taunting or the player being taunted off of because that alone could of made you see what you did. The only way to test either or out is in a raid where one player not one of the two tanks makes sure they are the intial aggro. then one of the tanks take it from them and begin to test the flop taunting out. You can see the same intial aggro thing pop up as any tank with a monk or puller that does not fd on a multipull and you run out of hate abilities and have to resort to taunting one of the npcs to get it off them. And I do agree on that notion before i made a bard in voa it would take me 4 taunts to pull it off most that I was grouping with before the npc would turn in the above situation.
Back, as late as VoA, you're recalling it took top of aggro list +4 to turn a mob, but this is no longer the case? My source, as I stated, for all this is Brael. The essential aggro thread is located at http://www.evilgamer.net/forums/showthread.php?t=140 Some things may have changed since December of 2005, but a lot of it still holds up to my testing. Who has initial aggro doesn't really matter - this needn't be tested on a raid or with even a third party. Two characters. One is top of the aggro list. The other successfully taunts, putting it on top +1. Mob doesn't turn until the fourth successful taunt (note: non-damage primary must be equipped on both characters, no damage shield, bashes, kicks, or the like), or the mechanic has changed. To confirm, run the same test again - now the prior tank is now the one trying to successfully taunt the mob.
I was saying it only happened when the puller did not fd ? So only when intial aggro was in play did it take 4 taunts to turn it off that person. I use ae taunt (the normal version) on west karana #1 all the time just did it last week and took about 15 npcs off others till they took it back with a disc or spell. =) but this is irrelevant to the conversation really . Ageless enimity also takes aggro and it is again just a no fail version of taunt so top of hatelist +1. We use it all the time for raids with tank switch mechanics. Ae taunt even worked to set a reverse ae taunt order on tunat . Ie one warrior went in and built some hate , the last warrior up went in and ae taunted , then the 2nd to last , then the 3rd to last , then the ST , then the MT ae taunted and when he died it would go perfectly in that order ) And in that post 15. Initial aggro is a 32 hate bonus
That's weird about the pulling. Initial aggro is a 32 hate bonus - i.e., the puller gets 32 points of hate. Once you taunt, that bonus doesn't matter anymore. It's easy to control for in the way I stated. In my own aggro tests, using one character to pull, it takes 4 successful taunts to turn the mob. To turn the mob to another PC takes 4 more successful taunts. Ad nauseum. AE taunt has always worked differently in this regard.
Hmm I wonder when that started I have used normal taunt successfully on the tank switches also when ageless and area taunt was down with success at doing the tank switch so I'm not sure how this is happening and I am pretty sure there is no difference between warriors and knights in that regard so /shrug is strange. I still also taunt to move up to second on the hatelist all the time and it seems the other warrior has to either taunt it back or use some kinda hate spell to take it back.
