If 2023 TLP is PvP TLE server

What exactly would a thread where no one bothered to point out what the devs have said in the past look like?

Here's the fact, people repeat what's been said by the devs in an effort to HELP the PvP community. Just because it's not accepted doesn't make it untrue or hateful or even anti-PvP.

We appreciate your input, but whew lawd.

Yes, I already posted above that I don't have a problem with people posting what the devs have previously said. What I do have a problem with is people posting it to EVERY SINGLE pro PvP comment. Saying it once or twice is fine, saying it 50+ times in the same thread is not needed or helpful.

It just fills the thread with spam that others now have to sift through to try and find what other people think or bring up.

And maybe others feel the same way about dozens of threads and posts about PvP and how the next server is sure to be PvP

Based on the description, it was an event hosted on a PVP server not really promoting inner-server PVP but more of a game to collect items for someone to PVP with. It's a novel idea and probably was enjoyable, but in no way does this promote the popularity of EQ PVP, most notably the creation of an EQ PVP TLP server.

And I'll say this again: This attempt was made by a person with ZERO incentive to promote a PVP TLP. If you, the community, want to prove that this game has a demand for a TLP PVP then the TLP players need to PROVE IT through action, not sitting around crying about it 2 weeks a year and packing it up for next year.

If you don't want to put the effort in to prove you want to PVP in a game that you love then this conversation is done. You clearly don't want a PVP TLP server if you simply cannot be bothered to put in an effort. This is a business that makes millions of dollars each year. They aren't going to just dump tens of thousands of dollars in assets for a market that has clearly shown they don't give a s... enough beyond troll the boards.

I highlighted the most critical part. The thing that differentiates these games with EQ is they were developed from the foundation to accomodate a TLP environment. EQ PVP was an after thought and absolutely needs tons of work. It's mega trash. You, and everyone, providing games that were literally built with PVP in mind provide nothing. That's like telling me that a BMW M4 is a good family car because the same company produces the X7. They are both BMWs but one is built by the motorsport division and builds around performance.

Go ahead, you do that. That'll really help promote your EQ PVP TLP.

The rest of your post is just rambling nonsense that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

TLDR: If you cannot be bothered with putting in an effort and coordinating with your PVP buddies to prove there is ACTUAL INTEREST then don't come onto the boards crying about there being no TLP server. They aren't going to cater to a dozen people who claim to care but have taken no action. You're nothing but a keyboard warrior pretending to care.

Absolutely, this is not a situation of "if you build it they will come".

PVPers need to exhibit that there are the numbers of PVPers who either are current subscribers or who would subscribe to play on a new PVP server, TLP or otherwise. The previous PVP server populations dwindled until the were merged down to a single server with a low population. Looking at it from a business perspective, that makes PVP a very poor idea for investment.

I am neither for or against PVP. I don't prefer it for my own gaming but I do know there are those who enjoy it and I think fun is important, too. However, Daybreak is obligated to make good business decisions based on available evidence. A continuing very low population on the one PVP server currently available is evidence it would be a bad decision to make another.

“Never argue with a man whose job depends on not being convinced.” and “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!”

That being said…For the lie being spread about the devs telling players to show up to the 2020 Zek event… That is disinformation. Stop it. The devs did not organize, nor promote that event. It was purely player driven.

A discord server was created that had brought together several different EQ PvP player bases. Players invested their personal time and money on promoting this event. I know this because I was part of the “staff” that attempted this event. I was there from the beginning. It caught the attention of some YouTubers and mmo websites but it was doomed from the start without official DPG buy-in. But it was done on such short notice and not marketed correctly. But I’d wager that it did give EverQuest some renewed attention. I’d be interested to see if subscriptions went up between the period of January 2020-June 2020 and then compare it to the same months in 2019, 2021, 2022 when there was no significant call for PvP. Maybe something to look into for you devs that reading this hijacked by anti PvP thread.

That being said, I have not seen any other EverQuest fan base make as much noise outside these forums. Yet we have live expansions and FV TLPs. They are paying to keep the lights on, why not add some more revenue with a PvP TLP. Zek is not a TLP.

You mean this? In the official EQ Forums #Ask A Dev Channel?

Dreamweaver — 04/08/2020 5:51 PM
Question 14 - Alan, are you and/or DarkPaw Games now convinced that people do want to play PVP TLP as opposed to PVP Live? Are you aware there is a PVP trilogy fanbase playing on private servers? You mentioned before that new TLP types are possible. I believe that the PVP TLP appeal has been underestimated. Can we talk about this further?

AbsorEQ — 04/08/2020 5:51 PM
I hate to say it, but I am more convinced now that not enough people want it to justify setting up such a server. The high population on the day that everyone was supposed to show up on Rallos was, frankly, very low. Certainly not enough to support a server. This would be my answer to most of your other questions about PVP things.

Aristo — 04/08/2020 5:52 PM
There's definite passion out there. We just haven't ever seen the numbers.

While maybe they did not set it up, they certainly looked at the outcome...

I also bet subs went up between jan-jun of 2020. Id even say more specifically in march or april. March 20th was the day I stopped going in to work for about 15 months anyway. I had lots more time to fire up a few more boxes.

Where's the ask a dev channel?

Also, just because they "looked" doesn't mean they promoted or supported the organization

Below all the live server channels

They said "show us you want pvp", the players who want it did what they could and the devs took note of the outcome. Why would they promote and organize an event when they already "know" it won't be worth their effort.

This is a business, they exist to make money, they are not going to waste effort on something they don't think will be a financial success. Are they always right? No. But are they going to intentionally do something they feel will lose them money just on the off chance they may be wrong? Also no.

Posting the AMA over and over again is the biggest self own ever. This is what was said about a FREE TRADE SERVER.

35. Hey Holly, Question 1 - Will there ever be a PvP TLP ?

Question 2 - Will there ever be a FV ruleset TLP server added?

Question 3 - is Daybreak going to continue their Mobile Everquest for tablet/Ipad and if so can you access regular servers with this new game type on ur iPad or what not?

Alan: Eyes… growing… tired… I started at the end and this must be question 4,343! And to top it all off, you had to ask three in one! Yes, I'm trying to make you feel bad. 1. Probably not. Very few people play on our PVP server as it is. 2. FV rules are a curse. You don't want that on your server. 3. We have a mobile EverQuest?

These comments are after. Devs specifically told us showing up wouldn't do anything, they haven't said anything since.The Devs discouraged people from showing up and it's still was larger then the push for a non-truebox TLP.

LMAO dude doesn't even know the name of the server. It's so funny how often the dev team just believes the opposite of the truth.

Restrict boxing? Nah that won't work
Instanced Raids? Nah that's not EQ
Free Trade TLP? Nah that will never work
Later era start TLP? Miragul is gonna be the best server ever
Ladder Server? Quarm
Fast server TLP? Selo, that will be for casuals
"Challenge" Server? Vaniki
Slower XP better? Coirnav
Limited two boxing? Nah what we need is to let everyone box all they want.

There are other places to reach out to to the eq community than the official forums. Other eq servers, discord, 3rd party tool forums, private server and P99 forums and discords, mmo forums and discords, and more.

The current pvp server should be the groundswell for this movement but the support just doesn't exist.

Oh you wonder if Eq subs went up in 2020? I'm sure there was no other reason besides a PVP event. Definitely not a global pandemic putting everyone in house arrest for a year. No way.

Talk about disinformation. Your post is one of the disingenuous posts possible by not acknowledging COVID in 2020 and an influx in all gaming subs, let alone the booms in video conferencing companies, cloud companies, etc.

Just out of curiosity which TLP is the FV ruleset TLP? Looking through the list I see one pair (Mischief and Thornblade) that has a small subset of the FV special ruleset, but is definitely not FV rules. So the AMA isn't really a self own since there is very few (like less than EQ PvPers few) people that actually want a true FV ruleset TLP. I suppose if you want to stretch it so that Free Trade = FV ruleset, then we can just say every TLP is a PvP server since the PvP Arenas and Priest of Discord is active on all of them.

Free Trade presents some serious CS problems on a TLP all by itself so they added the random loot code to fix that. That's totally understandable.

The problem with PvP is that there is no customer base for it. The events don't show a base, the people calling for it seem to be terminally allergic to doing the one thing that the devs said would prove their case.

i guess there are different opinions out there… anyway, I like most others had no idea about the event until much later. I am not on these boards every day, ‘cept maybe leading up to a serverrules release as I am as curious as the next guy.

There is no FV TLP. There is a randomized loot server that has free trade. There will most likely not be a FV TLP because it breeds toxicity quicker than rabbits.

It didn't. Aradunes ruleset is terribly enforced lol. I mean, I don't really care too much, but to say the ruleset itself was a success is disingenuous. You can log in and within 2 minutes find someone boxing more than 2.

EQ has been out since 99 and had instanced raids since 2002. When did anyone say this? You're quoting 2 decade old things? What other straw gasping are you going to do? LET'S SEE!

Now you're slightly modifying your argument. Disingenuous again. But again, Mischief isn't just FT. It's Randomized loot and that's what truly makes FT possible. The devs took a massive chance with something never done before, unlike a PVP server, and it worked out for them.

Still not comparable because no precedence. Based on everything I know, HoT is a popular expansion. True box aka restricted boxing is what did that server in. So yet again, one of things you love is what ruined a potential fun server. Just like what PVP would be. Nice.

Huh? Please find any source where this was argued against. I'll wait.

Still a successful server though, regardless if they were wrong on the type of people who they thought would join.

It's level-locked with very niche other rulesets probably to incentivize more Live server players to try TLPs considering they are a majority of the population and need something to do outside 1 expansion per year. Unfortunately they didn't listen to the threads about Level Locked or Era locked servers because those probably would be better in hindsight.

There still are various posts with people wanting slower XP rates. What's your point?

And the mega failed Aradune ruleset. Aradune was widely popular because the cheaters held an extra advantage over the people who followed the rules, coupled with COVID19, and it was a breeding ground for toxicity until POP. There are still plenty of people boxing more than 2. It takes about 60 seconds to find it. This is the most self-own of self-owns even mentioning it. And last I checked Rizlona pulls higher populations now and have for the last 1.5 years.

The interest in PVP is not there: