Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Kimbella, Oct 22, 2019.
Apologies if I've missed a comment from Devs.
If this change goes through with timed release on raid access. Is it safe to say that Dev's will be going back and applying this same change to past expansions, essentially opening them up.. TBL,ROS,EOK.. etc.?
I participate in an open raid force. We're usually working on raids an expansion or 2 behind current content, but we are still constantly running into flagging issues simply because the raid force changes week to week. Flags are still a problem even dropping more of them hasn't really changed anything.
It would seem silly to me to open up current content from the hurdle of flagging, but still have older content locked down.
We beat our final T2 raid 2nd April, be beat our first T3 raid 29th May, with this new system those not in the top 10 will have a shorter time period to unlock the next tier or raids. From what I remember Aalishia went down the same night we tried it, if not it was the following night. The delay in beating our first T3 wasn't due to difficulty it was getting enough flags to even attempt it. Being on AB we lose at least 1 raid night a month due to patches/maintenance, with the new system this won't matter so much as we aren't missing out on the possiblity of flags.
While those in the top 10 guilds will be slowed down by around a month, those guilds behind them will actually speed up quite a bit and hopefully with a month between tiers have each tier down before the next one unlocks. With the exception of UEE all raids went down within a short period of time after trying them for us, our main issue is and always has been flagging.
We got to UEE at the wrong time of year, just as everyone was starting to taking vacations, so for the Summer we didn't try UEE, over the last few weeks we have been learning UEE and hopefully it will be down before the next expansion hits. It is a complicated raid and not easy to see what all the mechanics are. We get to 49% consistantly, we just need to work out from there what is the best way for us to proceed.
Our youngest is 18 (he plays with his father), our oldest is in his 70's, most seem to be in their 40's, we have a lot of husband and wife teams.
Keep this system and try it , keep the servers locked till like 8pm est on the days the tiers drop and level the playing field for MOST guilds. ( The time is just a suggestion , theres no perfect time for everyone , someone wont like it. ) This would have most guilds in the game starting a time when MOST guilds raid.
Would be interesting to see if every guild started at the same time rather we would see the same results in the race to first contest.
There is still a race. It just will not start until March 2020, only involve three raids, and involve a lot more potential winners because more guilds would have defeated the first six raids already before T3 starts (as opposed to before when ROI would open up T3 first and be the only guild to attempt those raids).
No one has ever cared who the top ten was on raids 1-8 of an expansion. The only thing that matters is where you finished on UEE, Talendor, etc. That has always given your overall ranking. I can see where some people might be upset because there are more guilds who could overtake them, but wouldn't that really bring out some serious competition? If ROI, MS, Triton, SR, RA, ROV, ROTE, etc are all at the same spot on the day T3 opens in March 2020, that is going to be very intense competition. I am not saying that there is going to be an overhaul of the top ten; but rather that the chances of that happening are far greater with 6-12 guilds at the same spot on T3 release than guilds getting days/weeks/months head start on T3 over others...
People are annoyed because we have 3 more months of raiding TBL and GMM. That's why. You think we're just not going to raid at all or raid 1 hour a week?
If raids are challenging no one cares about the race part of it. But raids are usually NOT really that challenging. Mearatas was an outlier. In the prior two expansions it was more about bugs in the only raids that weren't beaten first day.
@absor: Whats the possibility of having a "sliding difficulty scale" much like normal/hard/insane modes to tune up your own raid forces version of a fight for an extra 1/2/3 pcs of loot or something to that effect...how much more difficult would that be to code in when theres only 6 or 7 raids if all it requires is adding hp/mob hitting harder/enrage timer etc? I feel like that's something you could look at mid summer or after an expansion has been beaten that may keep people interested, or may bring people back to the game even
That isn't much different to how it was in TBL. It is only a month later not 3.
TOV - You have 4 weeks you cannot raid, January you get T1, February you get T2, March you get T3
TBL - Mid December you got T1, 7 weeks (end of Jan) you got T2, 7 weeks (mid March) you got T3
If you raided lockouts you got there a bit quicker. but from what I've read most guilds don't raid lockouts so for them the time they arrive at T3 will be roughly same as it was for TBL.
Here is an update from Absor for anyone interested who doesn't have beta forums access to see the other thread..
So assuming DBG is going to release at 9 am PST for each of of tiers, I would like to see those release days on a Saturday (or on Sunday as a distant second choice).
If you release them on a weekday, the majority of the top 10 guilds that do compete/race will have to now take three days off of work. While I understand that some people work on Saturdays, weekends are when the majority of people have days off work which would minimize impacts on jobs.
Astral can you please stop posting passive aggressive pictures its triggering me
Yall make me giggle..
Yall seriously think its not going to be the exact same top 10 as its been for how many expansions.
Yall seriously think guild's who did not make the top ten.. ever .. actually have a chance to make the top ten now..
Because of a "start" time on when raids are released..
The very same guilds will remain in the top ten as they have for quite some time. Because they are the one's who put in the effort an push harder then most ..
Thee only way the top ten could conceivably change .. would not be holding raids back .. it would be giving lock out times for losses / wipes .. AS WELL AS .. lock outs an timer's for wins..
Because if THATS .. what happened (Arx mentis style one off had lock outs even if you failed) Anyone who attempt's it (winning or not) catches a lock out guess what ..
That would ultimately change the top ten guilds in a massive massive way.
Its like this .. those guilds who berely beat EoK , RoS, TBL .. now have LESS time to beat the T3 raids .. Guess what that translates into ..
Less time to beat / learn it .. mean's LESS attempts .. Less attempts mean's higher degree of mess up's happening..
Follow that through to its logical conclusion .. mean's those guilds that berely were able to down EoK , RoS , TBL completely .. have 3 entire month's worth of LESS attempts at it ..
I do not understand how yall think its going to just magically not matter now ..
I feel like there is potential for change depending on how hard the raids are.
There are 11 guilds that have beaten Mearatas as of this post, and they would obviously be front runners. I know there are some other guilds that have not beaten Mearatas but have shown some significant talent in the past that are going to use this change to their benefit.
Obviously Crimson Tempest is the number one guild that comes to mind, I suspect they will be pushing very hard to get back into the top 10, if not the top 5.
Iratus Lepus, Township Rebellion, Inverse Logic and any of the other guilds that beat Aalishai raid, but not Mearatas certainly stand a chance to move up the list this year if the playing field is level and flags are not a factor.
I am definitely more excited for the race this year than I have been ever before, and it amuses me that people think the race is dead. Quite to the contrary, there are a whole lot more names in the race this year than any expansion in recent memory.
Thee only way to negate "the race" / lock outs .. would be to either remove completely .. all lock outs or to lock every thing up even fails.. thus stopping the race.
You may want to rethink that, this actually means those who are slower have more time to beat the later raids. The only people who will be slower reaching T3 will be those who raid lockouts.
Everyone will be able to attempt T3 in March regardless of raids beaten. While most guilds will still do the raids in tier order, if there is a gatekeeper it can be skiped and gone back to. A lot of the guilds in 11 - 20th place on this years EGL board shouldn't take a whole month to get 3 raids down. Meaning we should see more guilds doing T2 raids when they are released, while it will take those not in the top 10 longer to get the 3 T2 raids down, it shouldn't take them a month. More guilds getting to T3 in March before the Summer vacations hit will hopefully mean a few more guilds get the expansion beat.
To put it another way
Previously they had to get X amount of keys to progress, which this expansion was 21 /3 = 7 weeks. The way this is being done content unlocks once a month 4/5 weeks (1 month after launch).
So they gain 2 or 3 weeks at least before they can attempt the next tier. Many of them don't raid over the holidays anyway so they won't be as concerned with the raids not starting until January.
14 weeks after TBL was released was 19th March 2019. For those who stuck to a weekly raid schedule and didn't raid lockouts that is the soonest they would have unlocked T3.
If as we suspect TOV is released 10th December, that would mean with this plan that T3 would unlock on or around 10th March.
The slower guilds will have more time not less to complete the raids, simply because they haven't got to farm keys/flags.
Those who raid once a week will get to T3 at roughly the same time they have previously.
Those who raid lockouts will take a little longer but will be better geared to tackle T3.
@Whulfgar: I disagree with your laughing off the thought of the top 10 changing for ToV. Some guilds just clear some raids faster than others. We've all been playing long enough and we've all seen it. Some nights everything just clicks, and people come out to play. Other nights, not so much! Even the best teams in any given sport can have a bad night. Also, with set tier "launch" days, people can book days off to guarantee their presence (in most cases) and hopefully guarantee their respective guilds a better chance at success, and ultimately a better chance at potentially moving up the EGL serverwide leaderboard. I'm sure 5 or 6 of the top 10 will remain the same, I'll agree with that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all to see some new tags in the top 5, maybe even the top 3 with this style of unlock.
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