Why are VS loosing faction specific weakness?

So the only drawback to the VS no bullet drop- arguably not relevant except at long range- was a lower minimum damage (but less steep decline in damage over distance) also arguably not very relevant except at long ranges.

They are removing this drawback and I wonder how others feel about this- particularly the TR loyalists out there as the VS are very similar to TR in terms of damage and ROF on weapons.

Is anyone else curious why they are making this change? I follow the data fairly well and I have never seen the VS struggling in terms of score/hour- in fact, they are consistently above NC in all categories except the MAX.

Seems a little strange to say:

NC- trade higher damage per shot for lower ROF
TR- trade higher ROF and more ammo per mag for less damage per shot
VS- trade no bullet drop for lower minimum damage at range

Is there some other downside to VS that I am unaware of?

Do the VS out there feel that the min. damage going from 125 to 112 when >120m was a problem?

People have suggested this is just a ploy to get the VS numbers up- how do others feel? Do you think this will work?

Personally, I started with VS until BR 32 and moved to NC (before the Mag nerf- I never piloted those anyways) because I got tired of the ugly VS aesthetics and wanted a faction that would reward few accurate shots (preferring mid to long range). I do not really see myself moving back to VS just because they have no real weakness now because I still am sick of the terrible designs and aesthetics but how do others in similar situations feel?

The weaknesses are: Bad pistol
High rate of fire with low mag size (rare to kill any more than 2 people per mag, tr can easily get 3)
Magrider was balanced to be in 2/2 against 1/2 mbt's because we actually used gunners so any 2/2 tank destroys us
We also have the most recoil believe it or not, you would think vs would have close to none but that is far from the case

I do not feel that there is going to be any noticeable difference. Maybe i will theoretically need one less shot to finish somebody at those ranges, but given that is a bit luck-based anyway at those ranges there will not be a noticeable change to be honest.

The problem VS has right now is that it has nothing really going for. Our tank is considered as garbage (i think it can be useful sometimes, but the common opinion is that it is bad), our MAX is definitely worse than the other two and our infantry may be somewhat balanced, idk. The only thing that is balanced is the ESF, but then again, there is only a handful of people in this game that can still be bothered to fly.

It's actually a nerf in medium range.

Lack of bullet drop is hardly an advantage. On the off chance that you're actually shooting from a range at which bullets do drop, the amount you'll have to adjust for is negligible and easy to deal with. On the other hand, there's no way of adjusting for increased damage degradation. The faction specific strength/weakness argument isn't really useful because it's so dumbed down. If you want to generalise, consider that whilst TR have the best RoF and NC have the best damage per shot, Vanu sit somewhere in the middle and don't particularly specialise.

The difference won't be noticeable, but that goes both ways. It's the principal of the thing, though. Why don't we just homogenize the factions, at this rate? Everything is NS anyway, and with factions losing their already muted faction characteristics...

Maybe the devs realised that the VS advantage makes little difference in the game world - any and all fights that are tactically useful are happening at close range. Except for snipers (VS sniper rifles magically have bullet drop anyhow).

Meaning their faction trait is irrelevant. Actually I feel the differences aren't large enough to matter.

no we are being balanced the VS have had a big disadvantage, both of the other factions had perks that decrease TTK while ours hurt us in the long run. You also forgot that we have higher first shot recoil that the other factions.


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its a stupid change that makes absolutely no sense, and in the end will hurt the VS even more when the devs add a new negative trait to make up for the one they are getting rid of.

I love all the VS defending this saying it won't make any difference. Oh really then why are they changing it? Obviously it's to give an overall advantage to the least popular faction to get their numbers up. My fear is that this is a change that will likely never be reversed and the long-term effects are unknown even to the Devs.

The weakness of VS is:

• Bad pistol - the default pistol just sucks whereas the alt pistol has a huge hip-fire spread even with the laser dot (it also sucks)
• Low velocity - velocity is often regarded unimportant yet is easily the most important thing at medium to long range moving targets.
• VS MAX is bad compared to TR and NC (The empire specific max ability for VS is sh*t)
• Magrider is super slow. A Magrider is pretty much useless without upgrades
• Bad sound for VS weapons (unless you have bass - most people don't) which results in lower immersion and enthusiasm.
• VS with camo doesn't blend in as well as NC blends in with TR or TR blends in with NC

I think this change might be coming to balance out the coming changes to the battle rifles, which will make them far more effective and give the TR and NC an advantage.
Just my take on it, I have no facts to back up this speculation.

How are the VS MAXs bad, how is getting a boost of damage and mobility in exchange for taking damage bad? That will make Bursters great, and allow us to pursue and kill infantry faster. If you have Engineers handy, it'll be awesome.

VS MAXs are basically TR MAXs, get dual Comos and have a party.
Magrider could go for a directional Magburner to help it dodge shells and have mobility, I will say that.
Audio improvements needed too!
I do really love my Beamer, though, but I hear a lot of complaints so maybe they have something there.

TR have more bullets per magazine*(usually 40), unique side arm.
NC have more damage per bullet(usually 167)*, unique 200dmg weapons.

VS have the same magazine size as NC(30) but the same damage tier as TR(143). We're supposed to be accurate with what we get, and if you miss you're screwed. VS also trade the *slight* edge in hipfire with some weapons with a slightly worse ADS COF when considering the damage per bullet ratio. I'm not saying VS are horribly UP but I am saying the faction's advantages and disadvantages have been gradually phased out, and the damage deg on VS weapons was something that had to go. We're already paying for the no bullet drop.

* There are some weapons which blurs the line, some completely, so please do NOT reply "nu-uh, this gun does bla bla bla". Thanks.

A lot of great contributions here and a noticeable lack of nonsense- kudos to everyone replying.

I too wonder how this will change things. On the face of it, it seems difficult to think that a weapons having its minimum damage at range go from say 112 to 125 will mean very little.

Still, I know people like to say that 0 bullet drop is a useless advantage but I fail to see how the same argument cannot be made for having more damage per shot if the ROF is such that this means doing less damage over time. I have always wondered why the trade off for more damage per shot is (1) reduction in ROF and (2) increases in recoil, (3) COF bloom, (4) HIP COF and in some cases (ACX-11) also (5) a mag ammo reduction. The result is that you trade more damage per shot (except with the ACX-11 where min damage is the same as 167 max damage tier weapons) for less damage over time, more recoil, worse COF bloom, and worse HIP COF- so if I want more damage per shot I pay by doing less damage over time and all these other drawbacks?

One of the lesser recognized advantages to VS is that the damage drops off less steeply, although it does continue to decrease beyond TR and NC minimums. I always thought this was an elegant way to balance the 0 drop because then at CQC to mid range where drop is irrelevant the VS have the advantage of slightly less damage degradation; then, at ranges where bullet drop is more relevant the additional damage degredation takes effect and provides the disadvantage to keep the weapons balanced. Now, I wonder what they will do with VS damage degredation because it seems that if only cap at the same min. as NC and TR that this will mean the VS have the 0 drop advantage at range and the slower damage degredation without any drawback at range. At the very least, it would seem that they should make the damage degredation equal among the factions if they are going to halt the minimum damage of VS weapons the same as TR and NC.

Also, seems like VS slug sniping is going to get the best of the changes and that could be problematic.

The only thing I can think of is that they are adding in the damage/range plot to the weapon stats preview in upcoming versions. Maybe it caused some discussion about if it woudl appear fair to players that vs weapons extended slightly higher damage at most effective ranges in exchange for lower min damage when presented like that. Or they just wanted weapon stats to appear less confusing when compared side to side.

Since when was bullet drop a disadvantage for normal weapons? You'd have to be fighting at distances way over 100m, distances at which COF and recoil are really going to **** you over.

Now Battle rifles, once buffed, may be different because they're designed for longer ranges, but VS sniper type weapons have bullet drop anyway... We'll have to see what happens.

I regularly fight at distances where the drop of my projectiles must be compensated for. Gauss Rifle S user, here.

The entire game is not biolabs, people.

Interesting, name one TR carbine, assault rifle or LMG that do less damage per shot than the standard VS weapons

Anyway, there are no real downsides to any faction weaponary anymore, only minor benefits
TR have their larger mags, VS have no drop and NC hit the hardest.

As for why, well obviously this is made as bolster for VS' dwindling population on most servers.