Ragefire Rotation Discussion

It was an open-ended invitation for the rotation discussion that you didn't show up for. If those 30 guilds have leaders as hard to reach as you are, I wish you the best of luck. What guild was that again that you are a leader of?

You can't even troll well. This has already been addressed. TL did not approach any guild. Those guilds showed up to an open invitation.

False Prophecy announced their intention to "Destroy TL" from before the server even launched. RoP and CAF are far from friendly with TL aswell. The fact remains, there was an open invitation, those guilds made an effort, and a rotation has been hashed out. There was ample time to get in on the discussion, and you've even been invited to join in on the discussion by multiple people.

I don't see what your end game is here?

First of all. CAF was keyed to bee island prior to the buffs. Just never found them up. So that's significantly more than most guilds.

Also, who cares who "boxes" do I care that you want to raid 1 day a week. Our that you want to tank with a shadow knight.

I don't judge your play style... No need to judge mine.

not worth it. Slang is bad mmkay.

Clearly, which is why 8/10 guilds voted to change it drastically.

Really...so Gynx's mods to the current rotation to add CT, etc, to the gatekeeper mobs was "approved" by DB, eh?

I'm confused, are people mad that they can't get onto the rotation because there aren't enough gatekeepers or mad that they apparently tried to make you happy and added more gatekeepers?

Actually, you're wrong. Per Breeze, you have to have killed Eye of Veeshan (pre-revamp).

Of which you and your 5 other guilds haven't done either Granted, it's a silly thing for Breeze to even have used that as a baseline...but hey, if Apok/RoE had included RoP, your guild, the other guilds who voted on the new rotation, and a bunch of other guilds, I'm willing to bet that the Apok/RoE rotation wouldn't have gotten a majority

Please drive through.

They did ask you - Skyp's post on this very forum was public and invited everyone to the discussions.

How can it be everyone else's fault if you were too busy to attend?

As an FYI - if you read my posts - especially on the first rotation that Apok/RoE posted, you'll see a lot of my calling into question TL (but Apok and RoE are far worse). But I guess you think I've been brainwashed.

Yup - he and Breeze shared a night together, took Rosengard's "still deciding to vote" and TL's "no" vote, went to DB, said We're 2 yes, 1 no, 1 no vote, majority wins.

And that's how the initial rotation got started.

It's ok though - it won't be that way for long.

If we were to get on your level, we'd all be stepping down and becoming homophobic pieces of crap in Apok...

And I don't think any of us want to do that.

As someone pointed out in the stickied Rotation thread, some of us are new members only because you could not complete a forum account until recently (his post is why I even tried again). I kept getting an error when doing the captcha that said please enable cookies and try again when trying to select a forum name but no matter what I did (Cookies enabled, tried in all browsers including IE lol, and on a different machine) it still didn't work.

It's fine to be skeptical of new accounts, especially ones that do not identify who they are (Seems to be a lot on both sides attempting to be anonymous) just saying a lot of us are only new because we were barred from posting until very recently.

lol. For reference:

and

- Skyp.

and lastly,

It looks to me as if my guild leader, Skyp, tried on several occasions to be all inclusive. If you missed the boat both he and Jain are still willing to accommodate you and be sure this IS in fact every guild that desires a voice. I'm willing to bet tho no one will ever hear from you as a rep for your guild or that you will manage to scrounge up "8 other guilds" that are not just full of apok/RoE trolls attempting to sway a vote. Even if for arguments sake I say TLG is a complete farse and just some TL smokescreen.. thats 1 of the additional 7 votes. Nice attempt but just like your attempts at FFA mobs, and then strong arming the server, this troll and undermine attempt falls shamefully short.

No one's mad about the gatekeepers...or can't get on the rotation. Getting on the rotation isn't in question here.

The thing folks are upset about is how Apok/RoE basically got DB to "approve" their rotation suggestion by a 2-1-1 vote of the "top" (note, the quotes - because, well, RoE/RoI were considered one of the "top" guilds at the time) guilds and DB went with it.

Now, Apok and RoE can't kill FFA stuff (as obvious to CT spawning primetime last night and neither bothered trying for CT - TL got him with 60ish or so...yet, Breeze comments on how they have 250+ L50 toons). The problem that Apok and RoE have are that they are afraid of losing more mobs.

What they fail to admit is that neither of them can field a very good raid force for a good portion of the day...and they don't want stuff to go straight to FFA...they'd rather try and shuffle people around and try and field a raid at 10AM no a Thursday morning, fail, and THEN about FFA. Whereas the proposed changes to the rotation offer up the more casual guilds consistent raiding times during primetime hours (with no guarantees to spawns) in exchange for more flat-out FFA.

Now, Apok and RoE are both not liking that because they both know they can't beat TL in an FFA race (and will lose mobs during "their" rotation to TL anyways) as neither of them are truly 24x7. They would both be better off just merging together and possibly having more available 24x7 and then it's a moot point.

Also, people are upset at the changes being made to the current rotation (the Apok/RoE one) without all 4 guilds agreeing (like the changes to the gatekeepers list that Gynx made on his own). Funny how he can arbitrarily change that rule, but yet, the rule to implement a guild being kicked off the rotation after failing a boss twice in a row is still "proposed" - why? you may ask? Because RoE and Apok both know that they won't have trading partners to put off the inevitable. RoE already failed CT once (and didn't even try on an FFA slot during primetime with their 250+). If thye failed again, they would be called to be removed. If they traded their slot to Apok (because TL and Rosen certainly won't take em), that means if CT were to spawn at 10am on a weekday, Apok would be on the hook. If they failed/missed the spawn, they would then have 1 strike against them and also no longer have a trading partner.

As such, you'll see Apok and RoE missing spawns, and Rosen trading spawn windows during North American hours to TL. TL will still get a majority of the spawns, no matter what Apok and RoE do (unless they joined together and somehow found enough to be on during the off-hours...and then, they would have to spread the loot even thinner).

Thus, why you see Apok and RoE so fiercely defending "their" rotation. Because they know, with the way its worded, they have some loopholes. However, those loopholes have been exposed, changes to the rotation having been discussed (also note, RoE (or Apok - I forget) used a lame excuse of "we're currently raiding in our slot" and didn't bother sending reps to the meeting of leaders - think for yourself - 1 person doesn't make a raid. If RoE really has 250+ like Breeze claimed, sending *1* officer to have their voice heard wouldn't be an issue. Same for Apok), and leadership has voted.

The other person here claiming to "get 5 other guilds" - what they don't realize - they, and those 5 other guilds would have to kill the gatekeeper to get on the rotation before they had any voice. And even if all 5 of them did, and they all voted to keep the current rotation...or whatever. All that will happen is TL will get more bosses - again, because no other guilds can reliably field a raid 24x7 like TL can, as such, they will miss multiple spawns, TL will FFA them in almost every case, and that will be that. But they're too blind to realize that and in their fit of "f TL rage" will just see they will be losing out anyways.

This was a beautiful post.

Yeah it surely was up until "they, and those 5 other guilds would have to kill the gatekeeper to get on the rotation before they had any voice." As I stated in different post there is no ruling for that. There should be for sure. When Skyp opened up the discussion to all guilds (not necessarily raid capable, but all guilds) kinda debunks that statement.

I really fail to see the problem here. Just force Apok/RoE to work with the new rotation or lose their position in it, and get zero.

Why though? The Summit took place, with 9 guilds present, and atleast two more guilds were reached out too. Half of the guilds that took part in The Summit are not even on the current rotation, they just set forth a ruleset for the rotation, because everyone should have their voice heard. They'll be working towards getting on the rotation in the future. The Summit had an open invitation to any guild that wanted to participate, to participate. It is not Skyp's, nor Jain's, nor anyone's job to seek out random guilds and ask them to join.

You now have to kill the Gatekeeper to get on rotation. Skyp, aswell as others, have already said Daydream, and any other guild, can still reach out and try to work something out. That seems pretty damn fair to me.

Sorry Detheb you may have misunderstood. To get onto the rotation YES they need to kill gatekeeper. Point taken np understood.

To have a voice I don't need to kill other than to say I want a voice. There is no ruling on that. This is my point which there absolutely should be a ruling that states if not on the rotation you can voice your opinion but your vote is 1/2 or 0 comparatively to those on the rotation. If I wanted to put my opinion in and say I get to vote on it also there is no ruling to stop me.

All hypothetically speaking because I seriously wouldn't do that lol