The NC6 Gauss SAW, T9 CARV and the Orion - Replacing myth with facts

The majority of players don't use shotguns .. And the topic is LMG vs LMG ..

Which is then trumped by the most used logical fallacy of all: if TR weapons were really so horribly unuseful, then why do TR players continue to play TR and whine about them rather than just switch factions to use their EZ mode god weapons like everyone else did when the Prowler was OP?

Nice post.

Maybe im just an NC player who is good at the game, but IMO when soe changed flinch they should have change the carv back to how it was at launch. SOE balanced weapons around a fail mechanic, now that they have dumbed out their fail mechanic they need to rebalance the guns.

This is just pure laziness or forgetfulness on their part.

No it's far from bloody irreverent. It's how the game is played by anyone who knows what the best weapon for the job is and uses it on a daily basis. You don't take a LMG to a shotgun fight. Only a idiot would ignore that QCQ is ruled by shotguns and that LMG's are used for medium to long range based on that fact.

Quit trying to ignore reality to boost your own flawed arguments.

Sorry but like said its irrelevant to this subject.

Actually most TR HA are using the T9, even many BR100's are using them with super high KDR's. Most default weapons are the most used in general across all factions as the stats show. Currently the T9 is still the best default LMG HA weapon across the board because it is better where most of the infantry fights are.

The SAW better at long range yes but most fights are not happening there.

According to the weapon stats, the Orion is better than the Carv in every way bar magazine size.

Which stats? I am talking about actual in game stats where the players use them, not technical specifications of the weapons. The in game stats are the most important, paper stats give a good idea of what a weapon is like, but like most things, its how they perform in action which counts and these are the best stats to rely up to get data as to which weapon is better.

What many don't understand here even when it's said over and over:

- Carv being effective at CQC does not matter one bit when there are pump-action shotguns available that over perform at those situations compared to any LMG. Since shotguns are in the game, LMGs are reduced to being used outdoors, where ranges can vary from 10-100+ meters. CARV has a marginal gap between 10-20m where it can be useful, after that range TMG-50 and other long range LMGs are clearly superior. If you want to land shots to an enemy in cover when his head sticks out 20+ m away behind a fence, CARV is **** compared to these more accurate options.
Only thing going for the CARV is under 20m range with the whole enemy exposed, where you can spray all your bullets to target without worrying about accuracy. This is pointless though since closing in with shotguns works way better. Only thing that matters in the end for LMGs is how good they are in range, and we have one choice...TMG-50 which is a toy compared to Gauss SAW.


Anyone who wants to trade their Gauss SAW for a CARV...yeah I would happily trade. Gauss SAW actually has a purpose nowadays.

The same stats that say NC are worse players then TR/VS with common pool weapons?

Your arguing with flawed stats. This is especially true for default weapons as they tend to be used by new players who are learning the game which brings the over all stats down even if that weapon has great gun values and excellent attachments.

The stats are also flawed ever since shotguns were released because they are hands down the best weapons to use in QCQ. You could have the best LMG in the game but your still going to lose to your average shotgun user at 10m or less.

I'm missing that part where he indicated that the guns are pretty well balanced. He wasn't saying that guns were balanced appropriately, he was saying that the common forum myth that the CARV is a god mode weapon couldn't be further from the truth, and that in actual fact, it is the worst of the three basic LMGs.

This is something I've been aware of for a while, especially with the changes to the flinch mechanic, the gauss saw is hands down the best of the three stock LMGs, and in fact, is quite better than many of the "upgrades" that other faction have access to.

By all means go ahead.
it doesn't solve the problem, nor does it prove you right.

you're doing a math equation while ignoring numbers apart of that equation simply because you don't agree with them.

Rather then using the data provided to come to a conclusion you're entering this argument already with an assumption and are hand picking what parts of data are beneficial to you and completely disregarding what parts of data which are not.

That would be true .. If the majority of people used shotguns .. But they don't ( ofc the actual number might differ from battle to battle and server to server )

Well said Hisenburg you did your homework here. While this information will completely go over the head of the majority, the minority completely understands this thread and thanks you for trying to properly educate the masses.

+1

I disagree simply because it is a mass sampling...

i believe that the provided average is a rather accurate display of the default weapons effectiveness with in-game conditions.
It has 'worst' stats yet denotes a higher SPH...

which can mean that the stats you're looking at may not be as important as other stats you're ignoring.
i think holding damage as the end all be all most important stat is the biggest flaw most people have.

Your picking flawed stats that have been proven to be dependant on player skill, knowledge, default weapon use, cert costs and buffs/nerfs that have happened since release. If you go purely based on player stats then NC players have little say on weapons because your less effective when using the same gun. That's how silly player stats are for LMG's or guns in general.

The Gun values themselves are set in stone. They clearly show TR LMG's fall short to NC LMGS in terms of gun values but YOU choose to ignore that and bring up player stats that are shown to be blatantly flawed and highly dependant on factors that have little to do with that weapons strengths/weaknesses or how planetside 2 combat has changed since release. Common pool weapons already prove that play stats are meaningless especially if one faction attracts the 4th faction mentality.

You're doing a math equation while ignoring numbers apart of that equation simply because you don't agree with them.

Rather then using the data provided to come to a conclusion you're entering this argument already with an assumption and are hand picking what parts of data are beneficial to you and completely disregarding what parts of data which are not.

Applies to you given you sweep gun values under the carpet when they are by far the deciding factor on how a LMG or other Rifles perform at longer ranges.

Can the NC get the EM6 and the Gauss Saw switched, so the EM6 is the default or even the GD-22S, and the Gauss Saw is a 1000 certs. That way the other factions are happy and new NC are not forced to use such a horrid gun when they start?

Yes the Gauss saw can get kills when fully upgraded, till then it is a death trap and will get you killed far more then it will kill.

It is an advantage that the NC's default LMG is probably the best empire specific LMG available to NC, for the reasons described in the OP (accuracy++).
The other empire's long range LMG's are Polaris and Rhino.

So would TR be happy if we buffed the Carv at range but nerfed it in CQC ? ... Give and take

If every faction had access to every faction specific LMG in the game which weapon would you pick as your LMG of choice?

Can you really say with a straight face that anyone would pick a TR LMG? or would everyone be using the EM6 or SAW?