The Mayong Origin Problem

Eugh now 3 mentions of it *shakes fist at LoN*
Legends of Norrath quote
'It is whispered that this enigmatic vampire lord of Castle Mistmoore is older than any other creature on the face of Norrath.'
Maps of Myrist quote
'It is rumored that the builder and inhabitant of the castle is an ancient vampire named Mayong, Lord of Mistmoore, who has lived well over ten thousand years.'
EQ 1 Lore Dev
'He’s older than any of the common player races. In fact, he’s said to have seen the first of Veeshan’s brood on Norrath. Perhaps something occured in those days that fueled his hatred of dragon kind . . .'

Only one of those is a problem
The LoN can be written off as a rumor ("It is *whispered*" is synonymous with "It is *rumored*")
the 10,000 year reference of Myrist can be accomodated by the length of the ages we have, and how far back each goes. (since Norrathian 'Ages' are marked by events rather than by a specific length of time, it is *possible* (though a bit of a stretch) to accomodate the 10,000 year reference)
[Note: Trying to construct a master Norrathian time line has thus far proved to be elusive. There are a number of them out there, but none is definitive. The attempt has even stymied the actual individuals that WROTE the lore! (Jindrack and Vhalen were attempting to construct one before they departed into the mists, but the effort eluded them as well)]
Vahlar there is no getting around. We are either forced to take it at face value, or (my preference) to disregard it as a mistake.

Mary the Prophetess wrote:

i'd go with 'he's said to have' as the same too *thumbsupsmiley*

Just to keep things in perspective, we're discussing the fictional history of a fantasy franchise that spans 3 MMOs, all controlled by separate development teams who have limited (if any) communication between them. At some point you just have to take the dev's word for it.

looking into the problem is half the fun

ratbastard wrote:

Some basics: We really don't know much about souls in this game. Did you know that there are ghost plants? Plants have ghosts. Animals have ghosts. We haven't seen any undead rocks yet, but if you had a zombie elemental...who could tell?
The Nameless doesn't act. As far as we know the Nameless started everything, created the elemental dieties, and supposidly created Theer perty much as his final act. Then he sat back and watched. We thought he lived in The Void, but it turns out that Rohen Theer and Anashti'sul were banished there. We've seen no signs of The Nameless in our void exploration.
Planar beings have been killed. So their existance doesn't begin and end with the universe. Even more bizzar, we've had stories of entire planes being consumed by the greater gods to perserve their power. Planes don't create gods, gods create planes (and can apparently consume them to recoup some of their power).
There doesn't seem to be any kind of concern on conseravtion of souls in Norrath. I have no idea where you get this idea. It just doesn't fit into how Norrath exists. Nobody seems to care about "the afterlife". There isn't even a god of the dead or afterlife. Just some vague stories of Etheneer and the Doom Bell.
The big violation of undeath seems to be the works of the gods being turned against their purpose. i.e. the dead killing the living. Mortals were created for a reason, undead work against this grand design. Though, after millenia some of the gods have adopted undead as a motief. (most notibly Cazic Thule because people fear undead.)

Meirril wrote: Planar beings have been killed. So their existance doesn't begin and end with the universe. Even more bizzar, we've had stories of entire planes being consumed by the greater gods to perserve their power. Planes don't create gods, gods create planes (and can apparently consume them to recoup some of their power). ================= beginning and ending IN this universe is different from beginning and ending WHEN universe started/ended. one is location based, the other is time based. i never said time. 'where' is not violated by planar beings destroyed inside eq2 universe. it would be violated if they were destroyed somewhere beyond the grey fields. i would submit they cant pass there. i will admit my original theory about conservation of souls is misplaced. eq2 universe doesnt deal with original and final disposition of souls. the closest is grey fields and being received into deities plane. in short, there is no reason to believe consciousness originated somewhere besides norrath (for mortals), or that their fate is to eventually travel till yonder. deities consciousness appears to have arisen here tho. which is why i say they must die here also.

ratbastard wrote:

What do you mean by "here"? The first dieties were definately not born on Norrath. The dieties of influence didn't know about Norrath until after Veeshan discovered it.
Also souls are used as a source of energy by the Shadowmen. Being used as a source of energy implies that the souls get used up.
As for mortal souls, everything we have about the Elysian Fields, Deathtoll and the Bell indicate that souls go Till Yonder. What does that mean? It isn't clear, but I don't see why you want to argue otherwise.