surprisring lack of tlp posts

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by curious2, Feb 3, 2020.

  1. Trevalon Augur

    sounds like the server you want is already out....P99 is that way >>>

    No chanter nerfs - I like all the non chanters (see Rogues) that come here and want chanters nerfed, taking possibly the most boring raiding class and making them terrible in groups. Yep, that's a sure way to make sure you have Chanters for raids!
    code-zero likes this.
  2. Moranis Augur

    P99 has corpse runs...effffff that.

    It's not logical that enchanters can parse multiple times better than the best "DPS" classes in the game - in group play (and situationally in raids). And it's not just enchanters - druids and necros can get on the action, mob pending, but they don't have quite as good of tools to handle the charm pet. Charm is too good.

    On Mangler, my druid's L53 charmed doggy pet in Chardok can, quite literally, out DPS 2 epic monks with room to spare while costing me almost zero mana. Oh, and he has 15,000 HP! C'mon, man.

    Do something else to make enchanters raid-worthy - but in the mean time, nerf the pants off charm.
  3. Hateseeker Augur

    Agreed, when you don't have enchanters available for raiding, remember what you did to their ability to have fun outside of raids.
  4. Skuz Augur

    I thought the changes to charm that were needed already went in, such as named being flagged charm immune (all of them) ?

    Screwing over a key part of what makes Enchanter gameplay fun by nerfing charm is short sighted & selfish to say the least & I am happy to say that so far the current dev crew has made recent common sense changes without unfairly affecting Enchanters who play in the spirit of the game.
    Tymeless likes this.
  5. Moranis Augur

    My only reason for wanting to nerf charm is the simple fact that charming a mob negates the need for traditional DPS classes (or tanks) in group play.

    Who needs a MAG/MNK/ROG/RNG when you can grab a charmer class that can out-DPS the former by two-fold?

    Who needs a SK/WAR/PAL when my charmed chokidai mangler has 15,000hps?

    Puller? Not needed - my charm pet does all this crazy DPS nearly mana free - anyone can pull because they're all FoM.

    I would be OK with charm being a short-lived explosion of DPS, but having constant, mana-free, insane DPS and tanking to me is just unbalanced. I'd get on board with charm staying the same power, but being more situational - as in having shorter duration charms (1-2 minutes) or tagging mobs with recast delay timers so you have to keep switching up charm pets. Mostly so you ca't just grab an OP pet, hold it forever with insanely low-risk, and dominate.
  6. Skuz Augur

    You need to re-think what you are saying there, what advantage is there to having an Enchanter in your group if they had a drastically nerfed charm?

    There might be some need to "scale" what hp/dps charmed mobs have/output at lower levels so that an Enchanter with a charmed mob outputs about the same DPS as a Mage combined with their pet, but certainly at level 100 (where I play the game) an Enchanter is about that now, a charmed blue-con mob can output around 10k dps & with the Enchanter's dot/nuke dps added on is not together vastly superior to a Magican plus its Pets, it's equivalent.

    The Enchanter & charmed pet should be a viable group choice, and preferred for it's main role as crowd control but also for it's ability to provide dps & buffs you're argument of "who needs" does however sound like one biased against Enchanters, do you think they should not be considered alongside DPS classes when they have a charmed pet? If so you're wrong.
  7. Zansobar Augur

    Exactly - the enchanter with charm pet should not be better dps than a mage given how much more a chanter brings to the group via haste, mana regen, cc, and other buffs.
  8. Beep Elder

    I think that when it comes to increased xp rates daypaw sees it as they lose out on potential xp potion sales, but in reality I'd stay subbed and play longer, buy more potions, simply because leveling alts wouldn't be miserable.
  9. Moranis Augur

    You're making my exact point. It's the 1-60 charm game that is broken, not the L100 game. If they had a nerfed charm, they would provide DPS ideally somewhere below top DPS classes, while providing best-in-game haste / debuffs / mana regen / and CC. Additionally, without OP charm pet damage, CC will become more of a factor.

    To answer your question...

    Am I OK with enchanters alongside DPS? - Yes, sure - but optimally somewhere below MNK / BER / MAG / WIZ / ROG since Enchanters have considerably more utility than any of those classes.

    Am I OK with enchanters head and shoulders (and torso, and legs, and feet, and toes, and then some...) above ALL DPS like they currently are in the 1-60 game? - No - this is what I'm arguing about.
    I'm OK with scaling the HP / DPS of charm pets and leaving the duration as is to keep them more "sustained DPS" - or I'm OK with leaving the HP / DPS as-is and just scaling down the charm duration to make their DPS more "burst". Either way is fine.
    Zansobar likes this.
  10. Hinastorm86 Augur

    Another chime in for nerfing charming.

    I'm tired of having to have an enchanter in every single group, or box setup, or feel massively gimped without it. It's just horrendously op. I'd love to see them compensate elsewhere for it, like buff their dots, give their nukes a -MR mod, so they can do something on raids.

    Or maybe make animations real pets.
    Moranis likes this.
  11. Moranis Augur

    On the flip side of that, it can be equally as annoying being the charmer(s) because you're basically expected to carry the group. I've had so many times where my ENC / CLR duo in Chardok were the only ones fighting for 10 minutes - everyone else just went AFK.

    Hell, I've ninja AFK'd before when leveling my Shaman if I'm grouped with a solid ENC / CLR much really is my 500pt nuke contributing to the fight, when the charmed pet is QUADDING for 218 per round? *sigh*
  12. XavierSelos New Member

    I think the posts requesting class reworks or dps re-balancing are insanely optimistic. I'm not saying that they don't mean well- this game has flaws, and those are significant, but the game is 20 years old and I doubt Daybreak has the resources or inclination to make such fundamental changes to a product that's still earning for them.

    My most recent TLP was Selo, and I thought it was the by FAR the best I've played to date. I'd really love to see expansion unlocks determined on a case-by-case basis- One month is fine for many expansions with very little content- dragons of norrath comes to mind, but 6-8 weeks would be better for many that require a lot of pre-req work to reach the final content. That's a change that could be made with a few hours of thought/consultation and is easily implemented.
  13. Dahaman Augur

    There is an example of this in the test patch notes: LDON for standard TLPs will be 8 weeks instead of 12 weeks.

    Mangler will be the first TLP to experience that change.
  14. Xanadas Augur

    Speak for yourself. Leave it all the same and reduce lockouts 50% since a new expansion every 6 months is about 2x original timeline. It only makes sense to have half-duration lockouts.
  15. GugokSkulkraker Journeyman

    With enchanters as they are now, it makes it hard to justify bringing another class for the dps spot since they have so much more on top of the already insane charm damage. The simplest solution is to add a slow component to charmed mobs to cut down on the damage output. Make it so haste can't stack with the new slow and there you go, fixed charm. The mobs would still hit like a truck but not nearly as fast. This solution can extend to all charm classes.

    To answer the question as to what do enchanters bring to the group if not charm? Same as it's always been, haste and clarity along with crowd control.
    Moranis likes this.
  16. Risiko Augur

    I've done decided I will not start over on another TLP, so it really doesn't matter for me what the ruleset is of the next server. but... I hope that if any changes are made based on this (or any discussion really) does not change the way that Mangler is setup today. I like Mangler just the way it is.
    Meridian likes this.
  17. Zansobar Augur

    A charm fix would be quite easy - just add the dps debuff to the effects of charm spells. I'm believe that's how they fixed charm in later expansions anyway.

    Monks are similar - every monk on TLPs during certain expansions has a permanent damage debuff just like they did with Mage pets on the early expansions of the TLP servers.

    Rogues would be slightly harder, but again trivial - they just need to increase the backstab damage stat on piercing weapons that are available in the first 5 or so expansions...even just increasing it on a few items that are available would solve the problem as rogues would just seek out those weapons to use.
  18. Angered Augur

    The main point remains that leveling in Early expansions is 100% anti Fun! Charm pet / AOE Farming is 100% anti fun and were all burned out! A Server that grants levels and AA's is the only way to save face! The lot of us do not want to sit and grind endlessly for EXP AA"s! I mean even flagging your self for VP / Vex Thal is a complete pain! They should also open every zone up to POP! Honestly ask your self Do i want to farm gear and raid with the people ive met over the last 20 years? Or do i want to sit in LGUK for 50+ hours killing frogs!

    We want to log in group up and either farm raid gear or gear for our toons also auto grant spells while were at it unless its a drop or quest spell!

    20+ Years of playing i only care about raiding , farming gear/augs , hanging out with guildies! Farming EXP / AA or even the early expansion flagging No way No how!

    Its also the time factor! The lot of us simply do not have the time to take off work each expansion just to keep up! Racing is over with we all know who the best of the best is (#Amtrak/WT 4 LIFE) So who cares we need a fun event server!

    I wrote in colors because im "special"
  19. Ruination Lorekeeper

    Charm should be nerfed or looked at for sure, but a much bigger issue is the ability to chain stun 100's of mobs and killing them at the same time Sebilis/Velks/Deep/etc.. The xp/plat/krono generated by that is insane. Maybe add a debuff to ae stun, making the following stun much easier to resist/lessen duration or add a debuff that makes mobs immune to stun for half the duration of the stun would fix alot of these issues.
  20. Rekreant New Member

    wait another year, then release a tlp raid prog server that does batches of expansions. Start with Classic/Kunark, then Velious/Luclin, then PoP/LoY then GoD/LdoN etc etc etc etc. something like that. classic and kunark are the worst.

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