So, my question to anyone who thinks Rocket Pods are fair and balanced...

Really?

...

Really?

It's an anti-everything gun that does the job of specialty guns better. Is this weapon balanced against your other options? Does this weapon feel fun to face? Does this weapon remove counterplay (AKA does it just destroy everything it looks at and things that counter other weapons no longer defeat this one)?

... Just I mean really? There's being biased, then there's being in denial.

oh lawd its hashinshin

Meaningful balance discussion on the nature of these types of things can't happen until we have more data and more time for the arms race to develop.

Right now a lot of P2P players have unlocked weapons long before the F2P masses have unlocked counter weapons, so balance will automatically seem off.

In about a month as more people specialize in what they want to do, we will better be able to determine where balance is and where balance needs to go.

It's... fun to use. Too much fun.

Uh sure...in most cases.

But rocket pods are over the top OP. That's not an edge case.

I do not believe we have enough data to confirm that one way or the other, because the arms race has not developed yet.

We do not know what vehicle set ups will look like as the game begins to settle and things that appear broken now may end up being laughably weak.

Data, data, data.

Our experiences and feelings are worthless on the subject.

This isn't about whether someone bought them day 1 or not. This is about Rocket Pods being a face roll weapon of epic proportions that are either way too accurate or way too high in damage - one of those facets has to go.

They were nonsense at the start of beta, they were nonsense at the end of beta -- that middle bit of beta when AA got crazily buffed and cleared the skies only made it so air wasn't viable, I'd imagine rocket pods were still nonsense.

OK. Rockets pods have exactly two issues.

1 - They are too effective at killing groups of infantry

2 - They are too effective at killing other air units (primarily Libs)

That's really it, the issue is mitigated significantly because ESFs are quite easy to kill or drive away, also to use rocket pods effectively you need to be low and slow and that makes you vulnerable, especially from air-air ESFs. Really if you think they are an I-win button you should grab them on trial and have a go, they are no-where near as easy to use as you think.

That said the two issues remain.. well issues, Rocket pods should do a lot less aoe damage and less damage to aircraft, they could also stand to have their ammo count reduced some. But its not as bad as people make out.

Shouldn't we know what that unlock is? I mean if it is a cert-only unlock (i.e., non-SC) then it is a matter of time, but if so, what is the counter going to be?

yes and we do. It is AA weapons of all verities except skygaurds, they need some love.

There is no way for us to know what the counter will be until we wait to see how the arms race develops.

The counter could end up being mechanical or strategic in nature.

We require more data before we can make such judgements reliably.

Even the meta game shifting could change the balance on a tactic without actually changing the numbers.

I find it hard to consider it overpowered. First off, if people think that they are gods gift to the game, try them yourself. See how slow you farm certs in a mosquito. It's fun, and it's "powerful" but you spend more time retreating, rearming, and repairing than you do actually fighting.

Second, it typically takes much more than one battery of rockets to kill a vehicle. It's extremely hard to hit a moving target, and you must slow your mosquito down to a crawl to be accurate to any degree. High speed straffing runs are safe, but horribly ineffective.

I imagine it's frustrating to get killed by rockets as an infantry, but if there is a huge cluster of infantry sitting there unprotected by anti air, then they all deserve to get killed by something.

I think the rockets are balanced very well, especially considering how easy it is to die to ESF A2A rockets at the moment.

I don't think so...I kill them in my A2A ESF, I kill them with my Hawk Rocket Launcher and I kill them in my Dual Burster MAX. Every once in a while they kill me, but that's because I left myself exposed, unprepared or I over extended into an area that my faction has no A2A Aircraft or players filling the necessary Anti-Air roles to ward them off or kill them.

I think it is just you, just like every game has good players, it is going to have bad players too...

Rocket Pod ESF dives AA turret and wins. Working as intended?

As the guy above me said, the issue is really that they take a vehicle that previously required a LOT of skill in to an easy mode hold button down and everything near your crosshair dies machine. If that sounds harsh, it's true.

I can tell you without a doubt that if I attack a AA turret with my rockets and he knows that I am coming, I will die. Also, let's remember that AA turrets are free and can be instantly repaired. ESFs cost resources and are on a timer.

Only if the target is stationary and the ESF is stationary. Target should be moving, and if an ESF is stationary it should die very quickly.

A bit on a tangent, but are all rocket pods equalized on DPS? Photons got such a massive nerf that I haven't bothered to even test them out in this build.

I remember having to dump 3 full mags into a lib to down it in late beta, but I see that a mossie's load can take more than half the HP off of one now.

Yes because an unguided missle weapon where you must be hovering relatively in place to fire off a full volley accurately in order to do so is so OP.

Infantry take anywhere from 4-6 shots for me to kill dead on.
Anti-Air Turrets take 1 full barrage to be destroyed.
Heavy Tanks take anywhere from 2-2.5 full barrages to kill.
Sunderers take anywhere from 3-4 full barrages if there is no one repairing it.

I love the rocket pods, but lets face it- I'd be sooner shot down by the plethora of Anti-Air weaponry *ding ding LOCK ding ding, ding ding* out there in a battle by infantry who can see me coming long before I see them than get off a full volley in a cluster small enough to damage specific targets. Sure I can use decoy flares [and trust me I do, religiously] but standing still in a swarm of people who fire with any amount of weapons seriously injures my vehicle to the point of being a burning heap of junk when I land on a pad.

It's not just anti-air I have to worry about.. large amounts of small arms fire, flak from turrets and max units and even non-guided missles from heavy infantry and artillery from tanks.. there is such a mass of anti-air gear out there that if people used it more often then I think there wouldn't be an issue with this at all.

Except that's not true. You require direct hits on vehicles to do any damage, and taking out a MBT or sundy requires at 2 full volleys. Infantry damage is actually NERFED from beta, and the only infantry that are getting killed are the ones standing around.

Meanwhile, there's a million things that can kill you from every single direction, and you spend most of your time running and repairing for every successful kill you make.

I agree with an earlier poster. The only issue right now is an imbalance in available resources. As soon as more players are unlocking skyguards, dual bursters, A2A and G2A rockets, and actually flying their own anti-air setup, you'll see things balance out again.

The problem is everyone wants to nerf rocket pods (which were already nerfed post-beta), but they don't want to put any effort into killing the people using them.