Striker 3.0 - Tweaks to it & its counters

Discussion in 'Test Server: Discussion' started by axiom537, Sep 10, 2014.

  1. axiom537

    Tried the Striker out in VR last night and I like it for the most part.

    #1. Anti-Air - The Striker is going to be a beast vs ESF & Valkyries and to a lesser extent Liberators and Galaxies. Rather then directly nerf it vs Air, I think this is a good place for use to give coyotes a different counter. Currently I believe Flairs are the counter to the coyote rockets. I think the hard counter for proximity lock-ons should be Stealth, not flairs. For each level of Stealth an Air craft has then the Coyote missile must be 2m closer to the target to acquire locks. Level 5 Stealth should require the coyote rocket to be with in 1 m for it to lock-on and no Stealth keeps it at the 10-15m proximity lock range it is set to now.

    This change is important, It stops Flairs from being the go-to counter for Air vehicles vs. TR & the coyote rockets in general. It also forces the pilot make a choice, Stealth to counter Coyote type rockets or Flairs to counter fire and forget lock-ons.

    #2. Anti-Vehicle - I think the Striker is in the same boat as the Lancer when it comes to Anti-Vehicle. It's not great solo inf. vs tank, but in groups it is going to be very dangerous. It has pretty good projectile speed and fair amount of range. I think it will work well for up close to medium range, especially as you are running and gunning in and around obstacles or from roof tops.

    #3 Anti-Max - I didn't have much opportunity to test this, VR just isn't a good place for this sort of testing, but I think it is fair vs Max's. This is one of those weapons that I wouldn't be my first pick to go against a MAX, but if I was out in the fields and had some range on the Max, the multi-shot rockets make it easier to walk them into your target. It also shouldn't be bad in most situations if you can keep the max 15-20 m from you, but up close in your face obviously the Deci would be the best pick.

    #4 Quality of Life -
    1. I think the explosive flair from launching each rocklet is too much. I really do not see the need for the rocket to explode out of the rocket launcher and completely blind the user. Even if it is meant to give away the Striker users position, I think the same could be achieved with a Fracture like Tracer behind each rocklet, rather then an explosion that fills over half the screen.
    2. I think the striker needs adjusted from the semi-automatic only, click to shoot mechanic to a full automatic with the ability to shot more quickly in semi-auto. Allow the players to rapid fire the Striker in a Semi-Automatic mode, however that means the rockets are going to fire while the launcher is in recoiling so the shots will not be as accurate. At the same time if the player holds the button and allows the launcher to auto-Fire the rockets will launch once the launcher has recovered from its recoil and therefore follow the same flight path.
    Over-all I think the Striker is in a good place. Ideally I would like to get some practical use with the weapon in a fighting environment. It's not the most powerful rocket launcher, but for general purpose I think it will be very nice. If you do not know what is going to come your way or if you know the fight is going to be a mix of Air, ground and maxes then the Striker would the my go to weapon. Solo - it will be strong vs air and fair vs ground, but in groups with rocklets screaming towards their target it's going to be quite good, especially if you factor in the AA potential that group is going to have, no ESF or Valkyrie is going to be able to get with in 150m of them.
  2. Chrispin

    I personally recommend using the Decimator as it's hands down the best RL for killing pilot-less aircraft in VR training.

    As for killing aircraft with pilots (provided they also have brains), I would recommend any other G2A lock-on RL other than the Striker. A common misconception about Striker 3.0 is that it's actually good AA past the 30m range.
    • Up x 1
  3. DxAdder

    As it stands now you would be better off using any other RL, the "New" Strike just isn't useful to waste certs or SC on.

    The damage vs Air/ground units needs to be increased to 250-300 and the AI damage needs to increase to 150 to bring its
    TTK to a reasonable lvl to use.
    • Up x 2
  4. axiom537

    #1 The grounder is different from the Striker and that is what is great about those two weapons, they compliment each other. The grounder actually has the same TTK as the Striker, New Striker TTK comparison, But what makes them compliment each other is the situations they can be used in. The Striker is going to allow the user to immediately and accurately put damage into low flying Air craft, the grounder is going to require the user to be exposed first and give warning to the pilot, before its puts damage on the aircraft, provided they do not have flares.

    #2 The skep has a velocity of 115m/s the Striker is 150m/s, so no you are incorrect the Striker has greater velocity. Again these are two different weapons, they are going to be used differently in different situations.

    #3 So it takes about 2 clips to kill a max which is the same for the other RL's. Now in mid to longer range engagements the Striker will be very nice against MAX's because it has greater velocity, which will make it a bit more accurate.

    As it stands it is situational, like the Lancer and the Phoenix, which is even more situational. It is not meant to replace, the grounder, the skep or the other Rocket launchers, it is meant to be UNIQUE and offer something different.

    Personally, I can see the Striker being a very nice RL and I can envision many situations it would be very useful and be a better choice over the other Rocket launchers.

    If you increase it's damage vs ground, then you are going to need to have a slower Reload speed or limit it in other aspects. Honestly the fact you are concerned about its AI damage is troubling, it already only take 3 rockets to kill infantry and it is not meant to fit that role.

    Your problem is you want this launcher to meet or exceed and replace all of the other launchers. I'm sorry but that just isn't going to happen.
  5. NoctD

    Flares should be and are the hard counter to Coyotes - this shouldn't change, it would be dumb to make Stealth give you total immunity.

    That's not to say Stealth should be as irrelevant as it is today either - IMO Stealth should be a softer counter, and each level of Stealth gives you a certain percentage that an incoming Coyote/Striker will ignore the target/not lock-on (maybe 5, 10, 15, 20%, or something along those lines, so it makes you take less hits/damage). This will make Stealth relevant in a sensible manner. Total immunity at all times is just far too much and totally unbalanced.
  6. DxAdder

    #1 The grounder is different from the Striker and that is what is great about those two weapons, they compliment each other. The grounder actually has the same TTK as the Striker, New Striker TTK comparison, But what makes them compliment each other is the situations they can be used in. The Striker is going to allow the user to immediately and accurately put damage into low flying Air craft, the grounder is going to require the user to be exposed first and give warning to the pilot, before its puts damage on the aircraft, provided they do not have flares.

    I can still dumbfire the grounder and do more damage at any low flying aircraft, yes the Stirker can lock on but it only does 500 damage if all 5 hit. I would rather have the weapon that is more versatile and can do some real damage.


    #2 The skep has a velocity of 115m/s the Striker is 150m/s, so no you are incorrect the Striker has greater velocity. Again these are two different weapons, they are going to be used differently in different situations.

    Sorry I meant to say exactly that, the striker is faster.

    #3 So it takes about 2 clips to kill a max which is the same for the other RL's. Now in mid to longer range engagements the Striker will be very nice against MAX's because it has greater velocity, which will make it a bit more accurate.

    As it stands it is situational, like the Lancer and the Phoenix, which is even more situational. It is not meant to replace, the grounder, the skep or the other Rocket launchers, it is meant to be UNIQUE and offer something different.

    Personally, I can see the Striker being a very nice RL and I can envision many situations it would be very useful and be a better choice over the other Rocket launchers.

    If you increase it's damage vs ground, then you are going to need to have a slower Reload speed or limit it in other aspects. Honestly the fact you are concerned about its AI damage is troubling, it already only take 3 rockets to kill infantry and it is not meant to fit that role.

    Your problem is you want this launcher to meet or exceed and replace all of the other launchers. I'm sorry but that just isn't going to happen.

    At 150 per shot that would make the damage for 5 shots 750, the same as a 3 shot lancer or Phoenix. I not asking for it to better just as good as the weakest RL vs Infantry.

    UNIQUE is nice but when your sacrificing it for a massive damage reduction and lose the ability to lock on to ground units
    you end up with weapons like the phase**** or Spiker.

    A few people might use this but overall its going to sit on the shelf for most people since the rest of the TR RL's
    will net them more certs.
    • Up x 2
  7. Mafarett

    ADS CoF should be zero, as it is with any launcher, currently even your first rocket can be off center so it's not just bloom. They fixed the acceleration and speed so it is going the listed 150m/s and it definitely feels better than before 09/10

    TTK list that someone posted earlier it's on par with the lock-ons, but looking at the ammo used it's actually between the default launchers and the Deci in terms of reloads needed to kill a ground target. Did some tests just shooting tanks in the rear and 3 full mags (15) kills a mag/prowler outright, but you need every rocket, and leaves a vanguard with a sliver of health, but less health than 3 default launchers would.

    So, ADS CoF needs to be tightened. Velocity feels fine, but can always be tweaked later as we get practice against actual aircraft, or if they want to try and extend or ground killing range. Damage against air is on par with other lock-ons in terms of damage per mag. Damage against ground is in between the default and the Deci in terms of magazines required to kill.

    I know Higby mention on the 09/10 mentioned they were going to look at tweaks to the magazine and reserve ammo size and adjusting TTK with RoF tweaks, which seems the better way to go than messing with rocket damage right now.

    Is it bad against infantry? Yeah, but honestly couldn't care less. I want to bring a RL to kill infantry with I'll bring the default or a Deci.
    • Up x 1
  8. TriumphantJelly

    So you want to be able to 4 shot an ES, and kill a Vanguard in 11 shots to the front?
    And no, TTK vs infantry is fine becuase rocket primaries are bad. All TTKs vs infantry with AV RLs should be increased :p
    • Up x 1