But remember, EQ 2 went F2P because the lack of a player base. Without those F2P people you would have no game to pay 15 bucks a month to. We all contribute, and complain together.
It did? Are you able to provide anything to verify that claim? If I am wrong on any of the following, please, let me know. The way I seen it, EQ2 went FTP in an attempt to jump on the FTP bandwagon, a system that was successful for some games, but disasters for others. Also worth noting, is they were very late to the party when it came to FTP. In a rather pernicious move, Smokejumper and Smedley removed the trial accounts from this game, and intentionally made Freeport the only server in the game that a new player could get started without an initial financial outlay. They also redesigned the Everquest2.com website to make it very difficult to anyone to see anything except info and the download versions for the Freeport server. At one point, they also promoted existing players copying (yes, an actual copy) a version of their character to Freeport to bolster the "numbers". After maliciously bleeding new blood from standard servers, and focusing all traffic to Freeport, Smokejumper and Smedley tried to claim that is proof that FTP and extended Cash Shops is what all players want. It was disingenuous at best, but they could not contain themselves as they ham-fisted RMT and FTP upon all servers. Pro-FTP supporters claimed that it was going to bring a surge of new players that would inundate the servers, but for all the existing servers, all it really did was have a few old players pop in before remembering why they quit in the first place, and allow existing members to create an additional 1-5 accounts for what ever reasons they may have. Any sign of a "population boost" (if you actually trust the server status load indicators, happy to elaborate if needed) failed to last 2 months, and little of note changed for actual grouping opportunities. Wind the clock forward to now, and here we are, doing server mergers in 2015. Someone else may look at FTP as a blessing, and savior of EQ2. I view it as a blight due to the way it is implemented. They should take a page out of WoW's book, and set a level cap on any FTP character, a cap of 90 would be more than generous enough.
I could see them implementing a level cap unlocker in the marketplace. 10 bucks per 10 levels......Oh god I just gave them an idea........
Smedley and Smokejumper well guess we should just dwell in the past and not move forward. Without any type of hard data I would still have to think that ftp community members spend money on the game. What's a better profit selling hundreds of dollars from the cash shop to an addicted hoarder or 15 bucks a month for a single sub? I would wager there are plenty of subbers that have plenty of ftp accounts and spend piles of cash on all sorts of things. Also you can't get to lvl 100 in this game unless you buy xpac content. ijs
F2P vs P2P will always be a point of discussion, but even if they were to implement a queue system for the F2P portion of the community permanently, this is new how? Other MMO's utilize this approach. One example. Archeage; this was especially burdensome at launch--players that reallllly wanted in without queue had to sub. Heck, in that game, if you were not subbed you could not even own a House or Farm (a necessity in that game.) If you stopped subbing--POOF house and all that went with were toast. Sub in EQ2 for a while, decide not to sub...no biggie. There may be a few toons you can't use or some Ancient Spells til next time you sub--when you do, they are all there. It's the magic of Norrath.
Who said anything about not moving forward? The current team inherited a poorly designed FTP model, which was devised by people who no longer work for the company as it stands today. Would be nice to see the current team fix it. I have noticed a trend where people tend to say something that equates to "I am sure there are many users who spend piles of cash on FTP accounts.". This does not even qualify as being anecdotal, it is more a claim of faith (belief with no evidence). There has been some, but not many, people claim they spend piles of cash on FTP accounts. In these cases, I present the argument that if they are really spending piles of cash, but a subscription is not on their list of purchases, then the FTP system is far too generous, and/or the rewards for subscription need significant improvement.
I will use Rift's ftp model as a comparison which I consider to be very well done. In Rift as a ftp player, I have access to all the content (other than new expansions), I get the same customer service as subscribers, I can talk in all the chat channels, I can use the in game mail system, I can buy and sell on the broker, if I buy a mount all of my characters on the same account can claim it, I get a free daily gift for logging in, I also get any free in game promotional gifts that subscribers also get and the list goes on. EQ2's ftp doesn't even remotely compare to that. Rift subscribers get extra currency (earn +15% currency), bonus experience (40% xp boost), etc. Really to many to type out so here is the link (http://www.trionworlds.com/rift/en/store/#become-patron). Also, their marketplace has a ton of variety and is constanty being updated and rewards you extra free items for the more you spend. All in all I love EQ2, but I don't think it is the best value out there for ftp or subscribers. It is not the worst, but not the best either.
Yeah, thanks for the link. One of the benefits of being a subscriber (they call it Patron on Rift): PRIORITY QUEUE - Move to the front of the line when your shard is full. I wish EQ2's subscription service included that as a feature, for when server loads reach a point that performance may be compromised.
I would prefer to have servers that were not merged to the point that the population was causing performance issues. Normally, when the population grows to a point that all players can't play without performance issues from the server, another server is launched. In this case, the opposite took place, and servers were closed and merged ("consolidated"). If the company has merged too many players together, that is a mistake by the company. I do not see why companies so often overreact in these things--it happens all too often--like instead of making an adjustment in a class or an item, they tend to nerf it all to crap. What bothers me in all this is if they are having problems with server performance right now, with the current number of players, what is going to happen when the new expansion launches and population makes a big jump in numbers? I'm still withholding final judgement, but I still feel like they may have overdone it on merging too many people together on each server. We will see....
Fact is, since the ftp model was instated by soe, a lot of people found they could do without things like the mail or broker most of the time. Seriously, when there is 5 people logged on all day, who is buying off the broker or sending mail anyway. As far as double tokens, no grouping means who cares if X2 of nothing is still nothing. Sub to me was worthwhile when I was making plat selling broker items. It isn't worth it to me anymore. Subbing just to log to new merge server isn't enticing me either and when it happens on skyfire, ill just play when I can or not. Sure wont buy xpacs to sit in qs. oh hells no If they want to rescind ftp they should just sack up and do it and take the massive hit. A slow leak or a gush, people are bailing over these continued problems. Im not saying people shouldn't just try to deal and lets all just get over this hump together kinda thing...but whats really happening is you are screwing with peoples cozy little routines. I know when I cant get my coffee I start to get aggravated. so it is when people have been in the habit of logging and doing w/e they like whenever they like. If its pissing you off enough to quit, just pay the damn sub and quit crying about the wait times or just deal with it because you aren't paying.
I've been around Everquest since 1999, and I think the F2P model is one of the best business decisions they've ever made. Certain games can demand $15/month from everyone, but the F2P model allows the casual gamer (someone that's not online every week, or even every month) to enjoy the game, contribute to the community, and pay a small 'tax' for certain services (i.e. the broker) that amounts to a lesser contribution for lesser use of the game. Could they improve the F2P model? Absolutely. I think the elimination of the Silver tier was a mistake; plenty of people would pay $5/month for unlimited Broker and Chat access. I also think Gold could come with more benefits (like an always-on 25% xp boost). I think they've done pretty well on the Marketplace, I really appreciate that Marketplace items 'augment' the game and are not a necessity. That said, there's a few obvious scams on there (vitality potions) that could be more appropriately priced and I would guarantee DBG would earn more revenue from Walmart-style "more sales at a lower price" on those micro-transactions. All that aside, this "queue" that temporarily existed was one of the biggest displays of apathy I've seen in recent years. They pretty much blocked F2P accounts from the new servers for 2 weeks with zero regard to those customers. Having been F2P on-and-off again since 2012, it's insulting to think the sum of my micro-transactions (char slots, features, mounts, etc) meant nothing to DBG and they couldn't find a better way to handle this additional "strain" on the server. They justified the queue by saying first-time logins put a strain on the server. Okay, fine, make the people logging in for the FIRST TIME sit through the queue and swim thru a reasonable bottleneck. After you'd logged a F2P account in once, why would it ever need to wait in the queue again?? How were the subsequent logins of a F2P account straining the server? Was the server not designed to handle the expected population?? Ultimately, it seems to just amount to laziness, and/or ineptitude, that they would design a queue that not only filters every account, regardless of first-time login or not, but then also blocks a certain type of player who might be spending more each month in micro-transactions than the average All Access member. Having both an understanding of programming and finance, I would say this decision was rooted wholly in developer convenience; they limited server load with a low-brow solution that essentially screwed over a population of gamers that I would most certainly bet contribute a double-digit percent of their monthly revenue. That's not what I would consider a "wise" choice from a customer satisfaction and/or bottom line perspective.
I will say this . I had an issue were my account has the pre order , also a chrono sittin gon the account . My account lapsed went FTP. so aI could not log in and consume the chrono. Holly took care of it pretty fast . I had to put it on a certain level first . But I will say she got it handled fast . But im one on a million in this regard
Those "mysterious third parties" who might not be a subscriber, and might be spending piles of cash on FTP accounts... I stand by what I said earlier in this thread, in that regard. You're allowed to think of it as laziness and ineptitude... All power to you, that is your opinion. It is my opinion that the implementation of the queue was a considered, informed choice to look after the primary source of income. If we both proclaim to have back-seat-driver degrees in the "understanding of programming and finance", where does that leave us? The best evidence to put on the table is that the 2nd round of mergers (creating Halls of Fate) still went ahead, despite the first round of mergers (Maj'dul) resulting in FTP queue implementation. One thing everyone can agree on, is that DBG wants money. If FTP accounts truly were such a cash cow, DBG would have held off on merging the servers to create Halls of Fate, until the memory issues and queue requirements were fixed.
(Written to Daybreak) (Part 1 of 2) "I wanted to launch a formal complaint, but knew not where to do so. This is the only place I could see to be able to, in my hopes, to get my concern across. Currently I am a paid member. However, this is not always so. I am disabled and on a very limited income. In the past I was a constant paying customer, buying a years worth of game play at a time. Life happens and events change how people have to live. My circumstance left me disabled and unable to pay for a game I love. Being able to play for free is now my only form of entertainment as I don't get to go out and do things anymore. This last month I was blessed to have enough money to pay for one month. But that month will come to an end. Like me, I know there are lots of other people out there where circumstances just don't work in their favor and they cannot pay to play all the time. But these customers are loyal ones... These customers pay when they can, what they can and purchase through other means that the game offers (marketplace). Lately it has come to my attention that there is now a queue in place on free to play players. This queue can last anywhere from 2 hours to 15+ hours. How fair is it to "punish" your player base in this fashion? All players are equal and all players matter. No matter if the player is paid or the player is free, all players put time and their own money into your game. Limiting a free to play player in this fashion not only hurts the player, but hurts you as a company. Overtime you will see a drop in player base and their money goes out the door with them. For those of us who are in a bad situation monetary wise, free to play is the way we can enjoy the game. Kicking free to play players out the door is a sure way to only cut your own throats. Not everyone has the money to pay, which is why free to play has been so great. Has is the key word here for it has been great until recently. Now, like I said before I am currently paid. Even as a paid member I see how unjust this is for the player base as a whole. The recent server mergers will soon turn into a merger of all servers into one if players are being discriminated against in this fashion. Just because a player is free to play, they are now deemed as not important and put into a long queue that is beyond ridiculous. This wait time is far beyond fair, even for being free. Perhaps someone should put their selves in the shoes of their customers and think about how the players feel? How would you yourselves feel if you were free to play and suddenly you had to try logging in a day in advance just to be able to play for even one hour in the day? How would you feel? I've seen the posts players have been making, the comments that have been said. People are not happy; the players are not happy. These players are seeing how unfair, unjust and how discriminatory it is against those that are free to play. Just because a person is free to play, does not make that player unimportant. All players matter. ALL players matter. This comes from a player who is not free to play now, a player who spends all she can when she can. What about all the rest who have paid their share? This queuing is a major concern that someone should look into and resolve before too many player leave the game and Daybreak finds themselves merging all servers into one. I hope my concern is read and taken into serious consideration. I mean no offense, just simply a concerned player for the fate of a game so many people out there love. Thank you for your time. I hope to hear back from someone concerning what seems to be a very serious and growing issue. I feel like I should clarify one comment I had mentioned. Thank you for reading this and taking the time to do so, so please bare with my example. African Americans were once discriminated against. When African Americans were on the public bus and a white person boarded, these African Americans had to give up their seat, move to the back of the bus and stand merely because of the color of their skin. African Americans were not deemed equal, the same, and were being shown they did not matter in comparison to white Americans. This is exactly how free to play players are being treated now. A free to play player is deemed not important, equal and the same, all because they do not pay monthly like paid members. However, all players do matter. Pushing a free to play player to the back of the log in list by forcing them into unfair, more than ridiculous queue times that are unjust is no different than forcing an African American to the back of the bus to stand. That is why I stated it is discrimination against free to play players. You are telling these players that they do not matter. Before it didn't matter if a person was free to play or paid, all players got to log on and off when the player had time to play. Now free to play players are forced to the "back of the bus" and into these long and ridiculous queue times. These players are no longer equal, these players are being told they do not matter anymore. Their time and what money they put into the game matters not. These players aren't able to log in and play the game because the times that these players are able to play is taken over by a queue list. So days go by and free to play players wait... and wait... and wait. Now I am currently a paid player and this is how I see the situation and feel about it. How do you think the free to play players feel? What does the free to play players time cost you? What is the cost of their lost play time? This queue not only effects the free to play players, but Daybreak as a company. It even effects the paid players as well. How does this effect the paid players? Easy enough. Free to play players build relationships and friendships in game with paid players. I've heard and read stories of people coming together in game, building a relationship and getting married. Some of these players now have children and all thanks to Everquest II. These players, paid and free alike, build friendships. These friendships grow in and out of the game. Free to play players join Guilds. Some guilds raid and what happens when a valued member of the guild no longer is able to log on? It hurts the paid players, it hurts the guilds, it hurts the game community. These free to play players also buy the game expansions. They buy the expansions because they want to continue to journey throughout all of Norrath and all the new experiences that await them. By taking the free to play players money, you are saying enjoy the game! Go forth and play! But that statement is contradicted by casting these free players to the back of the bus. You are now telling these free players that you will take their money but they cannot play the game they just paid for. Unfair. Unjust. With all of these added examples, and my previous message, I hope that someone out there reads this and sees how this is a valid and extreme concern. I merely hope my message opens the eyes of those that may read this and help solve a problem that never should have been. Many thanks." As a paid customer I see the negative effect queue has on all players. If a f2p is in a guild with paid customers, that f2p player now misses guild events and the guild will suffer because the guild is down a player (as mentioned above). I play with a member that is f2p and has sent in his own concerns about never being able to log on because of the queue. Players play on their own time. Players log in when the player themselves are able to log in. Not all people can play at the same time, and not all players can log in when the restrictions are not in place on them. Before now, f2p players were able to log on at their times of being able to play. By initializing the queue the rights of the players are being taken away. It is the players rights to log in game on their time and that right was given to f2p players. Now people will say, then just sub. As I mentioned above, not all people can afford to sub and pay when and if they can. F2p allowed people to play with fair and just restrictions. However this queue is beyond fair and beyond ridiculous with the length of time a person is forced to wait (not to mention what I previously stated by it takes away a players rights). F2p players are still players. F2p players still pay and purchase when they can and thus are still paying customers, even if it is not on a month to month basis. What happens when all f2p players leave the game? That will be a major drop in paying customers (as mentioned even f2p people purchase things). That is a great deal of money that will go out the door. That also means a lot of people left the game leaving no choice but for more mergers until finally, only one server will remain. This really does effect all players, not just f2p.
(Part 2 of 2) As I mentioned, I know a f2p member. He brought forth his concerns and this is one of the replies he received: "Thank you for contacting Daybreak Games. The server queues are in place to ensure server stability while we sort out all of the kinks of the server merging process. The greatly increased server populations of Maj'dul and Halls of Fate require that we place queues on the servers to ensure that the servers remain up. If the servers were to crash without the queues, no one would get to play at all. No amount of planning can remedy unforeseen kinks in the merging process. If you'd like to bypass the queue altogether, you can purchase an All-Access membership. That is an advantage afforded to our members while we sort out the servers' stability. I apologize for the inconvenience. Regards, TSR Gary B. Technical Support Representative" Seems fair, right? When he posed the questions on what happens if all f2p players subbed, what happens to the servers then? There was no response. So, what would happen if a good majority of f2p player subbed? If there really is an issue then those now paying members, along with everyone else, will notice they cannot play. Which means merging 3 servers into 1 was far too great of a stress on the server. Has it not been 2 servers in 1 in the past? Daybreak only did this to themselves at that point. But what happens if a good majority of f2p players subbed, or all, and there are no issues that was being mentioned? Then the queue on the f2p players are for nothing. In either case this is bad business on Daybreak's part. This is bad business because f2p players are being punished for Daybreak's own issues. If they could foresee the stress then why convert so many servers into one? Why purposely go into it knowing players were going to be kicked aside, pushed aside, and told they cannot play? That is bad business and punishing players for Daybreak's own mistakes. Don't take it out on the players. The queue, period, is just bad business for all reasons mentioned above. If there would be no issue and it is all a ploy to get people to sub then the community should be told and notified of the motives.In any case, these issues should have been thought about fully before venturing into a merger that effects so many people. Since I addressed my own concerns to Daybreak I was told to simply post on the forums. I merely hope to only have Daybreak, in the very least, realize the issues at hand. ALL players matter. Thank you all for your time.
Oh dear... You actually made an attempt to compare the implementation of a login queue that prioritizes paying customers, to racial discrimination against African Americans? Daybreak Games provide a luxury service, a form of digital entertainment. After some hunting around on the web, I was unable to find anything to support claims they are discriminating in any way. http://www.eeoc.gov/laws/types/ - While focused on the topic of employment, still a valuable resource. No obvious issues. http://www.justice.gov/crt/types-employment-discrimination - Similar content from Dept. of Justice. No obvious issues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_in_the_United_States - Despite being Wikipedia, it provided plenty of nice information, and links to various forms of legitimate concern in the "See Also" section. No obvious issues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_anti-discrimination_acts#.C2.A0United_States - Another good reference for types of actual real discrimination. No obvious issues. http://www.unesco.org/new/en/social...ernational-migration/glossary/discrimination/ - United Nations Educational, Scientific, and Cultural Organization website did not reveal anything of concern for what DBG is doing. If I have missed something, please, share the information. Otherwise, after review and further digging around, I am unable to find anything to support your accusations that DBG is engaging in discriminatory activities.
First and most importantly, these queues are temporary. Now let's see should we make the paying customers wait in the long queues? What would hurt the company more, paying clients leaving in droves or f2p players? I'm sorry that you are having financial issues, many of us have or will have. But to seriously compare the lack of a f2p person not being able to log into a game to the plight of civil rights is going beyond imagination and is actually belittling to the fine folks who work long and hard for years towards equality in this country. If you wish to leave due to some imaginary slight then that is indeed your choice, but you win no sympathy from me by trying to compare you being able to play a game for free to the civil rights movement. I was seriously floored by such a comparison and quite frankly deeply insulted. I could say more, but it would most definitely get me banned from these forums so I'll leave it at that. I'm sure that the queues will end shortly if they have not already. Whether you stay or not is up to you. Have a good day.
Too early in the AM for this thread--need more coffee. Lotsa' coffee. Like Moon, if I say more....I'll get banned.
Yet another <sniffle> They're not doing things exactly my way <whimper> so I'm going to go play for free somewhere else!1!!!11 rant. Yawn. Yes, the queues must be a PITA. Rather the entire server merge be a crashfest instead? They had to gate some people in order to keep some control over server loads. You ain't no victim here: they aren't blocking your rights. You don't have any per playing an MMO! Surprise! They could pull the plug tomorrow and those of us who PAY for our gaming experience, would see all our investment go POOF. How much do you stand to lose? Hint: in your case, time isn't money.
