[Suggestion] Nerf is a four letter word. How to fix (nearly) every aspect of flawed gameplay in PS2

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by TammelTR, Nov 9, 2014.

  1. TammelTR

    Higby himself said he wants to foster an environment where the combined arms aspect of the game is more integral, unfortunately his idea for doing so is actually going to result in the opposite. The reduced lethality of everything across the board is going to lead to compartmentalization of the combined arms, and we will see a game where air, tanks, and infantry hardly meet and instead just perform an awkward dance around one another. We already very close to such a sad state.

    So let's step back and look at why these issues presented themselves in the first place, why on earth was the need to nerf everything into the ground ever brought forth? The answer is a lack of regulation. The inability or unwillingness of the devs to tell the player "no". What I mean by this is that from the start of the game every aspect of gameplay is available. Without spending a single cert point you have access to every vehicle, aircraft, and infantry class in the game. Furthermore the resource system is woefully incapable of policing this as to prevent spamming. The result of this availability is that it leads to only one available meta which is the zerg. Players are prevented from crafting their own niche because every weapon and tool in the game has been watered down to make it widely available. It creates a lackluster and boring experience and divides the game into two groups, the organized outfits who are trying to play the game as intended, and the rest of the population which is not at all being directed or policed to do so.

    So how do we begin to fix this mess we are in? The first step is to completely rethink how a player fits into the game, and to do away with the current way classes are available. Think about it, when your platoon leader sees an enemy sunderer he orders everyone to pull HA and fire rockets, when he needs to push a well defended base he orders you to pull a tank, air a problem? Pull an ESF... Essentially spam. Players have no identity within the game, they are treated as amorphous entities designed to conform to every situation and be everything all the time. It's disheartening. No one has a niche, a specialty, a job... they just become part of the wave, never being called on to serve a special purpose.

    The solution?

    Phase 1- Players choose one and only one class per character and the switching of classes is done away with. This will ensure that you are a valuable asset at every encounter because you are performing a function that not everyone else can.

    Phase 2- Add depth to each class via a cert tree so that they can specialize within their class to perform either one job extraordinarily well, or be flexible and do okay in multiple roles.Simultaneously changing some current gameplay mechanics to better suit this new system. For example the ability to spot enemy soldiers will require a cert investment and only be available to assault and infiltrator. And finally, make it so that there is a cert cap and a player can never fully cert every option in the class.

    Phase 3- Reduce the number of weapons available across the board. We don't need so many copy/paste guns. And make Longer range weapons more effective.

    Phase 4- Increase the differences between each faction and remove all NS equipment.

    Phase 5- Make everything more deadly! Reduce ttk, buff aoe damage.

    Detailed explanations will follow, but there are the basics. By giving players the ability to fall into a niche instead of forcing them to be everything, we can increase the lethality and effectiveness of everything because none of it will be spammed. This increase in lethality will allow everyone to feel effective in their chosen roll.

    Phase 1 in detail-

    Classes will be as follows:

    (Pilot): This class is about the only one which is capable of accessing any vehicles beyond the flash. Their cert tree is divided into two major categories: ground and air. They start with access to the harasser, Valkyrie, and whatever vehicle has the AMS, currently the sunderer. Every other vehicle requires a cert investment to gain access to, MBTs and ESFs requiring the highest investment.

    Their access to equipment is limited to Smgs and pistols for weapons, and a less effective repair kit.

    (Engineer): The only other class to have access to any vehicle other than the flash, the engineer also gains access to the AMS vehicle. The engineer's role is to repair and maintain allied vehicles and MAX suits while keeping the infantry well supplied with ammunition. The engineer is also invaluable when it comes to situations requiring explosives as it is the only class capable of using c4 and vehicle mines.

    Through use of the cert tree the engineer can specialize towards a more vehicle supportive role or one in which s/he supports infantry or specializes in demolitions.

    The engineer has access to Shotguns and pistols for weapons.

    (Assault) Equipped with middle-ground armor, this is the class that opens up the way for the heavy assault. Making use of their accurate assault rifles and battle rifles, they suppress the enemy from mid range allowing the iron fist that is the heavy assault to advance. Along with infiltrator, has the ability to spot and relay enemy positions.(no longer a global cross-class ability). They alone have access to under-barrel grenade launchers allowing them to lob grenades a great distance to break up infantry positions and support their faction's advance.

    Assault has access to Assault Rifles, Battle Rifles, pistols, and under-barrel grenade launchers.

    Assault is the only class able to gain the training necessary to pilot a max suit.

    (Heavy Assault): The front line soldier, wearing the thickest armor and packing the most lethal weapons it is the heavy assault's job to combat enemy infantry and handle threats of enemy armor. The HA will be able to specialize into a role that enables it to perform very well in engaging enemy foot soldiers, or one that is more suited to anti-armor/MAX roles. The only class with access to their empires specific heavy weapons and rocket launchers, they are the icon of the battlefield.

    Through the cert tree the HA will be able to tailor their specialty towards either an anti-Infantry role, or an anti-armor role, but not both. The HA will lose it's ability to have both a primary weapon and an RL, and instead must choose which one to roll with, though through the cert tree two weapons may be equipped but it comes with a cost.

    The HA has access to Shotguns, Light machine guns, Heavy weapons, Rocket Launchers, and Pistols.

    (Medic): It is the job of the medic to heal and revive allied soldiers as well as provide means to increase sustainability in a battle. Through their cert tree they will have the ability to specialize into a role that focuses on healing and revival or one that forgoes some efficiency in that realm to increase the sustainability and supporting powers.

    Medic has access to Assault rifles, Shotguns, Smgs, and pistols.

    (Light Assault): The fast moving and highly maneuverable class designed to breach enemy lines and cause havoc. The light assault is built for speed and will be able to specialize in either fast and sustained travel, or short bursts of speed with more breaching and lethal potential. Along with the infiltrator will be able to hack terminals and devices though more slowly. Has access to proximity mines

    LA has access to SMGs, Shotguns, and pistols.

    (Infiltrator): The class that is either far back popping heads with sniper rifles or deep in enemy lines hacking and causing chaos, this class will be able to specialize into either role via it's cert tree. Has the ability to spot enemies. Has access to proximity mines

    Infiltrators have access to Sniper Rifles, Smgs, and pistols.

    (A quick word on maxes): The cost to pull them should be high and come with a significant cooldown, that combined with the fact that only one class can pull them now will allow for them to actually be effective and not so pathetically squishy. First and foremost, the max is now immune to small arms fire with the exception of headshots which will retain its current resistance rating. Furthermore each faction max should be able to perform better and be more unique.

    Quick fix one- remove charge from tr and nc, it is now the vanu ability, no more zoe.
    Quick fix two- NC maxes lose the ability to have two weapons equipped but can now shoot while their riot shield is active.

    I have a lot of ideas for maxes too but I don't want to get into the level of detail that exists in my head because this post is already getting longer than most would care to read. This is just a sample to show the direction things should go in.

    Phase 2- The cert tree: The cert tree is going to be like a skill tree much like an rpg or something similar. It will branch out into varying specialties and in order to advance through one branch you must have spent enough points in it to unlock the next certification. They will be class specific and focus on transforming your character into an effective soldier who specializes in their chosen role. Engineers for example can choose to specialize in a tree that makes them wonderful at infantry support, it will allow them to gain access to an effective AI turret(which through different certs will grant it a shield, increase RoF, reduce cool down, etc), place ammo packs that either regenerate standard ammo or rockets(not both), their repair tool will be more effective at repairing maxes, etc.

    When designing these trees it is important to think about making the player specialize and dividing what we already have and making players choose. Ammo packs for example currently rearm all munition types. It shouldn't be this way, with specialization we create more dependency on our faction mates, and allow the individual to serve a vital purpose at the same time.

    Furthermore with this system each weapon type available to a given class will have it's own certifications. For example if an engineer chooses to specialize in shotguns then by investing certs into the shotgun branch he should be able to reduce reload time by a small margin, decrease recoil slightly, etc. This will allow players to specialize and will reward them for using their favorite weapon.

    Finally with a cert tree and class system like this we can add a bit more flavor to the mix in the form of special abilities related to preferred weapons. For example one of the abilities in shotgun specialization might be concussive shells. This ability allows the player to carry one magazine of this special ammunition type that when fired applies the concussive effect in the area it targets. While non-lethal, it could prove to be an invaluable team aid. Another option could be anti-max rounds that cause an emp effect and limit the function of the max suit until another player with a rocket launcher can move in and kill the max.

    I have many ideas for each class cert tree, but I would like the developers to start thinking along these lines. I am happy to provide a detailed class and tree description if it's requested by them however.

    Phase 3- Within each category of weapon create one faction unique weapon. One faction specific, shotgun, AR, SMG, LMG, etc. Just one to start. And this one weapon should scream TR, NC, or VS. Take the time to create truly unique heavy weapons. Also develop the faction battle rifles and make them more effective. Long range weapons such as the Assault rifle, battle rifle, and sniper rifle should be much more effective and actually able to engage targets effectively at range. With an across the board(all weapons in game) increase in lethality along with accuracy tweaks, and reducing damage drop off of these weapons, an assault rifle should be able to burst down a lightly armored class at 100 meters with 4-7 shots.

    As it stands now the TR and NC traits are well defined and by and large their guns encapsulate them. There are exceptions of course because right now there are just too many guns and things have gotten messy. The big problem right now is that the VS are existing in a state of borrowing from the other two factions in traits and rarely ever seem to get anything unique. They exist in the gaps... so make them masters of the gaps. Make their weapon trait a configurable power core that can increase RoF at the expense of damage or vice versa(this will of course also effect accuracy and will take some testing to get working effectively and fairly). They can never achieve the raw damage output of the NC or the dakka dakka of the TR, but their adaptability should allow them meet either in fair contest.

    Phase 4- Wherever there is an NS vehicle or weapon, create something faction specific and remove the NS blight. NS needs to be done away with, it is used as a crutch for balance and it makes the game bland.

    Phase 5- Reduce the ttk on everything. Across the board, make everything more lethal. Make anti infantry weapons obliterate infantry, make anti-armor weapons cut through tanks like a hot knife through butter. Bring down the walls between the combined arms aspect and allow them all to play together. In a game of this magnitude tactics and positioning should count more than the ability to adadadad and plink heads. This game doesn't have the stability to be an arena style shooter with an insane skill cap and it needs to stop trying to be. With the above changes all implemented the reduced ttk will not break the gameplay experience because with a specialized class system there will be no need to nerf in order to counter spam and zerging. Every player will fill their chosen role, and thanks to reduced ttk will actually feel effective in that role. And because they know from the start that they cannot do everything or counter all comers they will not feel cheated when they die.

    When all of this is done we can start talking about the terrain and base design issues which are atrocious, but start with the above first SOE. Do this and you'll reach and go beyond your ten year goal with this game, do it not and you'll milk it for maybe another three before people lose interest.
    • Up x 1
  2. Ribero

    TL;DR:
    • One Class per Character.
    • Class revamps.
    • A Skill (Cert) Tree per Class, with a Skill (Cert) cap.
    • Shorter TTK on everything.
    • Buff AoE damage.
    • One type of each Empire Specific Primary Weapon (As in, One TR AR, one TR SMG, One NC AR etc).
    • No more NS weapons.
    • Make long range engagements matter.
    • Emphasise and revamp Empire Specific Traits.
    + Reasoning behind the changes.


    Some things I like, some things I don't. Overall it's not for me, thanks.
    • Up x 5
  3. patrykK1028

    How many words are there in this wall?
    I appreciate your effort, but... Im not going to read that all.
  4. Ribero


    2418 words, I think.
    • Up x 1
  5. DG-MOD-04

    Please keep all posts constructive and true to the original topic. If the thread starts constructive, you can too.

    Thanks!
    • Up x 2
  6. OldCuban

    Very well thought out post OP.

    But sadly those kind of changes would involve an almost complete rewrite of the game.

    And at this stage, that's just not going to happen.

    I do like the ideas though. They would fit more with the mmo aspect of it being an mmofps.

    Reminds me of what Titan from Blizzard was supposed to be, before it got dumbed down to Overwatch, which is just a TF2 clone.

    I'd love to see a sci-fi MMOFPS with the setup you detailed.
  7. TammelTR

    I don't think it would be quite as intensive as that, but even if it were... SOE has proven they don't mind completely changing their existing titles, this time it would just be for the better.
    • Up x 1
  8. Alan Kalane

    You want specialization? Specialization is what kills this game!
    I'll tell you how people who specialize in one thing end up:

    -Infiltrator: people who specialize in the infiltrator class (this is the majority) have next to no AV capabilities and limited anti-infantry options. Because instead of buying an G2A launcher for 250 certs and fighting that air zerg they prefer to spend 1000 certs on a new sniper rifle or an SMG.

    -Light Assault: Suicide C4 bombers. Every time I see a LA in the middle of an open field where he has no height advantage I can't help but laugh. It's funny to see the fairies run straight at your tank, granting you free certs.

    -Engineer: Mostly spawncampers. These players enjoy shelling spawnrooms with HE. If they can't do it for some reason they would rather sit in their precious tank being useless outside the base than join the assault as infantry.They play extremely safe. If they run out of resources they would just sit at the warpgate until they can spawn another vehicle.

    -Medics: Usually I really enjoy the company of a medic, but not in a tank battle in the middle of an open field!

    -Heavy Assault: Actually, this is probably the only class that is usefull in almost every situation.

    -MAX:Just like Engineers, they play extremely safe, because if they run out of resources they will have run in circles at the warpgate for the next few minutes!

    Personally I prefer versatility. I buy only the things I really need and that are cheap enough to afford them. I still use some of the default guns, because those are usually the best guns in the game. Things like A2G lock-ons(250certs),G2G lock-ons(250c), bolt action for VS/TR(100c), lightning HEAT cannon(250c),spawn beacon(30c),AV mines(200c),medkit(50c) and weapon upgrades. That's all you need. For a total of 1130 certs plus some certs for weapon and ability upgrades to a decent level (~1000c) you can be very competitive in pretty much everything.
  9. WTSherman

    Hmm. There's some good and bad here. It'll be hard to really break it down and give a thorough explanation, but I'll take a swing at it.

    This isn't really necessary. As long as the class abilities are adequately structured so that a having a well thought-out class composition on the field is important, there's no reason not to let people change classes. Sure you can all go HA, the trick is making it so that the all-HA team will generally lose to the balanced team.

    Primarily this would require doing away with the HA's "kill everything class" status, and nerfing or removing medkits so that the medic actually has a job.

    Yes, more detailed branching of class abilities would be nice. No, restricting spotting to just LA/Infil is not the way to do it. You could, however, allow those two classes to have more persistent spots (the map icon lasts longer), have a more generous spot cone (so they can spot things more quickly with less duds), and perhaps give them tools like laser designators that, perhaps, allow lock-ons to lock lased targets more quickly or at extended range.

    Similarly, different repair tools that specialize in repairing certain things faster than others (say one that's good at base turrets, another that's better for tanks), or medic tools that specialize more towards healing/reviving (one heals in a good size cone but revives slowly with less range, another revives faster and at longer range but is slow at healing) would be nice.

    The cert cap isn't particularly necessary as long as you avoid large amounts of *vertical* progression. You can only have one loadout equipped at a time anyway, so at any given time you will still be strictly better so long as there aren't any loadouts that are strictly better in all situations.

    Less copypasta would be nice. Though I'd prefer if they work to diversify and clearly define weapon roles with existing weapons, we should try to avoid removing a weapon outright unless there's just no way to give it a good role.

    Creating a pilot class would definitely help reduce vehicle spam, and would remove cheese like ESF LAs or HA suicide tanks.

    I would still keep MAX as its own class rather than making it a cert tree on another class, though it might not particularly matter much if people are still allowed to change classes anyway as per my earlier point.

    I'd define "heavy assault" and "assault" differently, the former being a strictly anti-tank/anti-air class (probably even renamed to reflect their anti-vehicle role) and the latter being the infantry fighting class. Equipment would be adjusted as appropriate.

    This means that if you're fighting vehicles and the enemy sends in a wave of infantry, some people are actually going to have to change class.

    I'd give Engineers SMGs in addition to shotguns. And/or carbines, you forgot carbines.

    I've really got a bad feeling about giving prox mines and hacking to LAs. Also buff Triage on medics.

    How about we don't nerf the NC max's damage by 50% across the board. Because that's really unnecessary. Also considering MAXes are much smaller targets than typical vehicles and can go inside buildings, their small arms vulnerability is pretty important.


    Here I think it's important to re-iterate that we should avoid vertical progression where possible. BR1s have enough trouble learning the game as it is, they don't need to deal with people who also simply have more baseline power than them too. When you gain something, you should be losing something else.

    A good way to achieve this is to make sure that new players start off with a good complete loadout in every class and vehicle (no empty slots). This way anything you get is replacing something else. Each weapon should also come with a set of default attachments (scope/barrel/rail/ammo, as available).

    This way instead of attachments being a strict upgrade over the stock weapon, any attachment you get is replacing something you already have.

    It would be nice to see people face-tanking less bullets. Nerfing or removing medkits would help, encourage people to actually use medics. However, for VS keep in mind that DPS isn't the end-all be-all of balance. Accuracy, control, and utility matter too.

    Here you just seem to be repeating 3. I will say though that I'd like a little more faction flavor in MBT main guns too. TR kind of already has the dakka dakka thing down, so they're good to go.

    VS probably needs something to make it more unique than just "halfway between NC and TR". Maybe their shells can have a small after-burn damage (similar to being on fire, but without the speed reduction and also works on infantry/MAXes). Not enough to give them a big DPS advantage, but instead it's there to delay NAR/shield regen by a few seconds. Trust me, that will piss people off to no end even if VS players fail to realize the usefulness (like they do with most of their toys). For example, enemy shields still being down when you fire the second shot.

    NC needs to be moved further away from VS: 210/190/125 direct damage (AP/HEAT/HE) and 0.25s of reload just doesn't really set them apart. Maybe increase the reload to around 5-6s, while increasing damage by a similar 25-50% to keep DPS the same. Then increase both the damage and radius of Vanguard HE/HEAT's splash, so that it's not a complete joke against infantry. Bump Vanguard HEAT splash back up to 1000 1m/1 5m, make HE be 1300 2m/1 8m. They're only going to get one shot every 5-6 seconds, that shot might as well count.

    Note that this would make Vanguard HE still slightly weaker than a frag grenade.
  10. _itg

    You've got some interesting ideas, but I'm comfortable saying these changes would make the game worse. The fact is, gameplay would get stale if you were locked into one class, and much fewer people would be willing to play support classes like engineer. But of course, people would respond to this by logging out and switching characters, so what have you really accomplished, other than to make the game more inconvenient for everybody?

    You haven't thought through the changes to make to MAXes enough. I like the concept of small arms immunity except for headshots, and I think that could become a well balanced, flavorful concept. But removing charge from TR and NC to make it the VS ability is massively unfair without a total rework of the TR and NC abilities. Your suggestion for NC is a second massive nerf, because the riot shield loses a lot of value when the MAX is already immune to small arms fire, and this absolutely ruins slugs on NC MAXes, which are their only legitimate option for range.

    I don't see why you want to reduce TTK across the board. Don't you realize that players dying before they can react is one, if not THE biggest cause of complaints about weapons? The fact that you seem to WANT to remove skill from the game is also troubling.

    Finally, I can't figure out what any of this has to do with nerfs. Factions still need to be balanced in your version of PS2, and explosive spam might be limited somewhat by compartmentalizing players, but it would be no less annoying when it happens.
  11. TammelTR

    It is the most necessary, without it the spam continues. People should not be allowed to go from a sniper to an anti tank HA. With class restriction it enables people to actually fill a role, and be eager to do so. Balance cannot be achieved because when classes are not restricted the only response is an over-response. Sundy under fire? we all go engi and repair it faster than the enemy can dps it down, etc.

    Spotting is a bit of a broken mechanic, it completely nullifies camo and is entirely too easy to spam. Restricting it to just two classes reduces the cheese factor of it while encouraging snipers and people in good position to spot for their allies. Tool assisted spotting is actually something I had thought of, but that level of detail is wasted at this point in time.

    I see what you're saying here, but we should remove all but the basics then add in weapons with defined rolls rather than leaving them in and trying to find a place.


    I think it is important to retain a tankier heavy weapons class, through the cert tree their role as AI or AV would develop.

    The damage nerf won't be so bad with the reduced ttk across the board and by enhancing the NC max ability to tank effectively it puts into a more NC flavored role as an infantry tank. The small arms vulnerability makes current max suits all too easy to dps down, they shouldn't take any damage from small arms unless there is an ammo type designed to harm them.


    There is nothing wrong with vertical progression when the basic equipment can be just as deadly and fill an effective role. Just because a level 1 pilot couldn't pull an MBT it doesn't mean he cant be highly effective in a harasser.

    People like some level of vertical progression in games with rpg characteristics. This game needs more of it.


    In my mind tank HE shells should be three times the radius of frag grenades but have next to no effect on armor. The idea of increasing lethality across the board is to actually make things useful, so quoting weapon stats isn't really useful in this conversation.
  12. TammelTR

    Most people generally stick to one class as it is, but are opportunists and switch to certain classes to gain advantages in situations. Like LA c4 fairies for instance. The idea is to make each class a rewarding and in depth experience that removes the staleness of the current system where no one feels like they're making an impact or doing anything.

    Maxes will take a lot of consideration, but are the least of it right now.

    People dying before they can react is a part of any fps, they can and will get over it. With a class restricted system however the spam and farming aspects will be reduced. The bottom line though is that tactics and positioning should play a larger role in this sort of game than individual "skill". It takes skill to maneuver behind the enemy front without detection and position for an effective flank too, but the current system favors twitch reflex. That is a mistake because this is not an arena shooter, but a tactical combined arms game.

    It has everything to do with nerfs. I explained that upfront. The reaction to every effective weapon or vehicle is to nerf it. The constant nerfing is why there is so much compartmentalization. The opposite of combined arms.
  13. Fatal_Finn

    I think reduced lethality is a good thing as long as it doesn't go too far. Can't bring the target down on your own -> co-op with other player. I mostly like how the game is now. If weapons were more lethal, massive battles would be just a diefest and everyone would camp to stay alive longer.

    It's true that the current gameplay encourages ganging up on the enemy but if you think it a bit, you'll notice that it's pretty much the same with every game/gamemode where you conquer bases by capturing the control point. That's why I think the problem is the bases. Every one of them have a capture point and a spawn. Even removing spawns from some captureable bases would make room for more tactical gameplay.
    But you have to remember that not all players seek for a tactical experience. There's a reason why ppl play this and not Arma, for example. Like me, I usually log in just to have fun and experience epic and heated battles. The current PS2 fulfills my needs really well.

    I don't really like that "cert tree" idea. For me this game is still more of a fps than mmorpg. People can already choose what to carry and what not, why make it more complicated? I personally find all skilltrees really oppressive. I like to build my character just the way I want, not to choose the way from a tree and possibly pay to reset the tree to try a different playstyle.

    Only thing I really agreed with OP is this:
    Also got some suggestions of my own:
    - Medics should gain more exp from restoring player's health and gain a bit less exp from reviving someone. Too often I get ignored by medics because they gain more exp for waiting me to die and then reviving.

    - Make HA shield absorb less damage from normal infantry weapons. Always wondered why any infantry class should have such an advantage over other classes. LMG + rocket launcher is heavy enough.

    - Remove the option to change class at sunderers, only allow to customize the class player is using at the moment. Class changes should be left for base spaws only. There could also be some sort of waiting time between class changes. Like "Class change completed in 10 seconds".
    • Up x 1
  14. EIMR

    While I appreciate the effort put on this, and I find it quite interesting, I think that your views are quite radical.

    Phase 1 is ridiculous. In a game with 5 classes(or 7 as you propose), choosing only one is too restrictive. While I do also think that we need to specialize instead of everybody being master of all trades, your idea is too much.

    Phase 2, the Cert tree, is quite a good idea, the only problem being it's emphasis on vertical progression. What I think is that instead, we start with more general roles, and then spread out. You can be Jack of all Trades, being able to change depending on the situation. You may be an ultra-specialized infiltrator who is feared across Auraxis. You may also specialize in two classes, such as medic and engineer.
    Instead of vertical progression, we get horizontal progression as I said earlier. You get some certs and revive faster, but thenyou can't buy regen. As you have limited certs, you can't get everything. That happens already, but I suggest a cert ceiling. You can get at most, say, 10k certs, and you can only change them weekly. The problem is balancing it for newbs. My suggestion is that they start with a generic set, and then we improve the questionary and give a specialized set, so they have spent 2000 certs. Then, at 10000 certs, you can sell the generic sets. That means of course even more specialization, but at the cost of the other classes.

    I agree with Phase 3 and 4, but not 5. The high ttk differentiates us from other games and gives much more room for strategy, and making it lower would give me soo many weapon locks.

    BTW, format it better. I can't see where the phases start and end unless I read it, and that's tiring.
  15. Cest7


    Sry I only got this far. My first though was Heros & Generals which has the same progression system you stated. Honestly, its long, boring and bland. The game would have to be completely re-worked to facilitate this system, something the current dev team cannot undertake.
  16. WTSherman

    The thing is though, sometimes that is actually the appropriate response. Different situations sometimes call for different class compositions, and it would kind of suck if you needed to get people's IRL phone numbers so you could call them and tell them to log in when you need air support.

    Difference of opinion I guess. I understand it can be annoying for sneaky classes, but if I do catch someone sneaking I like being able to tell my friends. Maybe if SOE fixed the voice comms so they weren't constantly breaking, and find a way to encourage people to use them but not abuse them.

    I suppose if maybe they couldn't equip the LMG and RL at the same time (introduce encumbrance? :p ) it would be alright. Maybe find a way to make the LMG work as more of an actual squad support weapon instead of an extended-magazine AR.

    That 50% hit is still huge. Especially when you consider the MAX's other roles. Have you ever tried to shoot down aircraft with a single Burster? Ever tried to kill a tank with a single Falcon?

    No. If there's anything this game doesn't need more of, it's vertical progression.

    It's kind of BS that a high BR LA's jets last 60% longer than stock, and recharge faster to boot. Starting off with no suit slot at all is lame. Level 1 medic guns are a bad joke. Vehicles starting with all empty slots sucks: a certed enemy vehicle literally has more speed, more acceleration (racer), more DPS, and more HP (extra armor, fire suppression, NAR) than you.

    We don't need more of that BS.

    While a 20m blast radius on my Vanguard HE would be hilarious, I imagine infantry players might have a hard time swallowing that much extra lethality. :D
  17. Prudentia

    I don't know what your problem is? i get specificly called for my primary role all the time.
    cause even in an Outfit consisting of BR100 the number of people who have a certed Skywhale AND want to fly it is still low.
  18. TammelTR

    An incredibly isolated incident that holds no relevance to the points being made.
  19. Prudentia

    ? I'm a very good Skywhale pilot who will always deliver his troops to the destination. the single squad i'm transporting can do more for a base fight than a full platoon of pubbies.
    the thing this game really needs is better communication between players. hell, the best time i ever had was during the Time when VS pop on Miller was at maximum 24% and the TVA was stronger than ever. faction wide communication gives squads roles that they are required to do to ensure the victory of their faction. there is no need for gamemechanics to lock playstyles completly, all they need to do is improve ingame diplomacy between factions.
    (and nerf the VS again so i can farm the overpop noobs again)
  20. Auzor

    And here I thought my posts were long XD.
    I've had to read parts twice and: no.

    In a mmorpg, you can have a skilltree cap, or a level cap, gear cap.... Whatever.
    This is still a shooter. The game mechanics limit what you can do, but thats it.

    In an mmo rpg, fixed classes work. One plays a tank, one a healer, one a dps, Fine.
    But, you dont run into an enemy player inside a tank that only a RL can plink some damage at. In an mmorpg you are never that hardcountered by another player.
    You dont run around as a healer worried that the enemy will bring an airzerg and lolpod the f out of you.
    In your approach, that healer cant switch to heavy for AA, cant spawn a skyguard...

    You would also suddenly need to refund all the vehicle unlocks people bought and now decide 'this char is not a pilot'. This char cant be a max, refund class specific weapon purchases etc.

    Now, how fun will it be to have a few heavies, a medic and 2infiltrators at a base, win The defense, and then realize none of you can pull a vehicle, none of you can drop ammo,... So now at least one of you needs to relog to transport the group to the next base.

    Next issue: you deliberately make the game more vertical, by requiring certs to unlock an mbt. I suppose the pilot class goes flash till then...
    The game is vertical enough, with a br100 getting extra armor, high level chassis, specialized vehicle weapons etc.
    Again, a shooter, more than an rpg.
    Weapons are supposed to be sidegrades and all that.

    I realize I dont put alternative proposals here, but I've posted plenty of small-scale suggestions already, posted on things like base design that remain important etc..
    Imo the class system works fine as is.