[Suggestion] Make Fire Suppression Automatic

Is that why I've gotten so many kills with my lock-ons these past 6 months? I remember how useless they were when I first got them due to everyone running Flares. Couldn't possibly have had anything to do with how bad Fire Suppression was...right? I guess keep feeding my lock-on squads certs.

I promise you, if they had changed the abilities name when they changed the mechanic this thread would have never existed.

And that is where you are wrong. People were running flares because the lock on were guaranteed 95% hit. When fired, They would even fly through terrain. They later fixed that, Then gave two buffs to "Fire Suppression" that made it vastly superior to every other utility (ESF mainly, The ground units are still 12%) available. Now, Noone uses flares because its situational, Like "Fire Suppression" once was.

You say that... yet you have completely forgotten how bad lock-ons were before they became almost 100% accurate. Hell, I remember right after buying the Nemesis I locked onto a parked Mosquito and fired all of my rockets at it and not once did I hit. Regardless, Fire Suppression was fairly useless and Flares allowed all those well-known farmings extra seconds to gain immunity to ALL lock-ons, not just that half-rocket the current Fire Suppression does now.

Its also funny that you have consistently ignored anything I've said mentioning squad-based teamwork in relation to the topic of this thread.

Its also funny how you seem to think every squad works as a team. If I had to take an estimate of squads who could actually follow suggestions and orders over just zerging to the next waypoint, I would say roughly 10% of the squads I am in. Would love to see more vehicles where the driver seat did not have access to the weapons. Maybe then you would throw that team work word around so loosely, Maybe then you would learn just how rare good team work actually is.

You seem to love bringing up how things were in the past, How broken things were back in the day to try and make it okay how things are now. That was then and this is now, "Fire Suppression" needs to be fixed to match the current utilities. It needs to become situational again. Flares still give extra seconds to gain immunity to all lock ons, But "Fire-Suppression" lets you take an entire extra rocket before you are actually in any danger. Thats if the rocket even hits, which on average is 50/50 if that rocket collides with something in route to the vehicle.


"Why should I take a situational utility like Flares when half the time, The rocket is not going to hit me anyways do to terrain? Its a thousand times better to take "Fire Suppression" for a band-aid for when a rocket DOES manage to hit you. Flares become useless if the rocket hits you, "Fire Suppression" does not."

The maximum lock range is 350m, they work for quite a bit further than that. Outrunning a lock is only feasible if you have AB tanks as it stands. I'd also like to point out that, for ESF's, G2A is a threat- two lockons send us to burning, and flak makes large areas no-fly zones. The main reason we survive it is fire suppresion, and that would be nerfed in the trade-off.

Actually it would not be nerfed, "Fire Suppression" Would automatically activate the second you hit a fire state with my idea. What IS being nerfed would be its ability to pad damage. Here is an example.

You are an ESF at 45% damage. One more AA rocket would be enough to instantly destroy you if it hit. To avoid this, You use your health padding "Fire Suppression" to bring yourself back to 70% health. Stopping that rocket from even being a threat now. This is where it steps into flares range. If I fire an AA rocket at an ESF with 45% health, Unless it has flares, I have earned that kill.


This is why I say "Fire Suppression" is being abused. People are using it to pad their health to stop things that would have otherwise counted as an fair kill. In this case, Only flares should have been able to stop that final rocket from finishing you off, Not "Fire Suppression" because you abused it as a health pad.


Oh! As for your flak argument, You have an armor available that removes 30% of damage from all flak, You have no room to complain on not being able to escape flak unless you are a bad pilot who flies in predictable directions.

Not quite: fire suppresion immediately puts you out of burning, then heals you. If it activates on burning, you lose some health regen. Plus, that 25% health boost takes a while to complete, so if it happened when you're already almost dead, it could end up not mattering, since your opponent can kill you before you get all that health back.

Composite armor has the opportunity cost of not being NAR- it's simply a lot less fun to play with. Imagine if, as infantry, choosing nanoweave over advanced capacitator recharge meant that you could only heal your shield by taking the time to resupply at a terminal. Would you use nanoweave? Hell no. The difference isn't quite so drastic, but in the end, composite armor only helps against a single damage source.

"Nanite cloud"

Is it alot less fun because you are forced out of the air more often to actually do work and fix your vehicle manually? Sounds about right. The ESF version of the "Fire Suppression" is just putting too many freebie repairs into the hands of the pilots. You also get that repair in only 5 seconds.

Actually, I agree with you.

Fire Suppression should only be available when the ESF is actually on fire; and not even automatic.

Essentially, as it is, Fire Suppression is a game-condoned cheat for ESFs.

Right.

... Except for when it actually was 12%, and EVERYONE ran Flares. Granted, this was pre-Coyote days, when the Striker ruled the skies.

Fact Check:

This is not true, myself and others have posted the correct values in this thread: please stop saying that FS heals Air Vehicles for 25%.

Yes, actually, it's an everyday occurrence for anyone playing the game during their server's peak time, and frequently outside of the peak time. I'd also say it only takes two HA, because if either of those HA is dumb enough to start reloading instead of simply pulling out their LMG and finishing an easy kill, they don't deserve that kill.

Nanites aren't real, there is no proof of anything using nanites, we have to just take the lore on good faith from the devs, since they created it they bought the Intellectual Property.

This is technically correct, but only because you used the verb 'was' which implies past tense. This is the way it was designed. Anyone who played then can tell you it sucked, and that's why almost no one used it, why the Devs recognized it was under-utilized and under-performing, and they went ahead and totally reworked it for EVERY vehicle.


I'm poking fun at this point, but let's be serious for a minute. You are wrong. Before you hit reply, read the rest of this, and let me save your fingers some trouble. Back when FS only put out fires, it also gave a flat repair. The mechanic was simple: Your health was raised until you hit the 'healthy' (green) threshold on your vehicle, and the performance of your engine was restored.

Here's the real crux, pay attention: If you had a decent connection to the server (and weren't being insta-gibbed by flak lag), you could wait until the instant before your plane exploded, and then hit Fire Suppression. In effect, this would give you all the health you lost between 'Green' and your subsequent explosion.

Do you understand what I'm driving at? The only real change was moving it from being reactive to proactive. Previously, you could 'abuse' 'pad your health' heal more than most users, simply by waiting til the last second. The heal was the same regardless of rank, the only benefit to certing deeper was lowering the cool-down timer. There were a large number of people that ran Rank1 FS as they saved certs for other stuff: This is exactly how I certed my Liberator in the beginning, until I had the certs for a Rank of Afterburner that was worth using.

IMO, this whole thread boils down to, 'There's a utility called Fire Suppression that suppresses fires. It sucked, the Devs reworked it to be a click heal (OVER TIME, it's not even instant, lol), and they didn't change the name.' Nothing about the actual mechanics of its use changed in anyway, the difference is that you can now hit it earlier than catching on fire.

I doubt anyone will read this far, but I just wanted to go on record saying I barely use ESFs, when I do I use Flares or Scout Radar, and this entire thread is a huge waste of time. I wrote a long post because I'm on break and have nothing better to do.

Until next time, know your real enemy is my FireSuppression/CompArmor Valkyrie.

That's not proof.

A thing isn't overpowered because it's sometimes useful. Things are only overpowered if they eclipse all other choices. In this case fire suppression definitely doesn't because often flares will be more valuable (completely preventing the damage in the first place, while also protection against any number of lock-ons being used against you at once.) But it varies, and that's why both options are balanced.

So you're just describing again how the ability didn't match your expectations of what it should do -- and you don't really care about the actual balance.

"Fire Suppression" isn't "Sometimes" useful, The utility is ALWAYS useful. You pop it when you hit 75% heatlh to pad yourself and then you can survive an additional rocket with no fear.

"Fire Suppression" for ESF's is currently the utility around 90% of pilots use. It is CLEARLY eclipsing all other utilities. Ask any pilot who knows even slightly how to fly, They will tell you its the end all of utilities.

"Fire Suppression" is chosen over flares because the hit rate for lock on rockets is around 50/50. Sure the flare will stop a single rocket, But that flare is only useful when the rocket doesn't collide with nearby terrain. That being said, "Fire Suppression" is the safer alternative because it can mitigate 55% of the rockets damage. Thats IF the rocket hits. If it doesn't, You didn't have to use your "Fire Suppression" and have it ready for your next damage. You can't save flares like that because you don't know if the rocket is going to it or not, Its 50/50.


I just broke down your entire post and explained WHY it isn't balanced and what the actual balance of it is. Right now the utility is being used over all else on ESF vehicles, Why? Because it is currently over powered compared to the rest of the ESF utilities. But hey, whatever, Keep letting me rip your arguments to shreds. Maybe the developers will see it and side with me. It's just more notice this thread will get.

For A2A work, fire supression has a strong lead for sure (though I also feel the maphack traits of engagement radar make it viable -- on Hossin at least where air cover abounds.) For A2G work, flares are generally superior and several high end pilots go with it. I'm ranked 42-53rd in KPH for the various AI noseguns, so while I'm not the best A2G pilot I'm actually reasonably good.

Or for a more direct context, here's our LPPA KPH:

• 116 Axehilt
• 20.8 Foxirus

So basically I've explained the logical reason behind flares' benefit, and knowing that you should keep in mind the fact that you have less than 1/5th of my KPH and I might actually know what I'm saying. But you seem the sort to ignore logic and superior experience in favor of feeling like you're correct, so I fully imagine you'll continue to act as though you've won the argument -- and I'll just have to be satisfied knowing you'll always be mediocre in A2G play.

Okay. I propose banning medkits unless you already have 10% health.

With a medkit, You sacrifice damage output for ability to recover. You lose the ability to take proximity mines, C4, Tank mines. So there is a MASSIVE trade off to using medkits. "Fire Suppression"? No trade off what so ever because it outclasses the other utilities.

It wasn't you who tried this route, But another. Here is the proof below:

So your entire argument is based on the name of the utility?
Then I propose medkits take 30 seconds to apply, like a tourniquet.

And no vehicle deserves nerfs until infantry get the AV nerfs promised around the time of the tank nerfs. FS abuse is nowhere near as bad as render distance abuse.

Disagree. FS is the best all around, because health is good. However, if I'm going A2G around a highly populated base, I'll usually run flares. Flak is bad and all, but I can get around it. Flak + lock ons = very bad. Going with flares means I really only have to worry about one at a time. Also, after popping flares I only need to disengage for about 15-20 seconds, rather than 35-40. Definitely more limited in use, but far from useless.

No, My entire argument is based on the fact the utility is stepping into the grounds of other utilities. Mainly for ESFs. If you can't be bothered to read my first post, Stop wasting my time by causing my alerts to be pinged. As for you trying to go after medkits, They already sacrifice massive damage output taking that ability to heal 500 HP. Your "Fire Suppression" has no drawback and is abused regularly. Render distance is not something that can exactly be fixed because majority of players expect their toasters to run this game.


And again, Stop bringing up medkits in this thread. If you want to try and get them nerfed for some reason, By all means take it to a thread about medkits. If you do it again, A report will be filed for offtopic posting.

Actually, They gave "Fire Suppression" two buffs. They increased its healing for ESF's to 25%, then they made it usable at any time. In the past you could only use it while on fire or it would not give anything. Now, Pilots are using it as soon as they hit 75% health for a free repair. They are also using it when they are are at 45% health to regain enough health to stop that final rocket from finishing the job. This is where it is stepping into flares domain for ESF's. If you get locked on at 45% health, It should only be possible to stop it via flares, Not health padding "Fire Suppression" abuse.