[Discussion] Obvious Weapon Imbalances Are No Secret

Hey everyone,

This is not meant to be a whiney imbalance thread, and if you have seen any of my other posts, you should know that I am an advocate of better AA, and the belief that aircraft are currently overpowered.

However, I want to point out a great example of drastic weapon imbalance, not versus eachother, to avoid an argument. The skyguard has long been known to be very ineffective against aircraft, which is what it is made for fighting.

However, has anyone ever used, or fought against a Vulcan? The vulcan is a chaingun mounted on top of a prowler. The weapon is similar to a liberator's main weapon, and can shred anything in seconds, including ESF's. Now, what I want to point out, is that the Vulcan is clearly more effective at destroying aircraft than even the Skyguard.

Why is this?

What do you guys think? Agree? Other examples? Disagree? If you disagree, please do explain why. Thanks.

So.. you write this post 4 hours after the Skyguard got a 2x damage buff.

Why?

And I've used the Vulcan a couple times. At first, due to it's rotary chaingun-like nature I assumed it was an anti infantry gun. It's not. It sucks against infantry. Later I learned that it shreads armor up.

The Vulcan is incredibly short-ranged though - the only aircraft you'll destroy are those dumb enough to hover at low altitudes.

Which update have you been reading? The latest patch notes states a 20% buff to flak damage (while also removing direct hit damage), not 100%!!!

hahahaahha oh wow.... no really

hahaahahahaa

Go to 1:20 - Oh, and if you're NC, bring some tissues...

Ah, you're right. I read the patch notes incorrectly.

OP the vulcans range is beyond pathetic. Have you even played with it, or did you just hover over one in an ESF and get destroyed?

That is possibly one of the worst vids ive watched in a while, hugely boring to watch. No offense mate. That is typical Magrider tactics, an not how to use a tank....

just about anyone can hit a stationary target

Agree. There is a double standard between aircraft and ground. Aircraft should be lethal to ground. Ground should only deter air.

Example. Skyguard cannon compared to the faction specific AA noseguns like the Vortek.

I've been stating in other threads that the lightning should be given an AA alternative to the Skyguard. That alternative is simple. Simply strap an ESF AA nosegun such as the Vortek to the turret. This weapon has the range, damage output, and accuracy to engage aircraft effectively. It has the capability to engage infantry effectively (AA weapons are historically extremely deadly against infantry in real life). It also isn't completely worthless against ground vehicles.

Any cries of OP for strapping the ESF nosegun to the lightning would be odd because:

1: ESF already have this exact same weapon and it is generally well accepted on ESF.
2: ESF have that weapon IN ADDITION to extremely potent secondary weapons.
3: ESF are far more mobile than the lightning, which allows them to maneuver into positions where the cannon is deadliest.
4: The lightning is approximately the same cost as an ESF.

I'd take one of these in a second - the only drawback would be how fast they ran out of ammo.

Unless you drastically increased the cone of fire, a Lightning with an ESF AA nosegun would be an incredible long-distance infantry farming tool. The AA rotaries (or the M18 at least) are accurate enough to be lethal against soldiers - they're only limited by the ESF being an unstable firing platform. You'd also be able to easily snipe turrets and MBTs from a distance that would be difficult using tank shells, keeping you safe from return fire.

As you say, this weapon is generally well accepted on ESFs - but if you put it on a Lightning you're removing some of the disadvantages that make it acceptable:
1. Aim instability - ESFs are always moving, even in a "hover". The constant small adjustments are magnified when aiming at a distant target, especially a small one. A Lightning can be stationary and aim precisely with the turret.
2. Fragility - you can take out an ESF with small arms, or a single tank shell will wipe out ~80% of its health
3. Low availability of ammo - probably minor, but there are far more ammo towers than air resupply pads

The Vulcan eats stuff up, but you have to be rather close to get hits on target. Or spend a lot of trigger time to get the hang of leading your target properly. I honestly think it's balanced; it does what it's supposed to do close up, and can be effective long range if the player is skilled.

post a video of you killing a tank from 800m in a prowler.

How? The Vulcan has the range of like 50-100m if that. Anything further it won't even register a hit... It's COF is also only good for armor at close range. If an ESF is coming that close to the prowler for it to get blown away, that is a dumb pilot. I guess you like to hover and get really close to the prowler?

A rotary on a lightning would be awesome... against stuff on the ground. Given the spread and lack of proxy detonation, I don't think you'd be shooting down many planes that weren't flying down your throat though. Not to mention you'd pretty much have to shanghai a sunderer with ammo to follow you everywhere.

1: Aircraft aren't that unstable. Especially when engaging other aircraft.
2: The lighting is far more vulnerable to destruction than an ESF. It may have more armor, but it is FAR less mobile. The ESF is a 100x more survivable platform.
3: Logically a tank based version would have more additional ammo for more reloads. It is a heavier platform, and lacks a secondary weapon.

It still would outperform the joke that is the skyguard by a significant margin. Again, I don't see why the tank can't carry additional reserve ammo for more reloads.

At what? It'd be an awful deterrent because you'd be lucky to scratch their paint at range, and if they're flying into your face it'd have the singular advantage that it isn't affected by their armour, but would otherwise do less damage to one than unloading the SG flak into it, and wouldn't have the added benefit of blinding them. And I don't care how much ammo you carry, you're going to run out, a lot.

Tell you what, next time you get warpgated by a large force, grab your ESF w/ rotary and hover inside trying to shoot planes flying out there.