How broken is Rage and Electricity

I hear ya. It should be deserving. I feel the same with Fire...but in all reality...there shouldn't be a FOTM...only good players. Its difficult to say it's fair for an electric toon with 175sp with little to no gear mods out damage the same cr of a Sorcery toon with 350sp and modded. Regardless of likes or dislikes in regards to electric. It is broken. Damage should split like all the rest.

nerf this and nerf that threads are pointless as there are very few people still in the game that can truly show you what the powers are capable of, most of the players suck hard but their egos are great so they cant accept being beat by *______* power (blank being any power a good player has that your not) most powers are subjective to the content to an exstent especially when new content releases its the most appearent while the adds have more life because people arnt at top gear lvl yet. Once everyone has geared it balances the field up more as it speeds up the encounters and adds die quicker.

get good if your complaining, along with ITS A COOPERATIVE GAME NOT A DPS ONE get over it. no one cares if you are top of that broken scoreboard but your own little ego * really wish there was a micro eggplant emoji to show whats driving this cause for nerfs *

in closing if you beat the content guess what you are WINNING do a little jig thank the group and move on with your life

Im in agreement with you on one thing. Nerfs are irrelevant. Period. But as far as some people like it or not there is a competitiveness in them. We play a super hero game...we want to feel super. If it was just grinding for gear for me...I would stick to other games. I am competitive by nature...is it life or death, not even a little. When it comes down to feeling super I want to be able to do just as well as someone who uses powers that have an advantage. I agree with you on the fact it is a co operative game. Completing content is my priority...but none the less I want to feel like I am just as good as the next person. As a Fire toon mainly I hold my own in all content. This whole get good crap gets old. Just because I choose to be Fire instead of something else does not make me less of a player or less skilled. Alot of people in the community just want better balance. You know it's not balanced by just looking around in a raid. Nuff said. Players like me want to be the best they can be...and being "super" is the reason they play a superhero game. I respect your opinion...and I second that powers shouldn't be nerfed. We are just voicing our opinions the same as you...we just see the game different than you do. No harm. No foul.

There are many of skilled players still playing that are very good with an assortment of powersets. I enjoy seeing players doing well outside of the FOTM powers. It's like rooting for the underdog that's underestimated.

The problem really is the way that raids are built. Some are built to favor certain powers, like raids with a lot of hallway adds will cause electric to prevail over others, while raids where melee DPS is piss poor easy, will cause rage to be on top, and since those two scenarios fit the majority of raids, then you'll always see them as flavor of the month unless you step foot in elite, where positioning is alot more important.


Only thing the devs could really do to fix this is give all powers good melee alternatives, and buff melee weapon combos.

The work "broken" doesn't really apply in this particular situation but its a 100% fact that they are out of balance.

There was more competitive balance in the game during AM's and pre-gu36 than there is right now. AM's you had mental, ice, gadgets, munitions big gun, earth/sorc with power cheese. Pre-GU36 with phase dodge near every power was competitive. When stats revamp came out it was heavily skewed towards nature, earth, rage, elec. Then obvious bugs with nature were fixed which brought that down and they made adjustments to earth which brought that down. Now there is only rage & elec for competitive balance out of 15 powers which is ridiculous. Now before you go saying im munitions/gadgets etc and can easily beat rage/elec etc im not referring to you im referring to 2 equally skilled players using the powerset. Right now its only the raid design that dictates which is better between elec & rage. Range friendly raids like zoo and zoo elite unanimously favoured elec with non splitting powers tesla ball and arc lightning and when zoo became melee friendly in addition to jfa/usr becoming melee friendly rage unanimously was favoured. The 2 new raids open up the doors to a few other powersets only because pano is near pure single target fights which allow powersets like gadgets and other heat vision loadouts to do well but that doesn't change the current state of competitive balance. No esc, especially the final room fight favors rage almost exclusively with the outrage range being able to hit almost all 3 targets and the close proximity of the bosses are effective for multiple beserk supercharges as well.

It doesn't matter what raids dcuo creates if its range and multiple targets always = elec and if its melee able always = rage.
40% of all endgame characters are either rage or elec as per the census
This is not the type of balance we should have been seeing from the so welcomed stats revamp.

I say this because I don't want to be rage or elec I want my powerset to have a reasonable chance to succeed competitively against another powerset which presently if im not elec or rage I can't do that. There is no way for me to push munitions or qunatum past a equally skilled rage dps in no escape etc. And pano is just an asterix because its so single target based and then its not your powerset doing well you are ONLY doing well because of a power in heat vision. Take out heat vision from your gadgets user etc and they don't get to make up any ground on that rage/elec

It is "good business" to keep the game powers not in balance. Rage and Electricity are OP, there is no way that the Devs/GMs do not see it. They have player metrics and can 100% see what powers the majority of players are. Once the population get to 80% Rage saturation then they will nerf it and say that a "re-balance" is necessary. That in turn will cause everyone who does not have power change tokens to buy them and switch.

We do tend to give Electricity a pass because it has been so bad for so long, but the only ones that do not want a Rage nerf or re-balance are Rage players. All I wanted to say when I started the tread was that they should do it more sooner than later, cause it is getting old playing a raid and EVERYONE is Rage.

There are 3 ways to dps for each power. Weapon expert, Hybrid, Powers. Try all three before you determine your power sucks. Instead of crying for nerfs. And please consider the possibility, that maybe just maybe, you aren't very good.

Certain powers shine in different content. In easy mode a.k.a. regular content. Rage and earth do crazy damage because you can get close and not worry about mechanics. Switch to PAN E. Getting to close gets you killed too quickly, making you a hindrance. In PAN E with my gadget weapon expert I can out perform electric, rage, earth, ice. Because my play style excels at long range combat.

Just side note: Dont compare yourself to a player that is fully modded, To yourself that isn't

You know maybe you should look at the players that use those powers. Some players really know how to maximize what a power can do others can't. I personally know several metals that hold thier own or beat electric and rage players often. So stop with the nerf this and that stuff learn your powers instead of watching how someone else uses it

Why are there still FoTM powers??? I thought about coming back to the game and one of the first things I see in the forum is this crap. Wasn't the huge revamp supposed to end all that? Stats matter n blah blah blah and so on..? Smh

people suck and dont know what they are talking about powers currently are pretty close but saying that as I pointed out before its a moot point because the only stat people are basing their claims over are subjective and not factual statements. the scoreboard does not matter outside of a players ego. the reading it gives don't account for so many factors that happen in content. along with the simple fact that this is a cooperative game discount its data in many ways.

if someone was staying away from the game becuase of power imballance then that also is a lie because there is no such thing as balance even if the powers were no two players are or would remain equal in all content. as just the content will change the factors. if someone weren't playing, for this reason, they really don't want to play, to begin with as thats almost never a reason to play a game especially long-term

Because you have a leaguemate or a person on a friends list that says they beat rage, elec all the time counts for nothing because it doesn't change the merit of the point that taking two "equally" skilled players with apposing powersets rage & elec will in almost every single scenario will come out on top. It's about the competitive balance, sure any power can complete the raid and say disregard the scoreboard but the point of balance is that a players skill will bridge the gap between powersets such as rotation, trinket clipping, positioning, supercharge management but even elec's and rages with outdated rotations still have a much easier time than someone who knows gadgets, munitions, nature, atomic etc. Pre-GU36 with phase dodge I could be practically any power and do the same damage as the FOTM powersets gadgets/hardlight, during AM's Mental/Ice/Gadgets/Munitions biggun would all do similar damage and would be up to to the player skill to overcome gaps. There was more endgame balance before stats revamp than with it, its not a mystery that 40% of all endgame players are either rage or elec, I want qunatum or ice or water to do similar damage to rage&elec but the way raid content and elite raid content is designed it heavily favors rage&elec and then when you are fully geared you are able to melee elite and all other content and rage is pushed even further ahead.

This isn't a case of people suk and need to get gud

I'm on OC's side on this one. Just because I say I can beat Electricity and Rage with my Ice DPS it doesn't mean that Ice is on par with those two powers. It just means I know very well what I am doing and most people who specced to Rage or Electricicy did so because they thought it would make them stronger. Doesn't change the fact that there are mediocre Rage and Electricity DPS out there.

And I say that as a player who played rage on my main toon for the past year and longer on alts. If you know how to max your total damage (total damage on the scoreboard) you can easily catch up to FOTM players who don't know that well what they are doing.

That being said I still think that the the main thing that should be adjusted with rage is the Berserk Supercharge. It's a neat idea to have a SC like this but as we saw it can be srewed up really easy (happened multiple times as we know).

I find it funny how broken the bow is, which can make any power look good, and it's never brought up. I've yet to see a bow/smoke bomb needs nerfed. I think some players are just bad dps.

I'm not saying electric and rage dont have an advantages on trash mobs, they do, but so what. We don't need to nerf powers that were designed to work this way. Stop worrying about others damage and move on. I've seen plenty of other powers keep up with both. Even doing better using the bow/smoke bomb.

PLEASE STOP THE NERFS!

I've already had to change powers right after the revamp because of what they did to sorcery. The berserk SC was adjusted, so it is working as intended.

This thread seems like the same people crying about munitions big gun. Look what they did to that SC. Just stop!

Bow isn't broken its just a hard hitting fastest WM combo, sure pretty much any powerset can do well with full prec bow/smokebomb especially sorc or ice but weapons expert damage drops off DRASTICALLY at range or midrange there are very little weapon combo's to use and bow/smokebomb has a 5m range which is the smallest melee range. Added onto the fact that you can be easily countered by any npc in a raid or alert when they block which more often than not they do which means your entire combo chain is lost and need to start over costing you 15-20k/s in damage where all superpowered spec'd powers don't have to worry about counters at all on their combos. Also with weapons expert you have to have 2 weapons one for melee and range or single target etc depending on the situation and thats more marks if you are buying vendor weapons which you should for the extra stats etc where superpowered spec's can pick almost any weapon they choose

Players are asking for nerfs/adjustments because its alot easier to adjust 2 powers than it is the other 13. Stats revamp on release earth and nature were way more unbalanced than elec and rage and they got adjusted accordingly and are doing similar damage to the other 13 powersets in most cases.

After what electric, nature and rage been threw over the past few years and elec is longer, I take this thread as an insult. Because someone out dps you be 100k, 500k or maybe a Mil because most don't know how to dps is just sad. Just tell the devs to scrap the revamp and bring back AM platform and electric, rage and others will be nerfed and that will take care of it.

Im not gonna say nerf, but somehow, someway we deserve the balance that was promised.

Im sorry many of you feel it is balanced mostly....but thats not the case at all. Many players are using the same iconics because their powerset lack. Without heat vision, fire is horrible compared to a few other powers mentioned. Ive played fire exclusively on my main since 2011, this is the worst its been. Horrible DoTs, horrible SCs, guaranteed interuptions, without heat vision I have no chance in keeping up.

I suppose if we all run around with an iconic loadout itll be balanced right?!?

I have to disagree with horrible supercharges, my fire alt may not be top cr, but I use him enough and volcanic calamity is definitely one of the hardest hitting supercharges in the game.

I can't vouch for the accuracy of these numbers, but we can at least give some statistical context to the conversation using DC Census:
http://www.dcuolive.com/Census/Characters

If you a breakdown by characters power type at endgame (CR > 215), we get this:

CR > 215
Powerset | Characters | Percent
Atomic | 667 | 6.07 %
Celestial | 383 | 3.49 %
Earth | 1,002 | 9.12 %
Electricity | 1,772 | 16.14 %
Fire | 661 | 6.02 %
Gadgets | 648 | 5.90 %
Ice | 1,002 | 9.12 %
Light | 454 | 4.13 %
Mental | 468 | 4.26 %
Munitions | 748 | 6.81 %
Nature | 417 | 3.80 %
Quantum | 744 | 6.77 %
Rage | 644 | 5.86 %
Sorcery | 636 | 5.79 %
Water | 736 | 6.70 %


Electricity is a clear outlier here. This may be due to balance or it could be any number of other things (aesthetics, playstyle, bandwagoning, etc.). We have Ice and Earth in 2nd place behind Electricity. I haven't really seen anyone complaining about Ice being overpowered (Earth gets some). Rage is actually below average usage at 5.86%. (If everything were equal, each power would be at about 1/15 or 6.67%). This is also a fairly low sample size because players are spread out across a huge CR range. If we broadened the scope of the comparison to characters at CR > 200, Electricity drops to a 12.82% usage rate, but still remains the most common power for those characters.

We are weighing adjustments to Electricity specifically with its abilities that don't split damage (Tesla Ball and Arc Lightning). Currently, those are balanced around hitting 3 targets. Part of the issue is that we don't show a breakdown of damage to basepop mobs vs. bosses on the scoreboard (yet*), which makes Electricity look disproportionately good in instances with high amounts of basepop, even if it's average (or even below average) against single targets. We can also take another look at Supercharges that act as damage multipliers like Berserk.

We are also looking into buffs for powers that receive frequent complaints for underperforming (though that isn't as apparent in this data). The bottom 4 powers in terms of usage rates here are Celestial, Nature, Light, and Mental, but only Mental really receives frequent complaints (along with Sorcery, which is very close to an average expected use rate).

Obviously this data has too many factors to be used as a strict gauge of balance, so we temper that with player feedback and our own play experience. Still, it's helpful to show that the situation isn't anywhere near what some people have claimed in terms of a huge population shift towards a few power sets.

You have to also take support roles into consideration as well for population count. Rage tanks are considered inferior to ice tanks for the most part which could be why the high number of ice players because ice tanks are currently the shiznit. Celestial and nature heals are considered inferior to water and electric because of atrocious power costs, and with electric being a great dps along side of being an amazing healer, that could be the reason why it's population is so high as well. Powers like atomic shine bright in tank role but not as much in dps role, so most of that population could be people that main as tanks. Gadgets is also a great dps but the population isn't as high, like any of the troll power sets, mainly due to the fact that trolling is in a poor state right now and no one wants to do it, which could also effect population numbers. Just throwing out some extra things for you guys to think about is all. I'm glad adjustments are being considered though for underperforming powers.

If you're looking at celestial I got a little list for ya