VoA, north part of Valley was a catchup area for pre-90 RoF, Shards landing was very viable at level 90 CotF, were scaling down to 75(and gave currency useful at level 75) TDS, I remember the open zones were very forgiving even if you were undergeared or below level 100, brothers island was popular iirc. TBM, was supposed to scale down to 75, but the devs failed at tuning it correctly! EoK, frontier mountains was super easy and forgiving. GMM, is significantly easier than TBL, with decent drops. ToV, great divide is an excellent catchup zone for the undergeared All of this is intentional, there is at least 1 zone specifically designed for catchup in each expansion with a level increase, RoS is the only exception I can remember(nameds were brutal in that expansion, but you get crafting mats from trash, for some pretty good TS-gear). None of them were made to support a wide level range, but they were designed to be a "catchup path".
You forgot to mention brutal TBL and very forgiving GMM afterthought. I've leveled up from 105 to 113 in GMM with ease and collected TBL T3 equivalent invisible gear as well. Very considered gift from DPG for those who needed catching up.
Sad ToL for early/mid game zones (NONE) Be nice if they have very low required level for gear and max level recommended, so I have a purpose with the new expansion, to run and grab freebees. Hopefully they make 90 required 120 recommended gear. What you think? They will put something like this in the expansion? 70% chance maybe?
TSS was the last expansion they made that gave a path from level 1 to max level. After that, they moved to a model of only creating max level content expansions. I totally get what the original poster is saying, but the game design for expansions has been focused on end game content for the past decade and a half. I would love to see new content added for level 1 to max, new playable classes, and new playable races. Sadly, that will likely never happen again. If you would like to play with others rather than a mercenary, my honest suggestion is to create a character on the Mischief server. They just moved in to the Shadows of Luclin expansion, and you have plenty of time to get caught up and make new friends on that server.
My totally uninformed prediction is that one of tier1 zones in ToL would be "doable" in ToV-gear, at levels slightly below 115. I have no experience with the beta though, so it is just a guess. I wouldn't count on any ToL zones being practical below level 110 though. For gear, I expect them to keep the pattern from the previous expansions. Likely a "req 115"
Uh, more like zero percent chance. I remember when I first started noticing your posts on the forum. I've read through some of the threads and I think even tried to offer some advice / help in some of them. But I must say, you seem to be an insufferable person. If you are even a fraction as annoying in game as you are on the forums, I can understand why nobody would be interested in helping you get to 'END GAME'. Like many others that have posted, I also returned to EQ after a long break [during RoS] - so I understand there are some frustrating elements to work out in the path to max level. That said, I am not sure you're ever gonna be happy with a live server. It doesn't matter if you are max level. ToV and CoV are awful expansions compared to some of those that preceded it. If you aren't having fun in the 80s and the 90s I can almost guarantee you that you won't be having fun at 115 [soon 120] either. Your refusal to acknowledge what everyone is trying to illustrate for you is ridiculously obtuse.
Tier 1 zones in ToL Umbtral Planes and Maiden Eye are populated by trash, which is somewhere in between ToV and CoV trash: similar HP to CoV trash and similar dps to ToV. That is today though, they have adjusted it once already, dunno what it will be at release. Fighting trash in Umbral Planes with my lvl 115 group-geared characters was trivial. Zelnitaks and Goranda were lvl 116-117, no practical difference between those levels. Although, I have not killed alot of mobs in beta. Situation is fluid though, many changes and rebalancing happen rapidly in beta.
Problem is with your breaks and mine, It was sooner, It wasn't a decade later. Its getting worse every expansion with how they've been going about it since HoT.
I think the lack of fun is because you are trying to catch up. Back when I was a fresh returnee(20 levels behind), I focused more on quests I could molo that were fun or told a good story, than on my xp-bar. There is lots of interesting content you can do alone, that might not be the most efficient level-path. But when you are done with it, you will discover that you earned xp anyway. At level 95 I would do "Champion of Alaris" and "Champion of Rain of Fear". Don't focus on xp, enjoy the journey instead! (I actually considered removing my xp-bar from my UI to accomplish this! but I was too lazy to fiddle with my UI )
Me? I was 110 levels behind. Didn't know how to use a fellowship. Didn't understand Tribute or Trophies. Augs left me clueless. I hadn't played since I went off to college, GoD era. I started a brand new 3 box from level 1. When they offered free Heroics in 2020 I added 3 accounts. I didn't 'catch up' until CoV. It's not a race. I was totally uninterested in bypassing all the content I had missed in order to fast track to current content. I primarily play on TLPs, but it took at least 2 years of casual play to have a team of max level, well geared and AA'd characters.
By your standards, the reason they do not make current expansion and take precious time to make "unnecessary" "catch up" zones is because, there's already about 70 (probably more) zones for level ranges 90-115. Why would they need to make more zones for specific level ranges when you won't use the zones that are already available in those level ranges? You have 11 expansions worth of zones (VoA to CoV) that have zones for 90-115. You do not need a new expansion to go and make low level zones and call it "catch up" zones. The GAME is full of CATCH-UP (according to your standards and defition) zones. Mr not relevant here. Let me explain to you why this isn't relevant and why we're looking at it from a "making people re-roll alts" point of view, as a returnee myself. The 95% of the player base is max level. You are not going to waste an entire years worth of work and resources to cater to the 5% of the player base. This game is too old to attract a large enough influx of new players to justify the time and resources to do what you want. This game is no longer concerned with bringing in new people, but about maintaining the current loyal player base. As returning players, our contribution and input is next to nil. All 300 of us that have returned over the last 2 years (those are not good statistics, and yes, clearly made up but you get the point). You make a product that 95% of the playerbase is going to buy, and not one that only 5% will buy. Quick way to go under if you follow that model. The problem is: there's not enough people in the 60-100 level ranges to worry about. And even so, there's 15 years worth of expansions that cover those level ranges to choose from. Creating zones for level ranges from 60-100 will just be creating zones that will continue to remain empty. Because there's not enough returning players to fill those zones. As I said, 95% of the player base is max level and they're looking to progress forward from 115 to 120. So you make a product to maintain and appease that 95%, which is going to have 115-120 zones. If you want something from 90-95, I can list over 10 zones for you. If you want something from 95-100, I can list another 10. If you want zones from 100-110, I can list 20. Creating zones for "mid-game" will just be creating zones that will be empty like the rest of the current "mid-game" zones because there's no one in those level ranges because the majority of the player base is maxed out. The marketing and development team have the numbers. They see the trends. They know there's nothing they can do for this game to bring in the amount of people that would justify the means of spending time and resources on creating "mid-game" zones. The game is slowly dying out. I wish it wasn't so, but that's how life works. Nothing lasts forever. Every generation has their new shiny thing that they like. EQ had it's time in the limelight, and the cost it would take to over-haul EQ and bring it back to the masses is probably so large that the risk isn't even worth considering. TL;DR - there's not enough "returning players" nor "mid-game level characters" to justify making "mid-game" catch up zones. 0% chance for that. Otherwise I would get gear at level 90, and then skip 30 levels worth of gearing and cut out huge chunks of the game, all because my gear levels with me and gets stronger with each successive level. Bad game design. The best you can look at is a revamp of "defiant" gear that covers 80-105 perhaps, with it's own tier system like the current defiant system. And stop worrying about having a purpose in the newest upcoming expansion dude. You have no reason to purchase ToL and no reason to be there. Don't waste your time nor energy on it. I've got a couple 115s, I have a reason to purchase ToL, and yet i'm not going to. I do not even have CoV. I still haven't knocked out but a third of ToVs solo/group achievements. And not to be mean, but you're not even anywhere close to catching up to me. Don't worry about max level. You're just going to hit a different kind of wall and have the same frustrations. I've got a couple 115s, and I'm going back and making alts (just to have experience with all these different classes). Once you hit 115 and you gear out....you log in and do the same thing every day...because there's nothing else to do. Log in, run your mission, get your ore, log out. At least with 85-115 I'm working towards things. So focus on 90-95. Tackle that hurdle Then focus on 95-100 (this was faster for me than 90-95) 100-105 is your next hurdle. You're nowhere near 115. ToV / CoV /ToL should not be on your mind until you get closer to those level ranges or that level of content. You worrying about ToL and them not having zones/gear for you but wanting them to is equivalent to being 8 years old and complaining that they're not making cars to fit your childlike stature. When you get to 13-14 and get close to that driving license/permit, then you can start concerning yourself with cars (just a generalized example for people who like to worry about semantics and technicalities lol). This. During this xp bonus, i was leveling a couple alts (a Berserker and a Shaman and another Ranger), and I was just doing the Hero's Journey quest line (never actually bothered to start it from level 1)....and even without the xp bonus, I would have out leveled the quests. Champion of Rain of Fear is the one I'd recommend. The first few quests leading up to https://rof.eqresource.com/shardslandingmasterhunterschallenge.php are straight kill quests. Then this one is a kill quest. The Mercenary/Partisans achievements for this expansion around 90-100 and all the experienced gained along the way is nothing to sneeze at. When I was leveling my Monk, I was in Shards Landing doing these quests starting at level 92. I was able to molo (with a healer merc obviously), a single blue/white conned mob at a time. 2-3 if they were the weaker mobs (pests, beetles, etc etc). I think by the time I got done with Mercenary and Partisan, I had gone from 92 to 96 (with maybe only 1 or 2 lessons burns in there just grinding away). Roughly 4 levels, in a single zone, just doing quests. 4 levels, 1 zone, in an expansion that was supposed to offer me 5 levels over 4 tiers and 14 different zones. I had a hodgepodge of gear. Some HoT gear from Erudin Burning, some TBM HA gear bought with remnants of tranquility, lots of gear from CotF bought with Marks of Valor from running Gribbles and Neriak 4th gate missions a ton (Monk acted like a good quasi-fourth tank with better than average dps defensives and a good dps output). Got a few decent drops in such as https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=107918 for the Monk as well. Few good augs drop in the zone too.
I share the OP's frustration regarding the mid game. Everything ramps up in damage and difficulty post 65ish in a non-linear fashion for molo players due to the content being designed for groups. They can't change it much because of TLP players, but the returning or ultra rare new players tend to suffer as a result. As others have stated numerous times, there are a plethora of mid level zones to play in already. If you don't plan to be max level soon, hold off on buying the new expansion. It's been this way for a very long time. DPG has no incentive to create any more mid level content like they introduced with TSS (new playable race) at this time. The only way I can see them spending the money and effort is if they were forced to finally upgrade to 64 bit, fix the god-forsaken mess of a UI, and bring the graphics up to 10+ year ago standards. I think a sunset is more likely to happen than any of that by the way. I get your point quakedragon, but this windmill is made of unobtainium. I think a "relatively" easy solution would be a scaling buff that is tied to released expansions. That way it could work for live and TLP as they see fit. They would then have the ability to adjust as needed to achieve the desired results game-wide without having to mess with anything on a ground level. It's a solution similar to what they did with Defiant armor, but doesn't rely on drops. Then they would be able to "tweak" the knobs so to speak.
I have tested Beta and been all over the "new" zones, except for the portals in inner Vex Thal that doesn't seem to be working at the moment. I have checked every bookcase, door and location in every zone. Unfortunately this seem to be the most boring expansion ever created. In fact I am a bit surpriced they call it an expansion. There are only 3 new zones we can call new, the 4 others are pretty much identical as they were in the old version. The 3 new zones are very small, and only Shadow Valley and Basilica Adumbration is something new. Bloodfalls is not my type of zone since I don't raid anymore. Old Vex Thal was one of my favorite zones when it came out back in the days, and the new version seems close to 100% identical. The mobs look pretty much identical, but have higher levels. Even spawn points seem to be identical as the old zone. If it was not for the new level 120 and new spells I would not have purchased this "expansion". I stopped raiding years ago, and beeing a group kind of player I unfortunately find very little content in the new zones. To the devs: Try beeing a bit more creative and make new content next time.
First. Profession servers. I just road a progression server start to end (phinny) so I could see and raid all content. Yes they lose players but don’t dry up fully. You could do the same. Second. You don’t need to spend a year leveling or gearing up to go to the next year of zones playing on live. It takes much less time and you can make the journey easy… more so if you just make a few friends. Third. ToL will be the only content for 115-120. Most 5 level sets have 2 if not 3 coax’s worth of content mostly dedicated to them from level 65 up. There is plenty for returning players to do and new content won’t make that trip any easier then making a friend and doing the existing content
For Daybreak would making a bunch of low level catchup zones be profitable? Would new people sign up to play these? Would enough returning players return to play in these zones? Or would they be ghost towns, taking up resources? Personally, I probably would take a look at the zones and never go back. I have no intentions of re-rolling a new toon. I might make an Heroic character. But I would PL it myself with my 2 level 115, soon to be level 120 mages. Does Daybreak have a research team that discussed this topic? Could it be they came to the conclusion that it would be a waste of time, since there is a lot of content to do in the so called mid-game. Daybreak wants to make money with EQ. Making content few will use is a waste of resources.
Catch up is playing on TLP for like 3 years then xfering to a live server or just sticking with it till it becomes live
Devs vision of Overseer was as a catch up, its not a huge quick catch up, but getting 5 - 10% exp a day from doing nothing, isn't to be ignored, even if you only have a spare 10 minutes on one day you can still get a that 5 - 10% exp. The TS mats also help catch up with gear, often you can find someone in PoK to do you a combine if you have the stuff to make it. If your behind the curve the best zones for your level will most likely be the first zone(s) of a level increase, these were always easier than the level they started at. RoS I think is the only exception, both Overthere and Skyfire are horrid T1 zones. So I'd skip those and go to Gnome Memorial Mountain. There are different kinds of returning players, some want to just get max level ASAP, then there are others who want to see the expansions they missed (these are usually the ones who stick around and are more successful in getting leveled up). The 2nd kind of returning player is the main reason why adding more lower level zones is a bad idea, spreading players out even further than they already are is not a good idea.
You certainly do not need to explain it again. I am certainly not missing the point. I simply disagree with you and you are attacking me for it. You should probably familiarize yourself with the people you are speaking to before you attack them. I have on numerous occasions supported ladder servers and other ways to use progression servers as a way to recruit new players. I have directly contacted the Devs about utilizing hidden illusions as a work around for the race cap, so as to add the ability to launch new races more often. etc etc. Simply put, you are entitled to your opinion. I hear you. I understand your position. I just disagree with you. I don't believe we have the player base to support large leveling expansions like we used to have. I don't believe that EQ, despite being a wonderful game with wonderful lore, can compete with MMOs like New World in drawing enough players, new or returning, to justify large leveling expansions.
TSS and the 1-current max level zones within a single expansion isn't what made TSS a success or popular. It didn't bring in a ton of new players, it made a few return sure. But it wasn't the zone layout for the expansion. It was the new playable Race. New races and classes and a combination of both (we'll ignore the abomination that are Wood Elf Beastlords lol), is what brings people around or out of retirement. The only reason the TSS zones were so popular was because everyone wanted to try out the Drakkin race, and Dragonkin are highly sought after in fantasy based games. And when trying out the new Race, what level did everyone start at? Ah that's right, level 1. Everyone had to re-roll an alt, which brought everyone through all those midlevel zones that you're wanting. So this is why we look at it from a "will this zone make me re-roll an alt to go through it" perspective. Looking at it from a new/returning player standpoint is: will devoting this much time and resources bring in enough new revenue to offset the cost of making this content. Answer is no. You don't spend $500mil on making a movie that you know is going to flop and only bring in $37mil in the box offices. Disclaimer: sorry, this has been bugging me for awhile and wanted to set that straight. OPs view on reality seems a bit tweaked.
