Precision DPS

i use rifle for aoe and single target. all builds are precision based. I make my powerset work for my weapon choice. by the tone of your post im guessing you are referring to "elite, end game players " and / or scoreboard chasing losers.

1. He only broke 40 when he's had a stupid high crit chance which you know is a clear outlier. In the actual video itself he goes back and says what average parses look like and excluding the 38.6 at 30% he started off with, he's at 35-37. Not to mention that this is a gadgets specific issue. To say "he's getting 35-43k parses with bow on 3 targets" is inaccurate, "he's getting 35-37k parses with gadgets and bow on 3 targets" is more accurate.

2. Expanding on the gadgets bit, I just hopped on a toon with 160 vwd, ai, cog and took off the shoulders face and ring to reach 19.2k base precision and I parsed off at:
(with phase dodge)
28.7 - 18.8%
32.5 - 33.3%
27.2 - 9.4%
31.0 - 37.9%
27.1 - 21.9%
33.45 - 31%
31.9 - 22.9%
30.3 - 22.6%
34.8 - 33.3%
28.7 - 21.9%
33.88 - 22.9%
26.7 - 15.6%
31.87 - 21.2%
31.26 - 28.1%
26.4 - 11.4%

As you can see, I'm extremely far away from 35-37 with just the robot sidekick and the weapon buff. When you look at the fact that my crits are biased from sidekick hits and my weapon crits are higher than what they're shown as, my 32.5, 31, 33.45, and 34.8 get thrown out as they're 5+% over what my standard crit chance should be, my average shoots down even further. That video is evidence toward the inbalance in dps that gadgets has through stealth and bot clipping above other powersets, not evidence of the weapon mastery itself being overpowered.

3. Single target he got 21, 23.5, 19.3, 23, and a 24.4 when he's looking at 30%+ crit chance taking into account the pet. Even taking the 24.4 into account that's a 22.24 average parse which we matched as nature on the might end. Did the same thing as before with 19.3k prec (dw higher than bow weapon for this toon) and I'm at 17.5-21.5k for my damage window at 16-25% crit chance. If I didn't have phase dodge, you can shave off at least 1k average from both smoke and flurry. And the part that irritates me more is that people act as if there's more than 2-3 other powers that can even match these numbers on a precision spec. Water and Ice would be competitive, Quantum and Mental should theoretically be close as well, but not as close, but that's 5 powers out of 15 that have the potential to excel. Meanwhile might based has Nature, Rage, Earth, Light, and Elec if there are enough adds that can match. Even if you take off take off Light with pure chainsaw that's 4 powers vs. 5 powers which is still fairly close. Not to mention that even doing smokebomb, precision users often lose on add damage because of the interrupts, the add movement, and the cone/range of smokebomb. People have been lying about the numbers and it's proven by the fact that any competitive dps has always used the phrase "have to use smoke bomb to hope/try to keep up". Not to win, not to tie, to just not get blown out. OG Mentor comp'ing Memz was a testament that Might based gadgets beats Prec based gadgets on adds. Gadgets is the outlier powerset that can do well with smokebomb and even it loses to Might based.

4. To answer your question, Ground Pound Mastery and Enhanced Shuriken Mastery are the next highest parsing for 3 targets and single target respectively for ranged damage.

5. Precision has never extremely parsed over Might based when they're alone. And that's been my main argument from the start.
- Get rid of the Cog group passive and have it for the individual only.
- Get rid of the controller power dump precision increase.
- Get rid of the Parasite precision increase or add might to it.
- Change Venom Wrist Dispenser to 12s duration at half the buff strength so more weapon combos have the chance to properly utilize it.

6. I understand your position of wanting to nerf things that are out of line, but the fact of the matter is that there's no upside to it. Dual Wield and Bow perform well because of the coded damage rules . Smokebomb is short and does well and I personally thing it shouldn't be stronger than something like Spinning Punch Mastery, but ignoring that anomaly, Dual Wield actually has a strong case for remaining where it is because it a pure single target weapon. In my testing, I believe there is only one other weapon mastery combo if memory serves me right where the weapon combo/tap and its weapon mastery are both single target. If weapon combos or weapon mastery combos are aoe, they should follow aoe damage standards. Aoe weapon mastery combos should not be competing with a pure single target weapon mastery on single target. If you want cones changed for more single target focused weapon masteries, that's one argument, but you do not punish a weapon for doing well at what it was designed for. You look at the powersets that are the closest to competing with a PURE single target wm combo and you have Celestial and HL, both known for single target dps, Gadgets with tazer pull and stealth heavy damage single target, Nature with Gorilla taps and iconic single target moves. The closer a powerset moves to being pure single target with a might spec, the more it ties with or beats flurry. It is not Flurry's fault that not every powerset has strong single target moves. That's been the case and an imbalance since the game came out. Flurry is a civilian bystander caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, but it's not guilty of any crime. Smokebomb seems to have evaded some taxes (damage penalties) because I cannot seem to find a reason why it performs better than Ground Pound with the same input and timings seemingly unless Ground Pound itself was actually overtaxed and was supposed to be equal. Regardless of how we got into this situation, to go back to the no upside existing, while the two weapon masteries I listed are the closest to Smoke and Flurry, it's a big enough difference to where you can't keep up against might based period and it'll still be just 2 weapon mastery combos being used. The issue is that once people see that even the strongest 2 weapons fail horribly in dps, you've officially killed precision dps if nothing else is changed. It's like dual pistols in pvp and pve, it becomes the lost and barely seen other than as a troll weapon to pick. And at that point, you have caused a failure of that entire portion of dps balance and have pushed us back into AM era because hybrid and weapon mastery will both be dead. It's better to have 2 weapons as a guide to where damage should be around than to nerf those 2 weapons, 1 falsely, hoping that the devs go back and buff everything else when we both know they don't have the time to and most likely won't.

Sorc and Earth with crystal/fury is actually roughly the same dps as any other powerset with a robot sidekick. Water with riptide doesn't work on bow smokebomb. You parse more consistently and slightly higher with just the weapon buff alone with like every other powerset. So all you actually have is ice with 2 snow devils. And the nature pftt doesn't rely on the wolf supercharge transformation to maintain parses. That implies constantly using supercharge like what the person faking parses was doing. I'm at 39k might and my wolf melee stays at 45-48k dps, god forbid I go into gorilla form and use impaling thorns to break 50k. I had an ice dps with 22k precision use double snow devil and they were only 40-42k on 3 targets. You also were parsing 40k-43k with electricity as 250 with 34k might. You're at 40k with Rage at 39k might but you're double nerfing yourself on your parses for the sake of supercharge regeneration. You have the supercharge generator in your loadout instead of the full aoe dot and you're using lacerate instead of dreadful blast. You're comparing a supercharge regenerating loadout to a full dps loadout from gadgets. If you wanted to compare them go into content and see if your rage parsing at 40k is equal to his 19k prec gadgets parsing at 40k and post the scorecard.

I'm surprised I haven't seen it mentioned but prec/mastery DPS should still be at least slightly hybrid in that it should be clipping a power onto the final attack in the combo every time. Tray should basically be buff + stat application (as required. ie burning/shock/etc) + DoT + pet + the best instacast/short cd power you can clip onto your combo every time + SC.

It is. It's common sense and doesn't need to be said. Unless there's some specific point you're getting at lol. I wish more people knew these basic things is all im saying.

The term hybrid is simply a mix of white and yellow numbers with the goal of trying in some way to maximize the synergy between both.

A focus on mostly yellow is super powered/might based whatever you wanna call it.

A focus on mainly weapon attacks with little clipping of tray (might) powers would be precision/weapon based or whatever you want to call it.

But in reality we just mix them because we know a little bit of both (hybrid) is best. You get the best of both worlds.

You can get deeper obviously and realize you can mix different ratios of precision and might.

Maybe but the whole prec tray is "common sense" and was brought up with a end-clip omitted so imo bears mentioning.

That is not true at all. Shows how little you know. None of my prec loadouts are like that. In fact most of my loadouts change a little basedthe power. To say that 99% of all loadouts are like that especially since you have a cult following is very bad and is how people are drawn to basic loadouts.

Sorry but that is BS and deep down you know it. You want prec nerfed to the ground cause you aren’t a prec dps. You make videos for your cult following. I dps as prec and might and test for both types of dps to be able to help anyone play how they want. The only change dw needs is to stop it from being being able to jump clip into itself. And bow smokebomb only needs a slight nerf while every other weapon needs some form of buffs. Precision dps does require more skill than pftt. That’s due to blocking and the radius of the attacks. I didn’t here you saying to nerf rage or nature. You want things to be nerfed that don’t go along with what you like. This game isn’t about what you like. People who pay should have the option to play prec or dps. That’s why I test things. I actually test things and can even show people how to test weapons and abilities. Can you? Cause I know you get loadouts from your league test things around those loadouts instead of actually testing powers.

Care to share what LOs you use?

For which power?

Any or all. Maybe just your top favorites to use?

Glad you found this post after nearly a month. You are 100% biased towards Prec just as I am biased towards Might. Its funny how you asked where I said nerf rage when I was the very player who got Berserk and Circuit Breaker adjusted LOL Nature relies heavily on supercharge transformations, if you are continually wiping in content you aren't going to be able to switch to gorilla for single target for example and see your damage potential plummet, just like when the Titans elite raids came out you didn't see wolves everywhere in elite cause for one the rotation wasn't even widely used yet and there was enough deaths that you couldn't constantly keep supercharge active, now you can with Gemini but that isn't a nature issue that is a gemini issue. Also funny enough how you mention I get my loadouts from my league were out of the 13 powers i've done guides so far for only 2 of them have been influenced by others.

I'm not going to get into an argument again about bow and dw until I have my own results to show but what your precision bias can't see through, which I think is truly sad, is the underlying issue of power. What does every single might PFTT dps rotation that is on par with precision have in common? they all take massive power and cannot be maintained without constant 6% gemini power back spam and a controller who at least semi knows what they are doing. If that earth or rage or mental or atomic or gadgets doesn't have the power sufficient to maintain his dps what happens then? Oh yea it drops off drastically but does precision have the same drawback? nope. You can see a plethora of examples highlighted by the endgame league Plats. They don't even bother taking a controller for their unique elite runs because its not even necessary for them because they are precision based. You try to stick a gadgets or celestial single target dps in a USE all bosses out run with no controller GG DeitySupreme. That's what none of you precision dps choose to mention when you talk about balance. I cant even do 30 second parses with 90% of the PFTT might rotations and that's with max gear, skill points and 4 max power generator mods.

Currently Precision single target dps has absolutely zero drawback, you have
1) max range damage
2) limited power required to push 24k + parses which the majority of pftt cannot even reach.
3) the ability to run a shield on the rotation
4) have numerous in-raid buffs available to buff personal precision (controller recharge buff, venom wrist, cog, sparring ai, demon fang, parasite power harness) what is there to buff PFTT dps at all? the tetra lol and that's not even a personal buff thats to the group like the cog.
5) non-splitting damage as the result of s/t, most PFTT powers don't even have purely single target high damage moves in their rotations besides gadgets/mental at midrange, fire, light, quantum so pftt has to resort to using Heat Vision to compensate where if you are doing say a Machine elite beastboy or crown/throne regular or any fight where npcs are surrounding the boss the objective becomes much longer because of all the splitting damage where precision dps can keep constant damage on the intended target decreasing the chances of something happening to a player or causing a wipe. Perfect example being the Beast Boy phase in machine elite you have adds everywhere that keep spawning and massive splitting damage where a raid with precision dps can keep on hive master and end the fight with little stress where a similar PFTT group would have to survive more than twice as long to accomplish the same end.

So please keep talking about how I make BS points and I just hate on precision because precision has MASSIVE advantages currently to PFTT especially in single target which has now become the meta for damage not only shown that the scorecard splits the boss damage category and the first scorecard phase doesn't even show overall damage to that every raid that is released has boss fights revolve around single target abilities.

How is this even an issue fr? Just make precision attacks plateau at similar levels and up the baseline power regen rate. Everyone wins (except the devs) and once all precision weapons have a similar damage potential then it will make it easier for powers to be balanced as well.

My issue with you is that you choose to hear what you want yet ignore everything you don’t like. I stated multiple times in different threads that dw flurry shot needs a nerf. But the nerf it needs is to not allow it to jump clip into itself. I’ve stated this multiple times. And I never said precision didn’t have advantages that might dps didn’t have but might also has just as many advantages but you only make list that benefit your own point of view. And to say that I favor precision is true. I never claimed I didn’t. However I am not biased towards precision like you are towards might. I test every angle of game play for each power. I test might and I test prec. I test to see what does better in each situation. You claim all you want but you said it yourself that you dont know much about precision. And the plats league is good but to say they have the best prec loadouts is not true. Yes precision can run power safe loadouts, but outside of single target which I stated multiple times to be broken, a precision dps won’t do much damage if they aren’t using their powers with their weapons. Look at quantum, I can run a power safe loadout and do decent, or I can use my good loadout and be out of power faster than when I’m might as quantum. But you’re to ignorant to see that precision isn’t as cookie cutter as YouTube makes it look. I want you to find a post I made that says single target is fine the way it is for dw. You claim I’m biased so show me when I was biased. You can’t cause you’re a joke.

Precision dps all seem to think I just want a nerf to dw and bow and then just wipe my hands and leave prec with no options, dw and bow are the outliers because how WM combos were adjusted at stats revamp with little initial testing cause the WM combos were buffed at the last minute on test server because the base weapon combos all hit harder than WM which was balanced cause they were clippable and lended themselves to a hybrid playstyle, but then that was quickly taken away because the devs wanted to save face with the work they put into WM. I can't speak to precision balance cause I haven't got around to doing it myself but it doesn't take a genius with prec to see the entire community using 2 combo variations and only them. What I do by talking about prec is pulling it into the light like I have and tried to do with other issues in the past which gets attention then actual work can be done to properly test.

I never spoke to how good the Plats players were I simply said it would be near impossible to accomplish any of their feats with the same group makeup but with PFTT dps because might dps are so heavily dependant on power and a superpowered spec does nothing in the grand scheme of things compared to precision where even with the power reduction it doesn't even matter in most cases because you're in WM combos the majority of the time especially in single target.

You say that im ignorant but you didn't address even a SINGLE one of my points but to say that you've agreed with aspects of them, you do all this testing yourself but its 2019 and people are creating and playing games in virtual reality environments but yet DeitySupreme can't record his own footage and post it for players to see. You are just like everyone else that will talk about balance but when it comes down to fighting for it you would rather just sit back and not worry about it. You ask me to find where are your posts saying that s/t is fine? I ask you to some me some where you created threads asking for balance or showing "hey devs here is all my results and as you can see things are out of line and this is how I think we should go about fixing it" Have you don't anything like that? while every guide series I make I highlight exactly what is wrong with the powerset and what it would need to make it competitive or what its advantages or disadvantages are for might.

The difference is one of us is content and the other is not.

In the end like I stated before when I have proper numbers in-front of me displayed on an Excel document showing not only each WM combo but also the weapon taps and regular weapon combos tested on 1,3,8 targets to show how Precision damage splits and the duration it takes to complete each WM combo then I won't really push for change.

Cause there isn't a single player on these forums that has generated that type of data with visual representation of the combos not just text on a page since Stats Revamp. This is what precision needs and no precision players have cared enough to do so in a long time and that's how I work. It's just low on my personal priority list at the moment with respect to dcuo.

You yourself said that you wanted it nerfed to the ground. You stated that I’m this thread... So according to you, just because I don’t record means my testing is invalid? Some of us aren’t self centered egomaniacs who want validation to make ourselves feel better. Ask anyone who I have helped and they will say that my loadouts work. Regardless if I record or not. And I’m not gonna get some sort of software to upload videos just to prove a point.

Funny you say that every prec dps uses the 2 same combos.. yet every electric dps uses the same loadout. 90% of each power uses the same loadout because that’s the best loadout. How is that different than every prec dps using the same 2 weapons? Yes might dps have options to use different combos to do decent damage, same as every prec dps having the ability to use different weapons to do decent damage. Difference is that the prec dps has to spend more marks to buy the different weapons as opposed to a might dps who can just get one. Weapons need to be balanced just like powers need to be balanced. But saying that the 2 best weapons need to be nerfed to the ground is beyond stupid. Sh*t, if a dps wants to spend extra marks to buy more weapons for every situation they all power to them.

Yea I do want them nerfed to the ground so that other options have to be found cause if the devs just tweak bow and dw that doesn't solve anything. If the devs just said well based on feedback flurry shot and smokebomb do 30% less damage and that's it. That doesn't solve anything. You test things great but just like when you test precision you didn't tell us 1) your precision stats 2) what artifacts you ran 3) when you said range and melee 3 targets or 8? 4) did you have a controller buff you 5) what rank was your venom wrist 6) are you clipping your WM combos or completing them normally? All these things you don't tell us unless someone asked. If I just said Berserk was doing x damage in a post and left it at that do you think that really would have made a difference? No I physically broke it down and compared it in a video cause its alot harder to deny or question things when you see it in front of you. Not being able to produce "evidence" to your testing is a giant hindrance and myself personally I would be completely laughed at by players if I tried that and didn't make a video to prove it especially when its completely free. Do you think I pay for any of the things I use? I edit with windows movie maker of all programs.

So you are saying I don't think PFTT is boring and not the same? lol of course cause PFTT is basically just AM's we are still in a 12345 world for most powersets, once again I fought against that but the playerbase wanted easy things like no damage modifiers. You say precision dps could use different weapons for different situations but they can't lol there are no weapons that would out DPS bow>sb or dw>flurry shot. MA could but do we expect to melee every boss and even then you really need the crit on it. There is no "secret" weapon that does way more damage but players simply don't want to waste the marks for.

When I post loadouts I just give parsers and the basic information. But I do it in a way to show everyone exactly how to do it so that they can compare it themselves to their own loadouts. Me hitting 32k range on 3 targets doesn’t mean that someone else will hit those numbers because of their stats. And the majority of people I help are one on one showing them how to perform the loadouts I give them. And when I tried to help you with your sorcery loadout all you did was try to discredit me... and your way of thinking is beyond idiotic it’s laughable. Getting a combo nerfed to the ground in order to force people find different combos is beyond stupid. Why not nerf berserker to the ground? Nerf nature’s wolf forms and force them to use powers while in human form only. Nerf gadgets all together... it’s just plain stupid and for you to say that shows a lot about you. You claim no one cares about precision yet when someone tries to defend precision all you say is nerf it to the ground. You’re pathetic.

Yes you certainly do give the most basic information about your testing there can be no denying that, I would like to think someone who puts as much effort into testing as you obviously do would want it to stand without question or interpretation. Sure videos can be a larger ask but literally anyone's kid can make a video and post it, doesn't even have to be public lol if you are worried about "ego" unlist it but not only that there aren't even any parser or stat screenshots someone that puts as much effort into the game you certainly put as much effort into having others clarify everything you try to tell us. You seem to have a fuzzy memory of the sorcery cause I showed it parsed higher and was a viable alternative. I discredited all your wall of just numbers instead of just providing a basic parser screenshot because you weren't capable of it apparently but there is no denying that your sorc rotation parses higher than the one I provided which doesn't bother me cause I dislike sorcery and haven't been it in over 5 years so someone like yourself who is seasoned and can only find 1 rotation better after I tested a new power for a few weeks doesn't bother me. I don't call my rotations "ObsChill Rotations" lol I don't care if one is found better as long as they can actually prove it.

The only way to draw attention to imbalances is to be sensationalist about it. Go look up GU:33 its the same situation as it was back then 1H Focused Blast was hitting ridiculously harder than anything else and was making it easy for groups to clear paradox wave because of its high s/t damage spam. I made several videos and posts and got yelled at by all the dps who used it because they just wanted to keep it because it was easy and didn't care about balance and Focus Blast was useless after GU:33 and brought other weapons into the spotlight.

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/dc...hats-its-not-broken-watch-and-discuss.177211/

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/dcuo/index.php?threads/one-handed-focus-blast.174921/

Hmmm it's almost like those threads are very similar to something else happening