A note to the devs regarding this last patch

On the ground you have lightnings and MBTs. Lightnings are pretty ****** on their own unless they find stragglers or pepper things at range. You want stuff done, you need a proper tank with a gunner.

ESFs are being herded toward flying lightnings and rightly so, thry cost the same and are a ONE man vehicle. You want to instagib things and take more than a few hits, get a friend and get in a lib.

ESF for it's cost, dual armament, crew requirement, flexibility and versatility cannot sit so effortlessly at the top of the foodchain. Unless you wanma just give all vehicles magburn, vamguard shield and link both weapons to 1 driver. Because that's what ESF whiners sound like.

I have no idea what the hell you are on about. The game is F2P and not P2W, so? F2P is just another model for money. You don't need to create super-smart AI, you can use the smarts and capabilities of humans to give the paying customers a challenge. And here's something that many many players need to get into their head: The developers don't try to screw up their game. These people want to eat, they want to have their homes, they want to have the money for their life. They screw up their game they are quickly out of a job.

What about people that didn't enjoy it? They made a mistake and bought something they didn't want in the first place, if the item is still a disappointment after the change nothing has really changed for them. So again no reason to give them their certs back. Their mistake remains their mistake.
The people who bought it and didn't use it in two years? If you are so stupid to not use it for two years, that's your own fault. Also it's still the minority of a minority that would fall under any category that says "didn't earn their thermals back".
Buying it for the sake of noobs defending your sundi? Well even though you might not have used them, you did get the bang for your buck out of it as it served it's purpose: A longer lifespan on your Sundi and potentially extra XP when you manned your own Sundi.
As almost anyone who's not **** will say, "what kind of bullcrap are you on about"?
You bought a thermal for something you didn't or rarely ever used? Then once again it's your own fault for making a wrong cert exchange. And then still the change to thermals doesn't matter since you weren't using it in the first place.
My method isn't spiteful, the players asking for a refund are entitled and spiteful themselves. "oh my god my super-cert machine has been changed, now I'm going to throw a tantrum in the hopes of getting one last cert-bomb out of it!"
A mass recert is the most moronic thing that the developers can do. I mean look at you: You have almost undoubtedly earned all the certs you put in back twice, if not more than ten times. Yet you are using the 'poor players who didn't like it in the first place or didn't use it in the first place' to try and get a refund for yourself. And that's the big and giant neon sign you are holding screaming "I know I'm wrong", not only do your 'reasons' have no real substance but you have failed to come up with any reason as to why players who did get their cert's worth should suddenly also get their certs back.

That's not even close to an analogy for the situation. Here's a better one:

You have one company that sells brakes for cars. There's all kinds of brakes for different purposes. When using the brakes you can gain points which you can use to buy other brakes and modifications to brakes you already bought.
So they serve a few thousand customers, only there's one type of brake modification that's far better than others. This causes two problems:
1: The brakes with the modification earn points far faster than other brake modifications, hurting the business model of the company as well as creating an unfair situation for customers who aren't using the modification.
2: The brakes are better than others, allowing the user to break and avoid collisions better than others, but causing other customers to start collisions as they are surprised by the faster braking speed.

Naturally the company rectifies this, which is the best business model as you are thinking long-term for your entire customer base rather than listening to a group of self-entitled customers who liked the crutches they were given. The company can't let some customers have an easier time earning points nor letting them cause collissions, at least not without paying for it and considering that non-P2W is the best long-term strategy even that is off the table. But when it does this the customers, who should have known full well they were gaming the system and causing collisions, complain as they've lost something that favored them without any regard for others.
And those who say "screw you, I go to another company" are lying to themselves that they have any reason to quit.

Your whole "points scenario" is just asinine and you are absolutely clueless. You're right about brakes to brakes not working for an analogy. It's more like you go in to get your brakes changed and they tell you the brakes aren't available for your car any more but they'll replace your wipers for the rest of the warranty.

They removed the product. A refund is in order.

Anyways I'm done arguing about it. I've spent and plan to spend more than enough real money on this game to warrant a refund on principle. They're losing an extremely valuable customer over something stupid if they go through with it because they're making a very poor business decision that I won't stand by. I've spent probably $30 a month on average since I started. They're losing out more than probably 100 players have spent on thermals combined from me alone. I was looking at stocking up on some more ravenous weapons to prepare for the ravenous directive, I guess we'll see since they haven't actually removed thernals from PS4 yet so they may still redeem themselves.

P.S. I agree thermals needed a change, I've no problem with that it's all the rest of the shenanigans.

All dead on except for that bit. Don't believe the hype - the last patch didn't do squat for infs (at least not for me - career BR 110 inf, only class I play). The thermal thing was a stone bummer for sure - I didn't see anyone asking for it, and then it completely nerfed every vehicle I had - I even had those scopes on my guns. I'm sure the game is all super balanced and Fun for Everyone™ now without the ability to see who's shooting rockets at you in the dead of night.

-S

That's not an analogy for the current system.
What your system should incorporate:
How you can gain points to buy different weapons for different purposes
How some weapons/modifications can perform above the norm, causing players who use these weapons to earn more points and lessen the experience for other players by using them.
How the company that sells the stuff is right to balance stuff out so that people don't earn too much.

What you system has:
There's weapons available.
One weapon gets it's purpose changed as it was performing too strongly.
Customers who were using their crutch get angry and think they have any ground to stand on.

So close to a real argument, nice try. A real argument is that the purpose of the modification was changed. But that's the only argument you can make. Every whiny comment surrounding it is pure self-entitled bullcrap.

Aaaand there's your entitlement! "Yo, I paid for something, now that you've changed something else I need a refund and I need it naow!"

Yes, they are losing valuable customers over something stupid, mainly the customers own stupidity. Regardless, 99% of the players will have been able to get their cert's worth out of thermals, and I'm all good with refunding the remaining players (assuming they didn't have enough time to make it worth their while). But refunding the others? That would only encourage these self-entitled bastards to ask for more and more until the game breaks down.

So... These weapons you use are only functional with thermals? Is that what you are saying? Without thermals they are instant-crap?

Then keep it on those shenanigans! Don't invent bullcrap to justify yourself!

At some point in time you're going to buy something that does one thing. After some point it will stop doing what you originally purchased it for and instead will do something else entirely. Perhaps it's no longer functional for what you originally purchased it for at all.

I want you to remember this conversation and all your comments when it doesn't work as intended and you think you should get your money back.

Good day.

If that happens (and it did, I had some thermals as well), you know what I do?
I evaluate if my purchase was worth it, I look at the changes, and then I'll post my thoughts about it. What I won't do is cry out and ask for a refund by making up stuff.

So I'll remember this conversation as a footnote, 'Ziggurat didn't get it'.

I said good day!

By the way. You'll get it, and I'm not making **** up, but you are "oh you earned points so it doesn't matter if they are cheating you" I just hope the company you purchased what ever from has better customer service than DBG and you get your money back.