MAX's are ******

Why oh why are max suits that cost the same as a tank so bloody weak..in ps1 small arms fire did practically nothing...in ps2 you get killed in seconds to absolutely everything....
now they are adding mine killing aswell...
WHAT IS THE POINT IN BUYING A MAX?
i can stay locked down with m,y back to the wall with dual ai miniguns and still get my *** kicked by pew pew assault rifles...MAXES should be hard as nails and make me feel it...in this its like im wearing a suit made of butter.

People don't like cool stuff even if it's readily available to everyone.

They want balance (everything homogenised) so i expect this game to continue to get more and more generic until it loses it's touch and get's boring, on pc.

Even with the built-in 80% small arms reduction, a 143x30 automatic rifle will still do 858 damage if you let its owner unload its magazine (KA5 reduces this to 536), which can typically only take 2-4 seconds due to rates of fire. In any case, damage adds up, and the lack of mode switching for anti-armor ammunition means vulnerability has account for normal bullet damage only.

Coordinated point defense and room breaching. Skill will dictate how autonomous you can act as a MAX without ending up in too much danger. Also, it's the only source of AA that players do not have to purchase, unless they get really good with barrel elevation or rocket sniping.

Hum in my opinion, Maxes are just exosquelets which make soldiers able to carry weapons of incredible high weight.
A relatively thin armor has been added in order to protect the soldier.
Adding a thicker armor would make the Max unable to move.
Not sure that thinking Maxes are supposed to be tanky is the best option. Better have the idea that it brings you a damn heavy firepower but that you're still a vulnerable soldier with a relatively medium/high armor.

I'm not experienced with Maxes use. But i know that its effectiveness depends on taking cover or not, choosing the right timing, choosing the right targets in the middle of a crowd. You just cannot use it as a tank. I also like to use Auto rep suit. (Maybe i'm wrong with this last choice)

You're just wrong lol.

You're just wrong lol.

I would say it's a nice choice, i use autorepair too it's amazing how fast you recover and you're good to go if there is no engi aroud, i pretty much never use it it's too boring everytime i go on 20k+ killstreak sometime even drop it and go back to infantry... People using max in open field with 10 tank aroud or in a room with 20 ennemy and expect to be badass...

Fine be that way lol.

"Buff the max unit" thread?

I like that kinetic armour on a max now has a purpose. Beforehand you could run flak without pause for thought. Play max as a heavy heavy: that's what they're designed to be; not "infantry tanks".

I must admit though, seeing the anti-materiel rifle come in: well, if they'd just balanced maxes properly - as per any of the 10+ good suggestions over the last 3 years - then you wouldn't need a long range rifle / lancer substitute novelty. Going full circle, yes OP - more health makes sense, but not without changes the other way.

Double their toughness, half their damage, and remove their ability to be rezzed. That is how you fix MAXes imo. They are nothing more than walking coffins at this point, a death wish for anyone who steps into them. MAXes instead should be walking bullet sponges (in a good way, not the current bad way). Gotta breach a door? Let the MAX go first. They walk in, draw the "Aggro" so to speak, and while the enemy is focused on him? infantry runs in and guns them down.

In PS1 MAXs took a lot of damage, but gave out not so much damage.

In PS2 MAXs (AI especially) give out a lot of damage, but don't take so much.


Personally I think the PS1 way was much, much better as it allowed MAXs to act as melee tanks for breaching (soaking up damage with support), left them strong 1on1, but without making them kill farmbots.

My wildly inaccurate rule of thumb would be to increase PS2 MAXs toughness two-fold, but reduce their DPS by 50%.

It's hard to take a thread about how MAXes are so bad seriously ...

-Stigma

Probably because you don't use MAXes on a regular basis, or at all, since a lot of guys are convinced MAXes are only for cowards and terrible players.

Pretty much all you wrote there is correct, though perhaps I wouldn't use as harsh words.
I try to avoid pulling MAXes as much as I can - because when I do it honestly feels like I'm cheating.

You pretty much have to pull them in some cases just to deal with other MAXes though, unfortunately, but the infantry gameplay would no doubt be better if they didn't exist at all (or as you mentioned they were tweaked to be more tanky but a lot less deadly)

I don't see how this works as a counterargument though (if that was your intention).
-Stigma

No, my point was that of course you wouldn't understand, because you have no experience. You speak from an inherently biased view point of almost pure infantry, which as had been stated before, has damn near 10 different counters for MAXes and is getting even more. MAXes are NOT hard to kill, at all. Given the rarity at which they are pulled, I can almost bet that statistically speaking their death rate and time spent alive are horrendous compared to even most infantry players. MAXes are nothing more than Giant Neon Signs that scream "LOOK! SHOOT ME I'M REALLY BIG!" You would not believe how easy it actually is to die as a MAX, or how many different ways you can be killed. So you can laugh at the idea of buffing MAXes all you like, but the realities of a MAX are not so simple.

lol max suits are already OP as F

as an engie main, i spend most of my time repairing maxes. when i play max, i'm always surprised at how fragile they are. max kinetic armor seems to do little to stop you from dying, unless you have a pocket engie and a medic or two at your back. i do NOT think maxes need to be buffed, but people should stop whining about them being OP.

So your argument is that a MAX is underpowered against infantry? If so then I can't take that seriously.

I have enough experience in a MAX to know that when I pull one I vastly overpower other infantry. Even someone like me that doesn't use them much (by choice of conscience, not because I can't go on a rampage with them) finds it trivial to go on massive killing sprees with them. Despite tending to "go rambo" in a MAX rather than playing safe an conservative - my MAX KDR is several times higher then on any other class. Presumably the difference will be even higher for someone who uses MAXes as a primary or more regularly.

But hey, maybe my stats are an abberation. If you care to share your own then we could look at the SPM, KPM and KDR of the MAX compared to the other infantry classes. If your point is valid then your MAX scores should be significantly lower... but I would be very surprised if that was the case.

-Stigma

As someone with a fully certed MAX and 60 hours in it I can tell you that MAXes are, by far, the easiest thing to play in this game. The charge ability makes keeping a MAX alive trivially easy because it means that you are the fastest thing in an infantry fight in addition to being the toughest. I could give a trained chimp my account and the chimp would probably get at least a 50 kill streak before going down. That is how hard it is to kill a MAX.

Hyperbole aside, this is pretty much my experience of it too. Assuming that you play smart and conservative it's not very hard to rack up a 50-streak (trivial if you include resses in that formula). I could likely go replicate that right now - but doing the same with any other infantry class is pretty rare.

-Stigma