Wizards Next Expansion

Discussion in 'Casters' started by kizant, Jun 16, 2019.

  1. Mookus Elder

    After having observed the trade-offs of other classes I no longer ascribe to the Stockholm syndrome notion that my wizard should tradeoff his DPS after a few minutes. We need more burst and more sustained.

    The trade-off wizards have is the fact that we can't tank named or have a pet that can do so either. Wizards need to be higher dps than anyone that can tank or pet tank a named in almost all situations.

    Or maybe we just need a pet at this point.
    Endaar, Xurn, Skewert and 1 other person like this.
  2. Travestii Journeyman

    Stating the obvious here, but a copy/paste of upgrades for wizards would be yet another relative/passive nerf to the class.

    I don't believe any of those actively playing wizards decided to roll a fragile cloth class with no solo ability and little utility in order to wield relatively mediocre dps.
    Endaar and Renotaki like this.
  3. kizant Augur

    Nobody is talking about burning for 4 minutes. The burn ends with ITC and 2nd spire which is around 80 seconds into the fight. 4 minutes is the point where all wizard abilities are finished and our dps is very low. The ideas here involve increasing burn dps during the first 30 to 60 seconds, extending the burn time itself by 6 to 10 seconds, and adding counters to things like FD to keep a small to moderate dps increase for an additional period after the burn is completed. Adding 20 FD counters would last maybe 1 minute given twincast rates and abilities that use extra counters. And would be finished before the 4 minute mark, which is only itself used as a guide because that's what the devs decided on for our ability durations.
    Sancus and Renotaki like this.
  4. kizant Augur

    The devs may only have time for copy/paste and do minor changes which is why I think the majority of our suggestions should be kept to things easy to implement.

    However, it doesn't hurt to list a few new ideas because, who knows, they may be able to do one of them. Or at least keep them in mind while implementing other things to help make the harder things easier to do in the future.
    Sancus likes this.
  5. Fintank Augur

    What if you guys got a new AA that didn't really change anything that doesn't exist currently in how your DPS operates. I assume it'd be easier to get on a "class balance" perspective than what you guys actually want/need. Granted the last time I was remotely serious about raiding on my wizard was in TBM so I am a bit out of touch, so this idea could quite possibly be absolute garbage. However, I'm willing to try just for the possible Sancus and Kizant likez!

    In regards to Burst DPS I've only seen you all mentioning "bigger damage" stuff, which naturally is kind of how you get more Burst DPS. What about speed though? Clerics get an aa called "Celestial Rapidity" that cuts spell cast time in half (50%) and Warriors get a group ability that decreases spell cast time by 40%. So, if Wizards got an AA akin to that would that not help in the same vein? I personally can't see it altering the class at all or making them OP. I assume being able to fit nearly double (probably) the amount of spells in the same time frame would give a tremendous amount of DPS to your Burst.

    Granted, I know the Burn is predominantly charge based so you would "burn out" a lot quicker too. Theoretically though, you would also gain more casts while under ADPS due to the nature of casting more spells, even once your burn is over. So this *should* also help with sustained DPS even if that's not the sole purpose of it.

    Plz don't bully me, I mainly play Melee toonz :(
    Sancus and kizant like this.
  6. menown Augur

    New abilities don't require another button push. You can add new abilities to old ones for a combination effect. Think of one of your burns that may last 5-8 ticks, and then add the force proc ability to it.

    Anyways, I'm also torn on more of these abilities being implemented. These abilities have caused massive lag in raid environments. But, I do see quite a fun factor for wizards getting this type of AA. They can maybe choose specific procs in the future for spamming (e.g., lifetaps, debuffs, mana taps, DDs).

    Wish you the best of luck with your endeavors.
    kizant likes this.
  7. kizant Augur

    I certainly wouldn't mind an SPA 501 type ability that took 0.5 seconds off casts that we could time around quick time. And if any class has extra room for things to click I would think it would be Wizards. We've always needed less AAs than most and don't have a lot of ability conflicts to worry about. Nobody should worry about us getting one more thing to activate.
  8. Brohg Augur

    I assumed precisely that mechanic and that's exactly the point I intended. Anything that stacks with our current burns would be powerful but not interesting because they wouldn't change game play.
  9. Wolfimus New Member

    Honestly, just uninstall the game like so many have done. It's a lot nicer when you get to a game that actually doesn't take 2 months for an update.
  10. Yinla Augur

    If they don't have time to do AA's properly they shouldn't be doing a level increase. We lost out to melee a lot last expansion due to the lack of AAs.
    Spellfire likes this.
  11. Cragzop Augur

    Please stop whining about the level increase in this and other threads. It has been announced. It's time to accept it.

    TBL was not a level increase and we saw NO new AA lines from that expansion and everything that you could buy was simple cut and paste (some very poorly done across the classes).

    Being concerned about limited (or no) aa and spell growth is fine … and you should post specifically about that if for you, it is a worry. Kizant's comments are right on the money … don't waste a lot of time with pie in the sky ideas and focus on small, tangible upgrades.

    The losing out to melee was not just a TBL thing and not just an AA thing. For example, you can look at the resists on mobs and the changes that were implemented on caster debuffs (yes, some got changed...but the fact that they went after those tells you they think casters hit too often). And I expect it to happen even more with the next expansion. The devs seem to be missing something regarding melee vs spell damage … and I don't think they have given any indication that they think melee is winning big (it is).
  12. Yinla Augur

    So many of our AAs need any overhaul instead of the usual cut and paste.

    Force of Ice and Flame should have the same cool down timer as Force of Will.
    Range needs looking at for our AAs - should be the same distance as regular spells.
    They need to give us something to use when we have no mana or stop giving us mobs which mana drain! :rolleyes:
    Give us something to use our End on, being we have it coming out of our ears now with all the regen AAs we've purchased.
    Mana recovery needs to be looked at.
    Manaburn needs a major boost and returning back to a single nuke or they need to increase the debuff slots on a mob, also need to remove the 1 wizzy only restriction. SKs and necros don't have this restriction, we shouldn't either.
    Our burns need looking at so they are on the same cool down instead of 3 or 4 different times.
    The AA the same as our flux staff desperately needs upgrading, though I think I'd rather have a quest to upgrade the staff than an AA.

    Spells - they need to look at cutting back on spell lines we don't use, no point in wasting time copying and pasting things we don't use. AE needs to be revamped totally, melee should not be out performing casters and we should have the same mob limit as they have. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander as they say.

    They also need to look at the soft caps for eveything especially AC, we get the least returns of any class on AC but the mobs are hitting harder than every, AC on caster gear, runes, etc should be re-evaluated. Being 1 rounded before you can do something about it is not fun.

    This is before you start looking at the things we have been asking for forever, eg TL to 3rd & 4th bind, TL to Guild banner, etc. I still live in hope for a single target snare, especially as we seem to be having more and more content with a mix of good guys and bad guys.

    After the changes to TLs this month I'd like an AE TL that only lands on guild members! Casting an AE TL in Beza to get those who gated out of the raid back to the guild hall land on someone exp there and putting us all in combat is a major pain in the butt.

    Casters need a lot of love next expansion, I just hope they are giving Dzarn the time to do the job properly as they certainly didn't for TBL.
  13. Yinla Augur

    The main problem as I see it is the global spell cool down, casting faster will do nothing for the spell cooldown period, we need something else to do while waiting for spells to refresh so we can cast something. The 3 forces don't refresh fast enough to keep rotating them.

    Maybe instead of casting faster we get a Tripple or Quadruple cast AA. Personally I'd rather see it number of cast restricted rather than time.....triggering twin cast is always a magnet for a run away emote! :rolleyes:
  14. Renotaki Journeyman

    Oh yeah, another idea that I think would be really fun is a PB AE version of Stormjolt Vortex.

    - It can be the same timer/ reuse timer as normal storm-jolt.
    - Can give it somewhere in the ballpark of 5k base damage.
    - Reduce the spell damage mod from 55 - 110% to something like 30 - 70%

    Also, as a side thought, normally wizard AE damage is highly uniform as long as all enemies get hit critically (or hit within the max damage range in the cases of our splashes and Self-Combustion) and this new spell would add some dissonance to our AE damage range while giving it a nice boost/ others a nice boost.
  15. Beimeith Augur

    We're never going to see triple cast or quad cast. Don't waste your breath. It's right up there below epic 3.0s on the never going to happen list.
  16. Brohg Augur

    ooo, a Bold Idea for Ethereal Combo (115):

    Twincast Blocker
    1: Cast: Ethereal Ice (25% Chance)
    2: Cast: Ethereal Magic (25% Chance)
    3: Cast: Ethereal Fire (25% Chance)
    4: -6k mana and Cast: Dissident Fire(which really oughtta be chromo) AND Cast: Ethereal Combo (25% Chance)

    Kinda randomly eff your whole mana bar, but m'fers are gonna know your nuke hit :)
  17. kizant Augur

    Ethereal Combo is an interesting idea and also reminds me of the one thing that usually gets ignored when talking about the spell with highest base damage. Braid can proc an additional Ethereal and if we look at overall damage per cast instead of per hit then obviously it has the potential to do more damage than most anything. But it is very limited compared to other spells which can be cast quicker and are more often. The small advantage it might have in overall damage doesn't mean too much.

    So, maybe it's time to just update the existing Weave/Braid. Lower the re-use time significantly, maybe increase the chance to proc the additional Ethereal or lower cast time. On say a 60 to 80 second burn we currently get 3 to 4 casts off assuming forced rejuvenation is used. If the re-use time was cut in half we could get 4 to 6 casts and if the cast time were 1.5 instead of 3.0 overall we could get another Ethereal or two in as well. I don't think it would have a large impact on sustained but would help with a burn while still keeping DPS kinda random since you need to get lucky and proc extra Ethereals.
  18. Renotaki Journeyman

    If they wanna mess with Ethereal Braid, then an alternative if we wanna focus on using it to augment our burst damage could be by introducing a new burn similar to what Shadowknights have in Gift of the Quick Spear. For SKs, it lowers the reuse time of their spear nuke and guarantees that it will be twincast. So for Ethereal Braid, it would be guaranteeing that you get the second ethereal to proc while the burn is running, and reduce the reuse timer by 27 seconds. Obviously the reuse time could be debated, I just say 27 seconds because that would make the reuse time into what Volley of the Many is, with our mage counterparts. Also the burn could probably last a lot less time than the SK equivalent does due to the strength of the burn... maybe more like a minute since really short burns are where wizards are falling behind the most.

    Even if we don't get anything else for burst, just that in itself would be a really cool way to boost wizard burst. Lorewise, the burn would be like the wizard temporarily gains slightly better control over a spell that he can hardly control normally.
    kizant likes this.
  19. Renotaki Journeyman

    Oh also- naturally can replace "Ethereal Braid" for whatever the new one will be next expansion on level increase.
  20. Ezbro Journeyman

    Clean up the messiness and consolidate and focus the class to be top DPS caster. Why the hell should Wizard not be?? Less spastic keyboard mashing is also needed! I am not 12 and playing wow.
    Petalonyx likes this.

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