Anti-IRNV/Therm

So....we have a seriously OP version of IRNV for vehicles, but no counter. Please consider adding something. See the video "Divine Intervention" in my signature to view how effective the IRNV is on the Liberator.

care to explain the problem in more then one sentance for those of us who do not know what you are talking about?

If I were to guess, he probably plays a lot of Infiltrator, and is tired of vehicles with IRNV/Thermal being able to see cloaked avatars and nuke them.

I don't have screenshots, but I believe his point is that the IRNV optics for a vehicle (InfraRed/NightVision) is highly effective. I believe it basically highlights all warm bodies and makes it incredibly easy to target. Still, faction becomes difficult to determine, but that is what "Q" is for.

The OP appears to be hoping that there is some sort of counter to this vision form, some sort of thermal masking. I'm not sure what I think.

The loss of magnification/obfuscation of faction identity seems like it should be enough.

Ummm....it's a pretty simple topic. IRNV/Therm is a rock and we have no paper (IRNV/therm masking) to protect our scissors (Infantry & vehicles).

I rarely play Infiltrator. In fact, I am normally the one using the IRNV and am ok with it being effective, but it still needs a counter.

Also, the ability for IRNV to highlight actively cloaked infiltrators is another broken aspect of the situation.

You can't see cloak with IRNV. I had to hunt down an infiltrator around a hill for 5 minutes because every time I got close, he cloaked and shifted. In fact, I would say it is harder to see infiltrator in many situations with the 50 cert IR. Not sure about the 200 cert one but if that can see cloak, then at least there is a benefit to reduced range 200 cert upgrade!

Spray yourself with a fire extinguisher

I think you have to back it up a step:

Tank (Rock) Versus Squishy Infantry (Scissor)
Infantry uses mines, rockets, or other armor / aircraft support.

IR/Thermo Tank versus No IR Infantry: infantry dies without really knowing what happened
IR/Thermo Tank versus IRNV Infantry (Or Infantry with ears): infantry hides behind rock and IR/Thermo is useless.

Doesn't the smoke grenade also block IRNV? I know the Lightning's IR smoke does. That might be a decent thing, though I rarely see infantry use it.

Are you sure? Did they change it? In the final days of Beta, IRNV would always made cloaked enemies stand out with a thick white border around them.

I am strongly AGAINST this idea because of all the games i've played with thermals , from SOCOMS to the originalghost recons, to games which ahd crappy counters implememnted like the COD's, to battlefield ,t o the most realistic games like confrontation, to ARMA OA

This is the way it is in real life- it was added to serve that purpose.

We should NOT be trying to counter this like this- even more, guess what? They took the extra step of giving it a MASSIVE nerf in which the range is extremely reduced.

This is not realistic at all, and already limits it- any more, and you're going ot make it not more effective than visible- when that's the point.

Let's keep what realism we have- as the sights are expected to make a different viewing experience to a gunner

Matter of fact - THE SCOPES SHOULD BE BUFFED

I have a strong case to back that up - here

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/...ndard-optics-night-vision-irnv-thermal.53280/

Maybe it's your quality settings. For me, IRNV makes cloaked infiltrators show up a solid shade of green which clearly stands out against almost all backrounds.

Mud worked for Arnold in Predator... just sayin.

"Need" is a rather strong word. And I'm not certain you can prove that by just saying it.

I'm not trying to be rude or snide, but the notion that every ability must have a direct counter seems off.

How does an AA missile counter that the target has flares?
How does a minelayer counter that a tank has the bottom armor cert?

Therefore, why should something thats already a counter, have a counter in and of itself?

Eventually, the game is going to turn into a highly reactionary game of RPS, and less of a combined arms game. I get I may not be making sense with this point, as these ideas are very, very closely related, but the nuance is determining whether or not an item/ability should be taken generally, or in highly specific circumstances. Some sort of thermal cloak is highly, highly specific, with no clear indication that it is useful (how could you tell that the enemy has thermal vision with which to use the thermal cloak effectively in the first place?).

I believe that smoke grenades and flash grenades should haze IR (one with a chronic loss of resolution and the other with an acute overload.). Would be hard to implement but it would be pretty hilarious to blind a tank with a flashbang, and honestly IR and Smoke shouldn't synergise together the way they do now.

Your tank vs infanty comment isn't incorrect, but it's not the topic. Your talking about the general rock/paper/scissors of predators, I am talking about target identification aids and counters.

An no, IRNV is a counter to smoke. IRNV highlights targets inside the smoke.

I like this idea. But I was thinking for infantry it could be a sidegrade in the "suit" slot and for vehicles "defense." Something multi-level. The higher the level the more effective.

I hope you realise that,

1. Almost no one flies around permanently in vehicle IR/Therm because it drastically reduces visual range.

2. Once in range of possible targets, WITH OR WITHOUT IR/Therm, any good gunner will be spamming "Q" [spotting] that will make ALL enemy locations light up even more than IR/Therm, not only for themselves but also so the pilot can see the targets on their minimap and adjust their flying accordingly.

3. In fact, many lib gunners prefer having Zoom optics rather than IR/Therm because of the larger visual range under all conditions and pilots for increased safety of the vehicle (higher height against G2A).

Apart from range, and color, there is no difference with IRNV infantry scope.

Therefore, the only "counter" to liberator weapons is counters to liberators which is AA, particularly ESF or Burster MAX - which are highly effective.

If you are Infantry do not get caught in the open while a bomber is flying around, just like in real life. No "smoke" or "cloak" is going to save you from a bomber!

So, what exactly is your complaint?

YOU CANT SEE CLOAKIES WITH IRNV KK?

Not everything in the game needs to have a counter. Its not god mode; its a visibility option. Thats it.

Why dont we have silent running engines for the Flash? Thats how you notice them, that and morons leaving headlights on; if there was cert for silent running, they would be proper spec ops vehicles.