The "Orion is Easymode" Thread

SVA > Orion. Orion is decent and I originally used it until about 10k kills but sometime last year I tried the SVA and there was no going back. Losing a tiny bit of damage for better accuracy and the ability to kill more dudes with less reloads is pure win for my solo play style. Perhaps in a nice sized squad the orion will shine but me switching to the SVA only made my VS HA better. Recently came back to PS2 and only played a handful of hours as VS, but will eventually get the aurax version and MAYBE switch back.

Reaper/tross/acx-11 are amazing to use not the SAW.

So you agree that the SAW shouldn't be the starter gun. Until that issue is resolved the SAW is a starter gun therefore must be compared to the orion by law by forumside. Any other continuation of this orion vs anchor will be punishable by scat max

Anchor is the CQC LMG for the NC (SPA and ALS). EM6 and GD-22S are the two most generalist of the bunch. EM1 and EM6 are both suppression weapons since they can opt in for 200 round mags.

The more you know :|

No, it really doesn't considering the Anchor is available to all players FOR FREE if they select HA as their class in the new character survey.

And we've ALL said, MANY TIMES NOW, that the SAW shouldn't even be default.

So rather than claiming the Orion must be nerfed cause the SAW is underperforming, how about we fix the more obvious issue first???

The SAW makes a better battle rifle than the battle rifles. Single shot that mofo (or 2rd burst maybe) and it has the option to full auto making it better in close than battle rifles too.

If that's not a unique advantage, I don't know what it.

It's a TERRIBLE starter weapon and awful for new players... that doesn't make it a bad gun... it's just far too specialized with FAR to high of a skill floor.

And yet no one talking about NC LMGs mentions my first true love, the SAW S, which is the Pulsar LSW to the EM6's SVA-88 ;_;

"So rather than claiming the orion must be nerfed cause the SAW is underperforming"

I never said the orion should be nerfed? I said the SAW should be BUFFED. I don't know where you believe that I think orion need a nerf I actually do not like the orion.

The SAW should definitely not be buffed....I already use it as battle rifle to great effect, while still maintaining 1666 dps full auto close up. If it were any more powerful, it'd be OP. The problem isn't that the weapon is weak. It's that it has a harder learning curve as it is so different from other weapons. Seriously...try counter-sniping snipers with it. 3 headshots and Boom. Dead. With lag/delay/etc...they often don't have time to even move/react. Tap. Tap. Tap. Win. I love the SAW. I just don't think it's an appropriate starter gun as it's hard for newbies to use.

The Anchor isn't the questionnaire weapon, the EM1 is.

The Anchor is expensive no matter what

You get the EM1. Unless they changed it.

I have over 2000 kills with the saw for the record. Im not talking about buff as in DPS im talking buff as in orion recoil when shooting and moving. Like I said I do not like the saw because you simply can't shoot and move because you get penalized so much compared to the orion/carv or any dam gun out there.

Also I don't like battle rifles so clicking and shooting one bullet at a time isn't something I like to do im more of an I shoot my entire clip until I see you drop in the floor regardless of what range.

I could see the SAW *maybe* getting a reduction in movement penalty, I know what you mean there....

but your second part... then the SAW is not for you... which is why the SAW just shouldn't be a starter weapon.

And sorry, I was wrong, it's the EM1 which is free..... and I always get mixed up with EM1 and EM6...

1 of them is good and 1 is vastly underperforming and in need of actual buffing.

For the sake of new NC players, I hope it's the EM1 that's good.

In any case, they should swap the NC starter weapon. The SAW is great and unique at what it does. You really don't want to give up a unique faction strength like that. It'd just be better for NC in general if just about any other LMG was default.

Someone said GD22 would be a good default, and I agree... It's one of more often used LMG's on my NC. Good RoF, good shoot and move, good DPS.

If 0.75 was removed from all LMG's (or just the VS ones) then the only buff to compensate I would accept is accuracy. The Orion is already at max LMG ROF, reload speed is the dumbest gimmick in a game with such low TTK's, and velocity can't really be pushed enough because of engine limitations.

As for VS AR's... it's really two problems.

First is damage per magazine of 143 guns which is actually a huge problem for non TR AR's and carbines, especially when you look at the following.

• 143x40 rounds = 5720
• 167x30 rounds = 5010
• 125x40 rounds = 5000
• 200x24 rounds = 4800
• 143x30 rounds = 4290

The difference between a 200 damage 24 round gun is still 510 damage per mag which is only a 200 damage differential between 167x30 round guns and 143x40 round guns, and remember that 200 damage 24 round guns were given an extra 4 rounds. VS gets punished the most in this area since NC get a bunch of 167x30 round weapons while VS get 1 carbine and 1 AR.

If they fix it this way I would like to see one of the following

1. All 143x30 round guns are moved to 143x35 round. That would put them on par damage per mag as 167x30 round guns (5005 vs 5010) while still giving TR an advantage in that department. You'd have to buff the NS weapons some way... maybe increase the ROF or something with damage degradation would be cool. TR 143/40 guns would get a buff to reload speed as well.
2. All 143x30 round guns that have a ROF of below 700 are given 35 rounds per magazine. This would totally be a buff to VS but it's one that is desperately needed. NS/TR guns would either need a very small or get no buff to compensate.

The second problem is that VS AR's aren't actually accurate to make up for their lower DPS (except for the CME kind of) because their horizontal recoil/tolerance is bad, and that more than vertical recoil effects a guns accuracy.

The Corvus has the worst horizontal tolerance of any 167 damage AR by 0.1 in exchange for 1 0.025 improvement in horizontal recoil. The only fix for this gun is to bump it to a 550 ROF.

The Pulsar... the only guns with worse horizontal tolerance are either 800+ ROF AR's, 0.75 ADS AR's, or both. For that it has a 0.02 horizontal recoil than the CME which even has a 0.5 horizontal recoil. Even lowering the horizontal recoil to 0.5 (which would match the Cycler) would probably be enough, and the CME's should be brought down to 0.4. Fixing that would also improve the Equinox and Equinox burst... although all burst AR/Carbine's need to have their FSRM cut in half at least.

You would have a point, but all I need to do is look at the NC Infiltrator and notice that he gets a BASR, while the rest get a semi auto. Just because they are starter guns, doesn't mean that it makes sense to compare them on that argument alone.

After playing with the Terminus Wampa I think the best way to "fix" the pulsar is angle reduction. Reduce it from 17/20 to something like 5/6 or even 0/0 would be a dramatic improvement in accuracy on its own.

Lol, I read the entire thread, and everyone, both those saying the Orion isn't OP and those saying it is are wrong, none of the stats presented prove it, at all.

The only thing you can gather from this thread that is definitely true is that the Orion is the best starter LMG (and from that we'll also get that the Beetlejuice is the best auraxium LMG). Can you be certain that it's objectively better than the MSW-R and the Anchor? Nope, not at all, you can't even compare their performances because of different sample types, and even if it is better, it's only slightly better at best.

And even then, even if the Orion is slightly better than the Anchor and MSW-R, keep in mind it's the ONLY option we have (the SVA-88 is crap after the nerf, and the other VS LMG have always been crap). Besides, TR also have the MCG, and NC have the Jackhammer and Cyclone (which is so stupidly better than all the other SMGs in the game it's not even funny, and it's quite a legit alternative for CQC), meanwhile we have the almighty (?) Lasher, lel, wtf are you crying about.

If there's actually a problem here, it's that the SAW is the starter for NC, and that's it.

I'd be fine with this as well, just something since the DPS loss compared to the Cycler and DPM loss compared to the Cycler and Gauss is not at all made up for in accuracy.

I think I like the Ursa best, even above the Betelgeuse. Will run a bit more to make up my mind.

Nope, I wish though.

The EM1 (the crappiest NC LMG) is the optional free LMG.

Ah... well, Pulsar LSW is the free VS LMG so I guess that's the standard for the questionnaire LMGs.

Well, GD22 would make a good default LMG then. It's a good all-rounder type.

You can still get some pretty good LMGs from the welcome kit. See my signature (blatand advertising).