Is the medic an AV class & is the Infiltrator a Defensive class?

Because rationally theres no reason why the medic should have C4 access & the Infiltrator to have Proxy mines.


Proximity mines =/= Sabotage

C4 =/= Reviving & healing allies.


The Infiltrator can rival an Engineer at fortification.(This is freaking bizarre considering the class roles & designs)


The Medic can be as much as a close range threat to ground vehicles & MAX's as a HA,LA or Engineer.(No words for how dumb of a game design decision this is).

I don't see a problem. I see Combat Medics in PS2 like we used Combat Life Savers. Dudes that can keep you alive and carry AR's and other equipment. For gameplay purpose, they're Medium Assaults. Tankier than a LA, but not quite as destructive as a HA. And they get the ability to necro their allies.

Infils can definitely sabotage. Just proxy mine an enemy vehicle terminal. Do that for an evening and forumside will explode with about 2-3 threads about it. Hell even you would make a thread about it lol.

Focus on the game not IRL.

Even then theres no balance or design reason why they would have access to C4, they are not a AV class.

Sabotage = Hacking, planting explosives on targets(NOT MINING, thats a Engineer job isn't it? ), etc.

I am fine with removing the C4 from the medic, as long as all other healing items are gone, and all vehicles and MAXes can't harm medics. Until then, I'll keep my C4, because all you HAs, engineers and LAs are too busy sucking each others dicks on how badass you are at shooting nonthreatening infantry, while vehicle and MAXes run right into our lines.

i don't see why infiltrators shouldn't have AI mines, i mean they are about sabotage and ambush. what better way to evade when exposed by moving through your escape route that has a couple of mines preplaced or sneaking around and placing mines when you see someone coming your way who won't reach your position until the mines arming delay expires.

trust me far too often people run into mines in obvious spots like doorways of the vehicle terminal room at techplants near the spawnroom.

I wouldn't care at all if they removed C4 from medics. i'm not holding my breath though DBG has this idea that if you don't have an nongrenade explosive option that you should have one.

C4 on the medic serves no purpose interms of working with the class role/design.


Don't make things personal when it comes to balance/design.

Right.

So How to Proxy mines Help you ambush targets or Sabotage bases?

Rationally think about it.

I use C4 on my medic to deal with maxes. IMO its a waste of time to C4 a tank. Ignore the tank, take their base from behind him, and watch him ditch their tank to redeploy.

Hack it then mine it. Now someone's got to switch to a infil to rehack.. get blown up, respawn, and then try again. Want to get a forum post out of them? Stick around as a stalker and remine it.

When they die a second time, hack an infantry terminal and switch to a MAX and sit on the vehicle terminal.

Chances are they'll log out. One less enemy to deal with that evening. That's sabotage. Be the psychological weapon.

-edit: Oh wait.. before you switch to a max.. switch to an engie and mine the front of the vehicle pad with AV mines... now we're cooking just in case you get taken out as a MAX. When they think you're finally gone and pull the vehicle...

Boom.

Previously considered safe regions of passage all of a sudden are no longer as safe.

Target A hits mine and dies, causing target B pause. Infiltrator kills target B while mine has caused its distraction.

Sabotage is not to be defined by activity, but by result. Ambushing is not the setup, but the result of the setup.

Until the mines are gone.

Thats not sabotage.

And then both targets come with darklights and kill the infiltrator.

Sabotaging is actively screwing with something to cause a result.

Ambush is setting a trap to eliminate a hostile force.

Its hilarious to see Tanks run away from Medics.

Its like "This games balance & design really is something special".

Also let the HA's or LA's deal with MAX's or keep your distance and headshot those tin cans.

Each class has a role.

That sounds like a amazing set of events that will never happen .

I'm not for this idea at all. And that's coming from a guy who detests prox mines. (Yeah, I know there are ways around them and such and they aren't OP. It still irks me every time one gets me though hahaha)

Let them both keep their toys. If we are really going to argue for specialization and class roles then.....

Everyone but medics lose any healing abilities (implants, medpacks, resto kits, etc)
Everyone but engineers lose any repair ability (nanite auto repair, fire suppression heals)
Only engineers can carry explosives (c4, prox mines, tank mines. Heavies keep their rocket launcher)
Light Assaults to get a buff in some way, shape, or form. (Perhaps base design that allows them to be more than an annoying threat from above? etc)
Infiltrators cannot wear nanoweave or flak suit options nor can light assaults.
Ammo is reduced or tweaked in some way that engineer ammo packs are more a necessity than an afterthought. (Especially on Heavy Assaults)
Infiltrators should never show up on radar unless they fire, cloak activated or otherwise.
Infiltrators are needed to hack a control point to start the timer.
Light Assaults naturally run faster than standard infantry.
etc etc etc.

And before someone insinuates it, none of my opinion is based on feelings, real life situations, or anything silly for that matter. I just see no way to start segregating the classes unless we make a full scale major overhaul on the system. Unless specialization is fully embraced and blankets all units/vehicles/etc then there is no reason to nail two individual classes. Especially because the two items suggested are not even "that big of a problem" at least in my opinion.

About the only problem I have with anything in the original post, are players with prox mines. And the only problem I have is that you can just pull them up and toss them down instantly anywhere on the ground. Give them a one second set-up time and the need to be placed like an engineer turret currently and they'd be perfect (again in my opinion). I only say this because it is ridiculous that a guy can just run into a crowded room and toss it down without dying quickly enough due to latency/lag/etc (also, it is rather annoying to be chasing an infiltrator with one health who can just "magic" down a prox mine instantly.) This way, they can still be set up in advance for defense, they still have a short delay so it isn't so easy to just suicide run, and an infiltrator can't be 3 feet in front of you then turn a corner and a magic mine is there (takes a lil more planning, though still possible). At least c4 requires you to throw the brick then there's a small eternity until you can press the button.

*It's hilarious to see Tanks who can't shoot an enemy medic with its main cannon, or it's secondary gunner not shoot an enemy medic with his/her canon, or the friendly infantry around the Tank fail to shoot the enemy medic.*

Fixed that for you.

I suppose hacking a terminal might count as sabotage but it's just as ephemeral as the mine under that logic. The mine will remain armed until is goes off (or is disarmed or replaced). The terminal will remain hacked until it is re-hacked (or destroyed and repaired). Both of these states of "sabotaged" will end rather quickly. Either of these issues prompt individuals to go Infiltrator hunting because there may be an Infiltrator about screwing with things. Indeed the Infiltrator is capable of quickly re-re-hacking the Terminal if need be, but that still allows use in between bouts of going to the terminal after it has been "fixed," and that allows the window for enemies to use it when it is fixed instantly. The sabotage was short-lived. Even with mines, hacking a loadout terminal, though rare as they are outside of the spawn room, allows the Infiltrator to restock his mines; and, while there are no mines, the pathway is free.

By this assessment, you can argue an Infiltrator is incapable of sticky sabotage. There is nothing he can do that is not easily undone.

There really isn't any way you can argue out of this paper bag other than avoiding how correct the interpretation is. Setting up a trap that kills people or using a trap that kills one person and the double distraction of the trap going off and that one enemy dying to kill other enemies because they looked in its direction, not in the one the trap-layer is waiting, is a completely valid ambush.

All classes can sabotage. All classes can flank. All classes can ambush. Not all classes can do it exactly the same way, and the Infiltrator just gets a variety of tools that give it a unique avenue over other classes in this regard.

I just hate that moment when a medic just plops down a C4 then kills me every time.

The medic doesn't need C4, I never understood that.

Proximity mines fit the infiltrator quite well. They can get behind enemy lines and sneakily cause some chaos, and proximity mines are great for that.

The issue here is thinking that a medic is just a healer/reviver. They aren't.

They have assault rifles (instead of carbines) for a reason. They are, as is stated, the "all around class".

A medic is going to do better than an engineer at c4'ing a tank because they can survive more fire if they use selfheal aura as they go in. They may not do as well as a LA, but they can probably get the job done.

Few people like to play pure "cleric". Thus, medics don't have to. I think it makes sense.

As to infs being defensive? Sure, if you mean we get shot less if we know what we're doing...

I dont think the developers had a choice on the medic side of things. I know people dont really play medic, but I do. And I feel that without the OPTION of C4 there would be a lot of rage about how "medics useless against tanks" etc. But thats not to say medics should have unlimited AV potential. 2 bricks is a lot of c4 for a soldier especially a combat medic. Id say a reduction or limit to one C4 brick for medic is fine.

Admittedly i do run C4 on my medic, but not because its useful. I could probably count on my hands how many kills ive gotten with C4 on medic. The other choices are just redundant.

Healing is just unnessecary when you have a self regen. I think we just need more exclusive options. Like maybe Empire specific stimpacks. TR gives increased sprint and reload speed by 15% . VS gets enchanced recoil control (like a horizantal compensator) and a 15% ADS speed bonus. NC gets increased recoil recovery speed by 30% and 50% reduction in flinch. Each would also increase bullet resistance by 5%.Hell there could be an NS version with 5% of all aforementioned stats. They could take a few seconds to ready and use but well worth it.


As for mines I somewhat agree they should be limited to engineer but engineers just arent stealthy enough to place them or informed enough to know where to place them. I say each faction gets a new anti personel mine designated for infiltrator that isnt quite a one hit kill or maybe nonlethal. But these new mines would be more sensitive and maybe have greater range at lesser damage. Maybe a Sticky bomb for vanu that gives an emp effect as well as doing some damage. A scatterbomb for tr that splits into maybe 4 bouncy bombs that do little damage but spot the target. A futuristic bear trap that damages all people in a very small radius and cuts directly into health.

Just IMO

They are both support classes, along with engineer. Meaning that they have offensive capabilities, but their main intended use is to support allies because of their class abilities and equipment.

HA, LA, and MAX are the offensive/defensive classes, meaning their main use is just to kill enemies.

And what is the class role/design? I am interested to hear, since you apparently have inside knowledge from the development team on how the classes are designed (was supposed to be designed).

As for making it personal, whenever someone spews personal opinion and pretends like it has any form of basis to stand upon, I usually just spew personal anecdotes, seeing as there is nothing to argue about, other than "my opiniun!"