I'm trying to look at this, be helpful, and see what the issue is people have. I feel like I might as well have consigned myself to read Portuguese the rest of my life, starting five minutes ago. What IS the issue? The sidearm gap? Every faction, save for the VS (maybe) have pretty decent pistols. I can run on my TR or NC alts, and get some pretty decent moments with pistols, on either a Light Assault or a Stalker Infiltrator. Even with the starting pistols for them, they either shoot enough rounds out to overwhelm a target (TR), or just have a great, well balanced damage, fire rate, reload, and magazine (NC). The VS? We have the Beamer. The %^&*ing BEAMER. And the trend continues with every single VS pistol. The Manticore? Worse version of the Magshot, with less accuracy, lower fire rate, and slower reload time. The Cerberus? Cool as hell looking, but the reload speed and fire rate make this thing complete and utter suicide. A .76 TTK is absolutely worthless, and if you go up against a good player, they can turn and kill you WHILE YOU ARE SHOOTING THEM IN THE BACK. The Spiker? It's awful. It still has a 'fire delay' between bursts of about 75-115 ms, which the NC's Desperado and the TR's Repeater don't have. It also does less damage than both per magazine AND per second, and it has a secondary fire that serves absolutely no purpose. They could remove it and no one would be able to tell. The NS AutoPistol is going to be a 'band-aid' fix. It's gonna give the sidearm game a much needed 'range' option, all while making VS players finally, FINALLY have something else worth using than the ^%#&ing Commissioner or Underboss.
The issue, as I am reading, is people looking at what a weapon can't do, instead of what it can do. Then they are using those weapons in situations where they don't excel or blaming their own failures on the weapon. Good example TR AMP is Fantastic at ambushing. If player is unable to open properly and dump bullets into the target maybe they picked a bad time to ambush?. If enemy begins moving and tracking becomes impossible (for them), let off the trigger and re-acquire the target instead of spraying bullets into the walls. Also consider other options like quick knife since usually the target is super close to you if tracking becomes too difficult. Not all the weapons "SUCK" but at the same time using something like a Beamer up close against a Revolver is not ideal. If you did use the beamer up close you would want to favor circumstances where it works best. Enemys back is turned you are being highly mobile, or you are putting cover between you and them. The Revolver is going to take advantage of synergy with knife, and headshot openers. However unless the players aim is wonderful revolver is going to fall flat against more mobile targets. I personally feel we need to extend the reach of semi auto - single shot weapons so they become more interesting at medium ranges. TLDR: I agree some tweaks are necessary...obviously, necessary to the point a revamp should happen similar to LMGs. I can't just help but feel like people are NOT looking at the weapons strengths and weaknesses. They maintain their own "playstyle" and get mad when weapon doesn't support it. Instead of adapting to using the weapon where it excels they take risks where the weapons won't perform best and get wrecked then call the weapon trash ignoring all the other benefits it offers.
I fully agree that the weapons DO fill a niche, but, compared to their 'counterparts' with the TR and NC, the only reason you'd score a kill in a stand-up fight against one is if your opponent is brain-dead. Maybe it's just me, but, while I don't want each faction specific pistol to be just a re-skin of each other, I DO want them to each shine at their own personal niches. For the VS, the TR and NC versions of each broad archetype just simply do it better.
What is the point of disabling the primary slot if the secondary slot is going to get weapons that have the same functions as a primary?
Rambling about power creep: In my mind secondaries have less overall kill potential due to limited ammo capacity, and generally speaking tend to be weaker then a primary. Commi / Uboss being arguably trend breaking in that regard. Namely because they can make at least one kill with shots left over in reserve allowing more room for error, and the reload time isn't a big deal. Very little drawback for using a revolver. However If the reload time on these weapons was tweaked to be slightly longer there would be more risk to using them. If the COMMY also took longer to equip, similar to how the crossbow does, there would be more risk in using it. Frankly though both revolvers do not carry any meaningful drawbacks. In contrast other secondaries do maintain negative aspects for the benefits they provide. The Low mag size of the blackhand and long reload forces you to disengage. You could look at the crossbows projectile velocity , reduced headshot multiplier of 1.5x, and chamber time between each shot, and 4 bolt maximum, and understand full well why its a secondary weapon. It also takes twice as long to equip a crossbow then other secondaries which prevents a reactionary whip it out and gib someone when jumped. Id like to see this added to the Commy since it is huge so it should take a bit longer to equip and by that logic probably the blackhand too. Most of the faction specific sidearms are old, and balanced for a time when certain things didn't exist. SMGs, Barons, Revolvers, Power Knives ect. Games changed and in cases like the Beamer its function was pushed back farther away from where it was originally envisioned. Its still useful, but not as it once was during launch. It really wouldn't hurt to do a pass on all the sidearms...
One problem I think the TR have is they don't really have a shock and awe factor. Like the NC have railguns, and burst shoguns, and have a cool ascetic and their guns sound boss as ****. VS have lasers, plasma, cool particle effects and animations for their guns, ect. What does the TR have? A tank with 2 guns, a minigun, and standardize 40 round magazines. Balance and all that aside. I never feel like the TR have anything special about them. Nothing about them makes them feel unique. And when they do get a toy that's actually different, NS get something similar, thus defeating the whole point. As beaver said, TR just seems like it's beta testing things for everyone else to have. I think the devs need to seriously look at the TR or VS (They are closer to each other then either is to the NC) and change some things about, because the TR doesn't feel unique or powerful (aesthetically). You just feel like a grunt from a modern military shooter. I get that the TR are the "we stick with the old ways" faction, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't seem powerful, and really that's excuse for them to have weapons that ARE different from ours. Like they have refined our modern weapons to a point that though they look similar and a IRL soldier could pick it up and figure out how to work it. Like an AI mortar that fires a projectile till you trigger it again, then immediately launches a explosive, or shrapnel down on the enemy's head. Ideal for blowing people out of cover and fortified areas. A 1216 style shotgun, with 3 of the tubes having standard buckshot while also carrying a tube of slug for each reload. When I'm playing my NC or VS alts, I never feel like the TR have any weapons that make them standout as a unique or a signature weapon that everyone can identify on the battlefield. This whole NS getting our toys is just salt on the wound.
I am mostly with your argument but i really have to correct you. The Vs Pistols are not bad.....but the other Factions Pistols are just better https://ps2model-axiom.rhcloud.com/#dps/la/1/13/7413/7412/12 This is a side where you can compare the Pistols.... as you can see, the Repeater overperforms EVERY VS Pistols with ease. The Ideal DMG/sec, Simple TTK and the Damage (multiplied by 3 Because of burst) are better then ALL the OTHER. And you as Infiltrator (as i know and like you ) should be aware that the better the TTK (Time To Kill) is, the faster you can kill the target and lesser be destealthed. Even when you increase the Skill of the Player in the "simple TTK" you still will peform better with the Repeater then ALL the VS Pistols... Also you don't have to run burst only with the TX1 Repeater, you can singleshot too and the makes it to a perfect allrounder. Screw Spiker, TR got Repeater. Screw Beamer, TR got Repeater. Screw Manticore, TR got Repeater. Screw Cerberus, TR got Repeater. AND we are not even done yet! Comparing all Pistols togheter with that very usefull site i posted, we can make out clearly winners! First place Repeater Second place Emperor Third place Desperado And then there is the Underboss.......... ...............and where are the VS? SOMEWHERE OVER THE RAINBOW And all that bothers me.... (I hope you don't take it too seriously )
lol....this thread over a silly pistol....I could not imagine if we started talking about something serious....like how to wear underwear in our infy suits
