I don't play in PvP... so i'm not familiar with what you may or may not be doing. But those ghost mobs in Hills of shade caves could be seen by putting an aug with see-invis into a slot on an item with see-invis (Faerune). If that doesn't work for SoS2, then try adding in a spell with see-invis ability. There used to be an old aug from LDoN era (I think) that had see-invis or Faerune that I used to use.
Thanks for the suggestion Nightops, I will look into this. It's invalid to argue that because rogues were not unkillable before, that they deserve to be so now. Rogues were already very strong, evidenced well by the fact that your guild has made so many of them. This is precisely the reason we had to employ many of the classes that could be used to counter rogues. Using these classes allowed us to at least stay competitive, but did NOT give us any huge advantage as you try to suggest. With effort and the right combination of classes, rogues' targets could be acquired previously, but you needed to be on top of your game, because it was still easy for one to slip through unnoticed and snag a kill. If your group lacked a class that could see SOS1, or had not farmed the eyepatch or it was on cooldown, you were at a huge disadvantage if a rogue showed up. On the whole SOS1 still offered a tactical advantage to Rogues. The arguments you're using to try to say that Rogues NEED to be in the untargettable state that SOS2 puts them apply to all classes, not just rogues. Any other class that zones in, their targets can be pulled as well. As far as being uselss once snared, this effects most classes just as much if not more than Rogues, snare a mage's pet, they are done, not to mention the OOR bard dispell brigade that strips their buffs before even being finished zoning in. You're just throwing out any argument you can to attempt to justify the brokenly OP state rogues are in at the moment. It's not that rogues won't stand a chance if they adjust SOS2 to be back where it should be, it's just that you will not be the gods of PVP this patch has made you.
Well, As usual in these forums the subject of this post has been taken way off track. This post was not designed for rogues to make their case for keeping SoS2. I have a rogue and I want to keep SoS2. This post was made to help identify how people are pulling rouge targets. The number of people from one specific guild (Tweak and Shadowedd are members) who can pull rogue targets has risen by two. So, there are now at least four players on Zek who pull rogue targets with impunity. How are they doing it? I can not figure it out. I am able to use one ranger spell, an physical damage AoE to knock a rouge out of SoS2, however, i have to get lucky to do it. I have to cast at nothingness and hope I hit. If one guild has it figured out it just means I am behind the curve and need to learn how. I will continue my work until I catch up with them.
Please provide a way for at least some classes to see SoS2. I don't understand how allowing a player that can instantly kill another player is balanced. There has to be a way to either create a short term vision spell to see SoS2, Make SoS2 have a long recast time, I understand some rogues are putting up the argument that it is too easy for them to die in pvp if they don't have the element of surprise. But understand there are many on zek that are using this new ability to grief groups over and over again and those groups have no chance to defend, they either have to run. or ignore until the rogue finds them and kills them. This is new mechanic is allowing a very select few to ruin an entire server.
The fact that you admit rogues targets can still be acquired (even though you are sad you don't know how) and then throw out a statement that rogues cant be targeted or that we are somehow arguing they should be unkillable makes zero sense to me. Rogues are not unkillable as all 3 times I was confronted with one today they either died or gated...you were there...you should know. You made the statement that "With effort and the right combination of classes, rogues' targets could be acquired previously, but you needed to be on top of your game" This comment also makes no sense to me as this is STILL the way the game is working if you know what you are doing and or prepare for them correctly. The way your rogues target has been pulled is the same way your guild members are pulling and holding rogue targets. Its not a hack and if they aren't sharing it with you then I don't know what to say. Wandid also said "The arguments you're using to try to say that Rogues NEED to be in the untargettable state that SOS2 puts them apply to all classes, not just rogues." This is just not true. Rogues have Zero range abilities besides throwing daggers which don't hurt anybody. They aren't casting nukes...they aren't stunning from a distance...they aren't battle leaping away or onto people while in combat..they aren't deflecting/reflecting ranged spells/attacks (unless you count the only spell block that blocks 2 spells and is worthless)..they aren't using healing spells they aren't sending pets that can do actual damage while they stay out of range.. You show me ANY other class that has ZERO ranged abilities both defensive and offensive that matter in pvp. This is the entire reason SoS is so important for rogues. But you keep talking about how rogues are unkillable and cant be targeted and they need to be fixed when its simply not true.
What happens to a SoS2 rogue if somebody casts AE or has an AE spell ready all the time on himself while protecting himself from caster damage. Does the rogue loose SoS2 and can get ultrafast nukes for some burns for his bottom? One single Burn-Shot should kill him instantly. How about making a boxed rogue or a guildy rogue (mh..critical), bring him into SoS2 and testing every spell and everything on him (or do it on beta or test to avoid playing him up to 105)?
Tweak - You're misquoting and attributing so many statements to the wrong people. Are you trying to confuse everyone into thinking that SOS2 is OK a is? Plain and simple, previously SOS1 gave Rogues at tactical advantage in getting the drop on enemies. Rogue Targets could only be acquired with constant effort and the right combination of classes. Now, with SOS2, Rogues RUN the battlefield. The only ways to acquire rogue targets are by hacking or by spamming AE spells constantly and hoping to get lucky and have one land on the rogue, which would require him to be so close to you that he was probably about to pounce on you anyway. Some are using this distinct advantage to constantly grief other groups who have no defense but to leave until the Rogue decides to stop harrassing them. Bottom line is that Rogue SOS2 in its current state is grossly overpowered and completely breaks PVP in favor of Rogues. We ask that the Devs review this and take appropriate actions.
Mages, Wizards, Rangers, Druids and Shamans see SoS1. Mages and Wizards must have their eye out in order to see anything and while the eye is out they do not have control of their characters. I have one of these classes in my group 20% of the time. I am hard pressed at naming an active druid or wizard that plays currently. I died 6 times last night all because there is no way to counter or balance sos2. Rogues have 2 stuns, 1 snare, a blind, a run speed buff, and 100k hit back stabs. They were OP before the expac and they are seriously op now. Obviously when the Wudan rogues get leveled up and your groups can't get anything done you will be asking for balance. Please fix
This is crap. The supporters of wanting to keep SoS2 are.... Tweak aka a ROUGE on zek and Shadowed another ROUGE on zek.. If you read Zek gen chat, these are the server trolls who enjoy griefing. Check the progression logs of these players. they have done NO progression. They log on to grief and talk . not to play the game. A rog can now AFK in a zone and block an entire army. This isnt realistic, AND ALSO ISNT FUN One person should not be able to stop an army of 100 toons. But its broken and they now can. ZEK CANNOT USE THE CURRENT XPAC DUE TO BROKEN ROUGES A ROUGE CAN NOW AFK IN A ZONE AND STOP ANYONE FROM ENTERING (and they have done this, drop a afk rog in every new xpac zone) [being a loner is now a reward and having friends is a penalty] YOU CANNOT SEE A ROUGE CANNOT TRACK A ROUGE CANNOT TARGET A ROUGE BUUT A ROUGE CAN AUTO ATTACK AND KILL YOU Waiting for a GM response still Roshen, Jchan, anyone out here??
Does anyone have confirmation that the Devs are even aware of this issue? Tweak says: I say BS. Are you trying to say that there are others besides your guildies that can target SoS2 without utilizing some form of AoE? Because it sure sounds to me like you are and that is crap.
Without a doubt, SoS2 is overpowered. Yes most classes can round people, but there are several ways to either mitigate the damage or make yourself invulnerable for a short period of time if you can see someone coming. Paired with one of the best one-rounder classes, SoS2 almost guarantees you'll lose to a rogue. The counter to Rogues previously was casting a spell buff on yourself which would allow you to temporarily see through SoS (with the exception of the shaman aa buff that gave the perma sight.....also overpowered imo). Even with this counter, rogues still excelled especially in small zones, where they could get to people while they still casted their see invis buffs. Now there is really nothing you can do but take the death or gate immediately when a rogue enters zone. It's going to depopulate the server more than it already is. Zek is the only option of pvp in EQ, if SoS2 remains as unbalanced as it is, more people are just going to leave, and we don't have enough players to able to afford that.
It is only overpowered because the counter actions to this action were not upgraded. Navin had some awesome ideas on how to balance the current situation. I personally would like to see Skylight Sagacity get upgraded to see SoS2; however, I play a ranger. I really don't care how the fix it, it just needs fixed. And by fixed I mean balanced. Every strike needs a counterstrike, every punch needs a counter punch.
Im sayin they are using AoE damage or traps to pull targets...just like we are. You are the only one who keeps talking about hacks and people pulling targets without some kind of strategy. The facts are you just aren't playing correctly or being prepared enough for when rogues come for you. Also when you have a see SoS spell that last for several minutes and can constantly be kept up along with a snare that constantly refreshes...you explain to me what the counter punch is for a rogue vs that...pfft. As for Zekster..you're just trolling and don't know what your talking about. I am a progression fanatic and have more progression than almost anyone I know..but way to go thinking you know how I play.
Lets give some background on tweak. Hes a minority who is enjoying his new found ability of being able to stop an entire guild by himself. And doesnt want his new found monopoly to end The thing is...Wudan will fold and zek will end if this isnt fixed. NOT movelog. forget giving extra money. we will quit and end the free money flow. A rog cant do anything if everyone quits.
