The Line between Boxing and Botting

Boxers should not be on the defensive, this argument is becoming one of finger pointing towards us. I don't have to defend my play style in any way shape or form. I have 4 boxed and had neither of the other add on players have a clue I was doing so. I have a system of killing down that is so quick and clean that most people would never know. I NEVER lose agro, I don't have wipes, everyone stays healed. I know what I can fight and what I can't. I now take on heroic x2 critters, albeit they are far below me in level...still green though. I have played a single character with pick up groups and had to leave because of how ineffiencent 6 people are killing stuff, its pathetic. It is very hard to be in a group of 6 and know that I could 4 box this or these critters w/o any issues and rinse and repeat. Nice thing is that I don't have to group with single players, they group with me.

I watch very so called efficient players over hit and get agro. I watch so called good players argue for 15 minutes about what to fight, how to pull it, why did we wipe. I watch so called great players pull an extra critter when in a fight, target the wrong critter, hit a mezzed critter, heal the wrong person, overheal and grab agro....funny that doesn't ever happen when I 4 box.


If I played 1 character with 3 buds who knew what they were doing that group will definetely be more efficient then my 4 box group...but 4 pick-up characters....seen it....wipe waiting to happen....argument waiting to happen....quest completed I'm outa here, sorry I am the healer but I don't need to fight anything else now guy.....

all these things happen way to frequently for my tastes....


Hammerstone
Message Edited by Hammerstone on 12-13-2005 05:08 PM

It seems to me in reading the previous posts that a lot of the complaints about multi-boxing are based on assumptions. One assumption is that people are boxing for nefarious or flawed reasons. Another is that people cannot multi-box as well as they can single play.

I do not agree with either assumption. Bad motives are fairly rare in the game, but I have not noticed people who box have worse pathology than those who do not. Honestly, I do not see many people who box. I do see lots of people who post outrageous statements in OOC hoping to get an argument started. But I do not see how anyone could post about the psychological motivations of boxers in general. There are as many reasons to box as there are people who do it. I do not box, I have the equipment and accounts to do so, but it would not be fun for me. I would get confused and killed. Not that getting killed is any big deal anymore!

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Thank you for expressing an open mind as to why people might multibox.....

I posted a response as to why I 2-box, hoping that some people would understand my motives as neither nefarious or selfish. I don't have lot's of time to play and many quests need a group that oftentimes requires 3-4 hours of commitment to obtain/support. (You can't always leave when your needs are met.)

The train of posts that followed, probably most of which paid no attention to my post, proceeded to analyze the anti-social behavior of multiboxers and to complain about how badly they unbalance the game.

My main is a L27... A friend who quit to go to WoW gave me the remainder of the 1 year account he had has a L36. I have a second account with a L26. I have a hard time imagining how I can possibly unbalance this game. I multibox because I advance a little faster and because it is challenging to figure out how to complete quests at these levels when groups interested in my quests are available less than 30% of the time.

I don't have the time to farm anything involving a 10 hour camp either as a single member of a group or as a multiboxing genius able to control the number of toons would be needed to take down the mob when he pops.

Many of the people complaining about multiboxing in all likelihood have had their main subsidize or help there alts advance. I can't afford to deck my bezerker in all carbonite because I don't have enough gold. ( I know how to buy using RL credit card but choose not to.) Peeps who deck there alts out in gear peeps w/o high level help can afford unbalance the game in ways I can not approach. I don't complain about them because frankly if I had a high level toon to help my guys, I would do the same thing.

As 1 person, I 2-box very well. I only screw up in a bad group that pulls way too much or doesn't wait for the tank to get solid argo before applying high DPS attacks. I like grouping and have helped many others who could not complete quests on their own finish.

I hope the narrow minded posters to this string get by their closed minds to discover that maybe, as you suggested, a number of people who multibox are just looking to have fun.

Well all I know is that any mob is open to anyone to pull it. So if its not being killed by all means attack it. There are no CAMPS in EQ2 so if they get pissed oh well get over it.

I agree I Box my sons toon all the time. Why? So I don't have to deal with grouping with a bunch of idots
I do group but only with my RL friends or guild members. The rest of you are just filler in my game hahahaha

[p]Sorry, didn't mean to resurrect this old thread. Ignore me. [/p]

I 2 box on a regular bases when Im not playing my main. My alts I 2 bow are a lvl 49 Pally and a 48 Fury. Yes, the reason I do this is to farm for masters and what so I can sell on the broker. But, I tend to do this only late at night when very little people are on. And, If I see people clearing a path heading towards a name.. I may set back and watch but I do not steal the mob... infact many times I've helped them by assisting the kill when they have problems our, if they wipe I rez them with my Fury. So, imo 2 3 4 5+ boxing is just fine as long as you dont go out of your way to ruin the game for others. Also the main reason I do this is because lets face it, at times it is very difficult to find a healer for a group, let alone late at night. I also have no problem joining, or allowing others to join me. And when others are in my group I`m fare on loot rolls. I always decline on one character so I dont get double the chances. I've been in full groups tanking and boxing my fury for healing and people have told me I' do a great job.. more so then alot of tanks and healers who just play the one character. So, it all depends on the individual behind the characters. On another note, I just picked up a third account and I was thinking about adding a utility class to my duo. I was thinking maybe a Dirge or Troub but idk.. Anyone have any suggestions for a 49 Pally and a 48 Fury duo addition?

I 2 box quite a bit but I try not to do so unless its just me. If someone asks to join me I make sure they are aware I am running both toons and cannot heal them quickly if they take agro from me.
I have a fae Monk and Fae Fury that I made when EoF came out and both are 70 now. The monk has 100aa (due to raids) and fury only about 90aa so far.
Boxing a tank-able toon and a healer works very well for doing quests, even heroic ones. I completed close to 700 quests 20+ heritages) so far on them and it was all duo.

I dont use macros though, just 2 keyboards/mice on 2 screens. I dont like "botters" who are just there to farm but I dont have any issue with people playing the game running more than one toon.

I forgot the link, but there was a group of five undead in WoW on a PVP server if I'm right. Two priests and three mages, all one guy. Five different accounts, five different PCs but only one keyboard which he had to do something with to control all the characters at once ina very specific way.[p] [/p][p]Yeah, not illegal, but I know people hated that.[/p]

[p]This is an MMORPG, not an MSORPG (Massively Single-Player Online Role Playing Game).[/p][p]With that being said, multi-boxing puts you into the non-social aspect of the MMO, which defeats an MMO's purpose.[/p][p]Sure if all you care about is loot, platinum and beating the game with or without help then go for it. If your looking to socialize, have fun, and make friends the boxing isnt for you.[/p][p]Personally i think people who two-box rather not waste time making friends, and i feel sorry for them. The fact that their is enough people playing this game, yet they have to two-box makes me sad for them. Its not hard to make friends and get stuff done, ive done it for almost three years and i dont two box or anything like that.[/p][p]If you want to be a uber group buy a single player RPG like neverwinter or something. [/p][p]As for gearing up slower by boxing? That makes no sense at all. Considering its more then one character played by one person is safe to assume they will make twice, if not more, loot and money then an average non boxing player. Sure they got to split it amonsgt more characters, however, having twice the normal help makes up for that making adventuring easier, and faster.[/p][p]If you want to two box go right ahead, just remember your second character and up just took a spot a friend of your could of had. And i dont care how well u make characters, they cant joke back, give advice, or try to annoy you with insults which makes the grouping experience all the more fun.[/p]

I multi box/mentor to help me and my friends to level faster. Yes, I said frriends. A mullti boxer can multi box with oether people! Oh and whats wrong with talking to yourself!?! I had a very knowledgeable conversation between two of my characters, and another one of my friends today!

[p]I'm absolutely amazed at all of the narrow-minded, judgemental stereotypes those against multi-boxing have pinned on the people that do it.[/p][p] Guess what, all people are different. Did you know that? You can not, ever, make accurate broad sweeping statements about a group of individuals defined by a single criteria (in this case, whether they multibox or not). [/p][p]I don't multi-box, but I'm offended by the views of some of you here just because I'm a human being that actually respects individuals until they, as an INDIVIDUAL, lose that respect. [/p][p]Wouldn't it be a much nicer world to live in if more people had the sense to judge each individual on their merits, after taking the time to learn what those are, instead of trying to put others into little boxes defined by one single aspects of who they are, what they do, or where they come from? *sigh*[/p][p] [/p]

I'm in a similar situation - I live in a time zone where I am playing very late at night USA time. Basically when I get home from woke at 5pm my time, it is midnight or later USA time and all my guildies are just logging off, not fun really. I did have a good late night crew that I ran with, but they weren't always on, so 2 boxing became a good option. When I bought the collectors edition the only way to take advantage of the free month was to open a second account, so I began running a second chacter on another PC and found it a lot of fun. I used it for farming, levelling and generally adding another dimension to the game.

[p]Boxing = Multiple accounts being played by one person[/p][p]Botting = A program that uses macro's to autoattack, autoassist or other things like crafting. Most of the time the player does not even neeed to be at his/her computer.[/p][p] [/p][p]There's a big difference. One is against the EULA and one isnt. [/p][p]Their both 2 different things and I dont think alot of people understand that.[/p]

[p]In college atm so cant type alot. [/p][p]I 2box on the same computer, I have my warlock and my gf's fury and when she plays I get on my Ranger. Now she cant always be on to play with me since I dont get off work untill 1am central time usally. Ever tried to get a group after 1am central time during the week? Its almost impposible. [/p][p]Another thing I like to be able to log on for 5min or 1hour or what ever and be able to log off since im on call 24/7 at work. I dont want to be a burden to a group when we are 1/2 way through a zone and be like.. "peace" or "L8r I gotta go"[/p]

Used to play from a Lan at work, and we would box other guys accounts just to screw around. It was kinda fun to do the keyboard splitter route and hextupile nuke a few mobs. It gets to be a major pain in the *** after awhile though. Not what I would call "fun", but it was kinda neat to play around with for an afternoon.

[p]A good multi boxer will leverage the most efficient use of macros and casting time combinations possible.[/p][p]The loss of efficiency is usually quite minimal, especially if the class combinations synergy is good and you are aware of the best combination strategies.[/p][p]For example, my conjuror has a lot of slow casting spells and the pet dishes out much of his damage. I can cast a spell and que up an additional to buy myself 5-6 seconds worth of "down time"[/p][p]I can then switch to my mystic, who normally would wait for a tank to gain aggro before casting anways, which also has a lot of slow casting wards/heals (in addition to fast casting CA's thanks to AAs)...so I belt out some fast casting damage, que up debuffs or a ward, swap back[/p][p]Conjuror has just finished 2nd spell, can resume stacking up new spells. In some cases you don't want to spam out the dps lest you gain aggro.[/p][p]I don't tend to multi box in public areas, just because I'd rather not interrupt other folks' game play. Instances are a fun challenge though, especially if you are trying a zone that should require a full group.[/p]

I saw this and i just couldn't help to ROFL =p Click Here

We are talking about the game, aren't we?

Azarroth@Mistmoore wrote:

that is actually a great site. I 3 box and work with a guy who 6 boxes (attempting to find ways around the problems with multi-boxing made me want to 3 box). Xzin has a great setup but he uses a lot more hardware than should be needed. There is just no great way to do this without botting. Big difference between Botting and macroing - Bots react to external input automaticly. Macroing "can be" against the EULA if it allows for unattended play (repeating macros are bad). Basic macroing SoE does not seem to have a problem with. Short duration macros using something like a g15 are ok. Making that same macro run in a never ending loop is not. It is the unattended part that is the problem. Necro/Conj can kill unattended without actually doing anything but letting their pets auto-attack .. this is just as bad as actually botting.

I 6 box and everything I do and use is 100% legal no bots and no external macros. Where I draw the line I guess can best be summarized in the fact that I believe that using short macros in a G15 keyboard is not legal. It is possible to play 6 fairly decently, you just have to plan ahead. You can see my rig here.
Now I am not as effective as a well played group, but if I have seen the encounter and now what to expect my group can out perform many a pickup group. I can clear Unrest and do fairly well in CMM. I often drop a character to help a guildee get there class armour or finish a quest. RL issues make me a poor group partner so I have gone the mult-box path. And mult-boxing is a lot of fun.