Nanoweave 5 versus Nanoweave 1

Usually it is the 'scrubs' that all have 10% Nano weave for that 1 cert expenditure. I find the vets use more grenades to greater effect to warrant the bandolier, more rockets, use cover better to utilize the capacitor or have a full nano cert for the 15% above the 'scrub'.

Then again that is just what I am seeing.

To summarize this, versus explosives:

Nanoweave 5 gives you 1125 health
Flack Armor 5 gives you 1333 health

The difference is even bigger if you include HA overshields.

Haha! Oh wow, that's rich. You really don't have any solid arguments do you?

Like I said - I don't have to work hard to make my point... Nanoweave makes it for me.

I think the point is that NW (while not leaps and bounds ahead of the others), is still obviously superior to the other suit choices and makes it feel like it's not even a choice.

Easy there kitten, put away the claws. I was making an observation about 'scrubs'.

Is this is the part where you pretend that someone didn't just show that your math was horrid? When you screw up on something that is easily verifiable, the mature thing to do is to at least acknowledge that you made a mistake rather than claim that it doesn't matter. The discrepancy I pointed out shows that flak armor offers more than double the resistance against explosives. That's worth considering, as is taking extra grenades. The choice is not so cut and dry as you concluded that it was when you were relying on bad math, and you should probably reconsider your position.

Unless you're often finding yourself winning fights with less health than the boost from Nanoweave gave you, it's not often doing anything for you.

I will never change the grenade bandelier on my LA. The extra grenade getting me far more kills than an amour/shield upgrade for survivability.

I played ALOT since Beta and i'm sorry but i have to disprove what you said. ASC is alot better than NW in surviveabillity. I would never trade my ASC vs NW. NW saves you what? 1 bullet? so some 0.00..s time between the next bullet hits you. I prefer to hide a 2.5s shorter time behind a wall before my shields regenerate. Than i can go out and kill you with 2 shots because your shield hasnt regenerate at all!

All the suit choices kind of suck tbh.

I get they didn't want to leave new players stranded down the road, but making everything be useless except for a single one cert puchase is really not how to do that.

1 more bullet to die makes enough of a noticeable difference for me. It's not like the other options are any better anyway.

It's not as if a second grenade could clear a choke point, right?

It's not as if you ever use cover and therefore gain an advantage from having shield regen faster?

And you always have an engineer attached to you so ammo & rockets are never a concern.


People who only see one upgrade worth taking do nothing but show their ignorance to the advantages of the others. Especially when they claim NW is a constant advantage (the reality is that it's only an advantage when you don't have enough health to take the damage which is incoming, but you would have had enough if you had NW).

If I take 400 damage and don't even lose all my shield during a fight, how has NW helped in the slightest? It's just as situational.

Lol, HAHahahaha epic.
I thank you so much for showing this to me....
GREAT JOB BRO!
but somehow i feel very sorry for ppl that invested so much certs ... for nothing

I've even survived claymores that would otherwise have killed me with NW. It just suits my playstyle better than the other suit upgrades do.

I'm still pretty sure Buzz is right (and I hate it when that happens), even if flak protects you better against explosions, NW is still a base increase over all damage types, not just one. NW gives you better survivability over all simply because it isn't limited to a specific damage type.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but standing on a grenade, or getting a tank shell to the face, even with flak 5... you're still going to die, yes?

I think the point of this whole thread though, was that the cost:benefit ratio of the NW cert becomes increasingly awful as you cert up to NW5, to which I would agree.

You would have survived better with flack, as it reduces damage taken to both shield and health, whereas NW just adds to the health pool.

I am not saying NW is useless or that no one should take it. I'm fine with you using it. I'm saying it's not the be-all and end-all that some people claim.

I would've survived better? I'm not even exactly sure what that means, but personally I find NW more flexible and versatile than the more specialized flak armor. I get more often shot by bullets than explosives so NW still suits my playstyle better even if the difference is subtle in many cases.

But do I think NW should get buffed/nerfed? No. Overall it's still pretty well balanced.

Buzz is not complaining about the cost expenditure. He is complaining because there is a way to get 25% extra health in the game and he does not like it. Look through his other thread. It is not that he is looking to make the other options more viable for the cert expenditure, it is that he is asking for the nano weave to be removed entirely because it 'should not be in the game'.. The cost expenditure is a side note used to bolster his main agenda of getting NW removed entirely.

I'll start this by saying that I don't really care what happens to Nanoweave armor. I care more about people knowing exactly how the game mechanics work, so I never have to read a misinformed forum post.

Now, I do have rank 1 Nanoweave armor on all of my classes because, for one cert point, it gives you the most bang for your buck. If I had piles and piles of cert points to spend I'd only have Nanoweave armor on my Heavy Assault and one of my Light Assault load-outs. I'd agree that that first rank of Nanoweave is the most cost effective cert in the suit slot but I'm not sure that holds true if you're looking at fully upgraded suit mods.

In the first Modern Warfare game there were two perks that occupied the same slot: Stopping Power and Juggernaut. These two perks did the same thing but in opposite directions. Stopping Power made your gun kill one bullet faster, while Juggernaut made your character take one more bullet before dying.

The funny thing is that Juggernaut was almost universally hated and Stopping Power was never complained about. Probably because shooting at a player who had Juggernaut gave you a little icon telling you they had the perk and players then had something to associate with their death. While players never had any indication of whether another player was using Stopping Power.

Even funnier is the fact that Juggernaut was inferior to Stopping Power, despite all the hate it received. It was inferior because it only helped you when you were being shot at. Good players spend more time shooting at people than they do receiving bullets, hence their high kill/death ratios, so Stopping Power was vastly more useful to any competent player.

I bring up this example because it gives you an idea of how to value Nanoweave armor. Nanoweave armor is only helping you when you're avoiding death by one bullet. Count the number of times in a day that you survive a firefight with 1/5 of your green bar or less, those are the times the cert is actively helping you. If Nanoweave armor is the best choice for you those occasions will be more frequent than the number of times you take shield damage without dying, run out of ammo, die to explosives, or run out of grenades.

Compared to the other suit choices, I think it's incredibly newbie friendly that the best part of Nanoweave armor's effect is front-loaded into its first level and costs only one cert point. But I don't know if I believe Nanoweave outclasses the other choices, I'd have to see the numbers on Resist Shield. The only thing that really concerns me is that Nanoweave armor hurts slower firing weapons more than high RPM weapons. The gap can be as big as a 25% TKK increase for the slowest LMG and a 17% TTK increase for the fastest carbines and ARs.

Also, this ended up way longer than I intended.

That was more or less the point. The first level is good. The fifth... I'd have to know the stats for Resist Shield.

Smart players are going to get NW over everything else. There isn't any reason not to.

Want more ammo? Find and engineer.
Want more grenades? Go to a terminal.
Need shields? LOL just wait an additional 2.5 seconds, that's if you can get out of combat that is.
Flak armor? Hah! You get murdered by ordinance even with it.

I'll stick to my NW armor and that additional 25% health. Besides, I'm TR... our weapons don't fire too slow so that extra bullet isn't as noticeable to us. It's the NC that get screwed the most.

Enjoy being pigeon holed into high ROF weapons and NW if you want to stay competitive.