I made this thread once before. On the 16th. Right before the forums were wiped. >_> Unfortunately due to my lateness I missed out on any real discussion that happened, and there wasn't much time for anyone else to gain anything of value from the thread either. So here it is again only different, a thread containing my relatively unfiltered, likely broken proposals to "fix" the MAX. Or at least it's certifications. Please contain any and all objections to my absurdity within your oral cavity for the duration of this post. The MAX is a highly customizable, extremely durable armoured exo-suit equipped with a modular weapon system capable of adapting to any situation. Oh wait, that's what it's supposed to be, according to the wiki anyway. But in it's current incarnation could anyone actually say that description is accurate? Is the MAX living up to it's potential? Does it even have a role? Does Smedley know why kids love Cinnamon Toast Crunch? Personally I doubt it. The MAX has the durability of a smart car, and it only has options that create an illusion of choice with very few that actually make a discernible difference. Of the three defensive certifications only one is useful. Kinetic Armour provides next to no protection when maxed out and Flak Armour is quite nearly as useless considering how fragile MAXs are in the face of explosives by default. And even the Nano-Armour Accelerator is only helpful when you stay in the corner out of the fight for long stretches at a time. For "abilities" (one of them isn't even a real ability) we have run slightly faster than an infantryman for three seconds once every minute and carry more ammo. And as much as I'd love to, I'm not going to talk about the weapons. I feel there's so much wrong with them, but that's just it. I feel. Without actual numbers anything I say is just anecdotal. Not to mention any suggestion I made would just be, "make it better". So that discussion can be done later. So I've established my point I think, so here's the part where I pitch my solution. Lightly nerf the basic MAX, and buff it's certifications like a madman. Start by removing all innate bullet resistance from the default MAX. Don't worry it'll get more back later. If it doesn't already have one give it a head hitbox with a 1.3 multiplier for bullets and a rear-torso 1.3 multiplier for direct explosives like rockets and tank shells. Giving the MAX weakpoints will add some element of strategy to encounters and reward good aim. Next up remove the medic's ability to revive MAXs. You can't revive a tank, and there shouldn't be a method of circumventing the resource cost if it's truly necessary for balance. Finally, increase the resource cost. It should be enough to make spontaneous MAX crashes very rare without disallowing one to be a dedicated MAX operator. Honestly I'm not sure what a good number would be. (As compensation for the survivability nerfs, new players would start out with the first level of NAA.) There's the nerfs, so what about the buffs? Well if I were in charge of the MAXs certifications (I'm not and you're wasting your time reading this because none of this is ever going to happen) the defence certs would look more like this... Kinetic Armour: (5%-75% [5/15/30/50/75] small arms resist, headshots ignore 5% of armour) Nano-Armour Accelerator: (0.5%-2% [0.5/0.7/1.0/1.5/2.0] repair per second, 15s-10s [15/14/13/12/10] wait after damage) Flak Armour: (10%-80% [10/20/35/60/80] explosive resistance, rear-torso shots ignore 5% of armour) As you can see, this is insanely overpowered. Or is it? Sure a KA MAX could tank three HAs focus firing LMGs, but two with rockets (or one behind him, maybe with a few pistol shots thrown in) would annihilate it. An FA MAX could go tank hunting but a couple of LAs would shred it with carbines. Maybe an NAA MAX could regenerate way too quickly but without any bullet resistance and the MAXs weakness to explosives it wouldn't last long under direct fire of any sort. I guess what I'm saying is specialization is the key to my entire idea. The MAX becomes something to be feared within it's role but is incapable of stepping outside it. The infantry classes have versatility but MAXs gain immense power by choosing a specific role and dominating it. Obviously we would still need weapon buffs to really make this work but the idea stays the same. Currently MAXs are almost mediocre at everything and good at nothing, but any straight buffs to them will push them towards overpowered territory. So make them specialize! Y'know, like that one class in PS1 that could be AV, AA, or AI, but not two at the same time. Ugh, what was that class called? I can't remember. Oh well, it'll come to me. P.S. Obviously there's more that I want to do with the MAX but this is the most important bits. Other changes would be appreciated but are not entirely necessary. And you've successfully read my entire rant! You've earned the right to tell me why my ideas are awful and how much of a terrible person I am. Fire away.
I'm doing quite well as a TR max, but that's only indoors. It just dominates. But as soon as I step outside I'm dead pretty fast. And considering 90% of battles are outside, the MAX is at a huge disadvantage most of the time. +1 to your ideas though, resistance to small arms fire would be fantastic.
That's pretty much experience as well. But I do think things are working as intended. I don't go anywhere in an AI MAX without support. To my mind the AI MAX is a great big "shoot me" distraction in many circumstances which gives my sqaud mates a couple of seconds breathing space. I get a very nice amount of kills indoors with the TR AI MAX. In Planetside 1 you would always let 1 or 2 "meatshield" MAX units autorun in a door first. Nine times out of ten the enemy would become separated. Several would chase after the MAX units, leaving the assualting infantry to mop up those left. We also often had 2 MAX's at the rear of the push as well so that they were an added distraction if the remaining enemy numbers were still quite high. An AI MAX has always been a supporting unit in my eyes. It can get kills really easily, but is righfully (in my opinion) very vulnerable when used solo. It's meant for indoor pushes or to slow attacking troops down. It's not an outdoor MAX. That area belongs to the AA MAX and the AV MAX. A MAX crash using AI MAX's is brilliant. I've noticed a few in PS2 at last, which is really good to see.
And that's where I disagree.. Very strongly as well, the design philosophy for things in this game is that 'sidegrades' (okay.. upgrades, there's barely any actual sidegrades in the game) are not meant to buff you immensely, because this will make the experienced players WAY more powerful than newbies, you know what? In a FPS I have to agree with that design philosophy. It worked differently in PS1 because there you just certed into the stuff you wanted, once you had it, you were as good as a veteran in that one thing, this is PS2 where you can get unlimited certs by grinding them out, by making the MAX insanely powerful when certed to the top, your breaking way too many things. Your basically asking for it to be 'once you've got enough certs, everyone needs to bow before you, because you earned it.. which isn't exactly fun for a lot of people other than you. I agree that the Kinetic armor is kinda garbage and I'd never pick it over my regeneration, but it's really not as bad as you make it sound.. finding a minute to time out in a fire fight is not hard, unless the enemy are right on you, in which case regenerating 2% per second would hardly help you, because either you have a line/safe zone to hide behind.. or you wont get the chance. 5% may sound underwhelming.. No, I'd just prefer if they added some actual customization to the MAX.. not screwed up it's balancing.. Because saying 'but you spent a few thousands cert on the MAX.. so it's okay that I'm invulnerable to bullets and lay waste to all of the infantry, that is not balance.. or fun. I play MAX exclusively whenever it's off cooldown btw and have plenty of fun using it effectively, you can't just charge mindlessly into a fray, that is true.. but if you have a lot of infantry and want to charge a location? A MAX or two using their charge ability in through the door usually distracts everyone inside long enough for the rest to mop up and then rez your ***. They're also great for skirmishes and hunting solo players!
Well, at least you're honest about your intentions to make your favorite class better at the expense of other classes. Look at what you wrote down and think about what you're suggesting. Regardless of the nerfs you're proposing, a MAX with the buffs to armor you're proposing would be completely unbalanced. 75% small arms resist? 2% hp per second? 80% explosive resistance? How do you see anything like this entering the game? To me your whole post cries of "backseat developer" without truly thinking about the impact such a gigantic increase to small arms resist would have on, oh, I don't know, those pesky MAX crashes you want to get rid of?
Did you just stop reading at the line you quoted? Because I already stated why that wouldn't happen in the opening post... And all infantry and vehicle certs are straight upgrades. It's weapons that are supposed to be side-grades. The point of that was that the only worthwhile cert only works when you are not actively contributing, and that's just wrong in my opinion. As should be obvious, I'm almost always in a MAX suit as well. And I also have fun with it and get a fair number of kills, mostly by pretending I'm a massive ineffective infiltrator. When I'm against idiots I like to pretend I'm an HA and really start pushing, but more often than not I'm shredded by a TR with a CARV before I can even get my bearings when I try. Even if you don't like me, I like you. Large masses of slow moving targets weak to explosives? Throw grenades. Rockets. C4 instagibs MAXs from what seems like a fair distance away. What do you believe would be a more fair number?
On iPhone going to be short Add health bar. Medic rez engr repair Suit options. Add shield ( blue bar) Or Nanite shield (reduce explosive damage can be over loaded with small arms) Or Stabilizers increase reload or accurary Or Mobility enhance increase movement spied and jump hieght Utility slot Add a ability tonshield regen allies Or Tertiary weapon slot - shoulder grenade (throw grenade) - shoulder gun targeter (optics for weapons) - other ideas
75% reduced damage... 75... That.. is.. ridiculous.. I read the entirety of your post, twice btw yes all 'sidegrade' certs are upgrades.. but they also follow a very specific 20% rule that they've already stated, to not make people who've certed into something insanely more powerful than a newbie. as for the regeneration, I guess it's the price you pay for how survivable a MAX is when they actually have an pocket engineer, it's there to allow you to play a MAX solo if you don't want to bother with a squad. a friend.. an outfit.. or looking for a random. Because let's face it, as long as engineers can repair a MAX, then the MAX doesn't need insane amounts of survivability from it's certs, you can very easily go in get a kill, lose half your health, fall back, repair up, rinse & repeat. Also currently you can revive a MAX, again unless your entire squad is wiped out, then you are a very survivable beast. If I had to point out any balance issues then it's not that the MAX is poor, but rather that the HA is too effective for how versatile it is, which is something that should be balanced out with that class, not the MAX. (This is especially true for the TR HA, since the MCG is as effective as dual cyclers, while they still get to have a no-skill SKEP launcher, grenades, pistol, regenerating shield, extra shield and med packs) buffing the hell out of the MAX is not what is needed right now <_<.. giving some actual utility and customization on the other hand would be very much appreciated, I'm hoping we'll see some sooner rather than later. and with that, good night.
Currently in my opinion the issue isn't that you can't rambo and 1vs10 or whatever, it's simply that in many cases you can't even 1vs1 against most basic classes unless the situation is heavily favorable to you(generally very close distance, no cover for the enemy). Besides the infiltrator I think every class is able to beat a MAX 1vs1 assuming they're not in a corridor or a staircase or something like that(and even then the LA could probably jump above the MAX). The small arms resistance should be boosted to decent levels that would give you a definite edge. A HA with a shield is about as tanky as a MAX but also doesn't cost ressources or have a cooldown and can equip both AI and AV/AA(all as good or better than MAX weapons). Should get like 25% with max points, which as a reminder is like 2500certs or something stupidly high like that. A cost decrease would be helpful too. The nanoregen thingie need to give more too, even maxed it's only 2% of your hp per second, that's like 40-50secs of standing around doing nothing to regen to full +15secs for it to activate, a full minute? It doesn't take 20secs for normal classes to refill their shields. Just give it a cap but make it heal faster, so for example up to 10%/sec but it caps at 50% or 60% or max hp. Emulates the health aspect that normal classes can't regen on their own unless they're medics. The flak one also should be boosted but to be honest I feel it's always going to be worthless, you won't ever be able to tank AV dmg anyway unless it's OP, so that's fairly useless. Maybe make it ignore splash damage instead so you can only get taken down by direct hits at max rank(you'd still die in 2hits from most AV shots but eh). Also one thing I want back is the long distance running ability. MAXes can fit in vehicles but finding a ride can be annoying at times, I wish I could just equip it instead of say Charge and have a long distance high speed mod. Make it similar to PS1, long ramp up time, disarms while you're running, Lets me play a MAX longer when moving between bases and I don't catch a Sunderer.
I'm aware, but bear with me on this one. If you roll back the changes to the patch just prior to the final patch of the beta, give that MAX 75% resistance and how much damage can it take? About 2 CARV mags. (Besides, if the internet and politics have taught me anything it's that discussion never happens when you ask for something sane.) Really? I was unaware of that. Losing half a squad to ensure it's other half is combat effective is a little absurd, don't you think? Definitely agree with HA overpoweredness. Again, reasonable, sane demands and all that. Customization is half my problem with the MAX. I only briefly touched on it, but still.
I actually think that's part of the problem. A medic can only fix half an infantry; the other half is up to the player to be smart about. A MAX is completely dependent on someone else to repair any incidental damage they might incur, but when they do they become very powerful. It feels too binary, and out of your control. Definitely agree on customization. Edit: Completely agree here as well. I honestly feel guilty having an engineer following me around heh, especially when they die because I can only catch so many bullets
I have an idea for a Customization that could help specialize the role of the MAX. Right now we have giant infantry slug fests backed up by AMS and the other side's Spawn room. What would help if there were an infantry unit (such as the MAX) That could lay down some cover. IE Mortars. Mortars can cause a firing line to break up really fast, and could also have the option of smoke grenades, giving cover for a push into the tower or building the squishy infantry need to get to, without getting a tank battalion in the mix and every HA within a mile's rocket to the face. Yes, this would be another weapon for the MAX to use, but being highly specialized and giving it a definitive role is what it needs right now, as nearly all of its roles (AI, AV, AA) Have it playing like another class. AI = Bad infiltrator, AV = HA with only a life bar and 1 rocket, AA = Annoying screen shaker.
A scrap of what I believe a fair MAX rework: Considerable buff: -Small arms resistance (about 75%), Weak spots Head and Rear torso BUT: -Reduced turn/aim speed (like tanks) -Loud noise when walking -Limited MAX seats in transports -Increased cost from AMS
NC MAXs already make a fair amount of noise, and I'm pretty sure the TR ones do to. It's just the Vanu that move like massive metal ninjas. Reduced turning speed and limited seats make sense for nerfs, and the turning speed would actually add flavour which is always nice. Not sure how I feel about increased cost from AMS. I think I get the idea, but I really think a global cost increase is the way to go.
IMHO the OP is a good idea, BUT as someone suggested, these are player choices. Tactical choice >>> character level. A better balance might be, instead of: (original) Kinetic Armour: (5%-75% [5/15/30/50/75] small arms resist, headshots ignore 5% of armour) (better) Kinetic Armour: (65%-70% [65/67/68/69/70] small arms resist, headshots ignore 5% of armour) [or something similar/better balanced - whilst a vet is marginally better, the "new player" is competitive and has a tactical choice]
That hadn't even occurred to me. But you're right, if we're balancing so a new player could reasonably stand against a vet that would be the way to go.
