Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Randomgamer, May 19, 2019.
Purposely train them
Training has been tried and it'll get you some time off. They don't like afk play but they seem to dislike training even more.
Rmt happens when people are willing to pay real money for in game commodities. It goes down when people stop paying so much. Or it adapts to what people will pay for, eg selo has way less box army farmers (aka fishermen...) while powerlevelers stay in business. Krono did not cause rmting to go up beyond the natural increase due to allowing legitimate players to pay real money for in game goods. Rmt happened regularly before krono, as it still does, for people willing to buy cheaper krono off 3rd party sites, as well as characters or services.
Removing krono won't kill the box armies. It will only make the whole process even less legit and more 3rd party. Any decrease in rmt armies will end up proportional to only the lost money from legitimate krono buyers (from dbg directly) who aren't willing to go outside game rules.
Want to stop rmters? Stop paying them. Earn your own yourself. Want dbg to stop rmters? It has to be at their source - 3rd party sites and that exchange of cash money. Want to stop people who are not automated and not selling that krono for real money but hog/monopolize your favorite spots? Probanly never gonna happen.
Yeah..great post yerm. We're all aware of what the issue is already. Most people do want to earn **** themselves but can't get past the DPS botters/DPS boxers locking it down. People are forced to buy it or forgo ever having the items. I would very much like DBG to stop the 3rd party sites but they seem unwilling or unable to do it. So what do we do? DBG needs to either enforce their own rules, remove those rules or provide a new way to access the content.
DPS botters and DPS boxers are two entirely different things and don't deserve to be lumped together under the "need to be banned" umbrella.
Botting is against the rules, boxing is not. It is obnoxious that some people who box decide to hold down and KS important spawns, but that is an entirely separate issue from people bot farming.
Lumping them together confuses the issue and causes more unnecessary argument rather than helping to solve the problem.
I agree they are different things. Doesn't change anything to me though. Both bar me from the game's content as either one or the other is at these camps 24/7.
And that is frustrating, but you can't solve those problems the same way because one issue is against the rules and the other isn't.
You can “steal” a few hill giants from the bots if you drag them away before the pets get a hit in but they just keep on going after you leave and the bodies pile up to the point where you can make a good profit looting the trash left on corpses.
The guy running those bots practically rules the server .
Different in degree, not really in effect.
If I can’t ever camp my own GEBs or FBSS or Heiro Cloak because some neckbeard with 12 accounts is constantly monopolizing the camp, it makes a difference to me if the characters are automated or not only in the most philosophical sense.
Either one makes me annoyed at the player. The botting makes me somewhat annoyed at DBG too. Which in the end is the only real practical difference.
Yeah, the effect is essentially the same, and I think that's why the crossover between complaints is so common.
But with the rules as they are, the only way to combat boxers locking down camps is playing like a jerk and stealing their spawns. I understand if that's a line some people are willing to cross, I am not personally, but that's a philosophical difference.
Botters are breaking the rules and enforcement against them should be strict and swift, but it does appear that either that is not possible for reasons of resources, or the extent of the problem is misidentified by frustrated players, or the tools botters have are too sophisticated to be policed effectively (this is likely the bulk of the problem).
The only real solution to all of this is instancing and a more closed world, but not everyone agrees that would be ultimately good for the game.
Am I missing something as far as the bot's go? I mean I understand the Giants and other mobs they take down for profit but when new expansions open up either they are going to farm the newer mobs which in returns open up the older mobs for us now or they stay farming the older mobs and we as players move to the newer mobs. New expansion = better loot,more mobs, more places to farm.
Ways to stop a large majority of botters...
Nerf giants cash drops...
Lock corpses so you had to be in group at time of kill to loot it...
Those two changes alone will kill a large majority of botting/KR farmers... some will still exist but their lives will be much harder.
The legitimate player has limits. They will not be able to lock down a camp 24/7 because they sleep, and will likewise lose it if they try to do anything else like raid. If they aren't cheating they will likewise have trouble managing to farm multiple places at once, such as efreetis in multiple picks or an entire hg hill, without succumbing to poor play like just pet attack without tactics.
So if you get rid of the cheating and ban the purely rmting folks, leaving you just the overzealous neckbearder tryhards, you are left with manageable situations where you can grab a camp while people are raiding or sleeping, or go get it in a pick.
The former just moves them to a different spot and reduces viable spots for all players. The latter makes it harder for guilds to gear up their members and the workaround is just to sell spots in the group for your bot farm.
These aren't solutions to the problem.
Wrong and hell no.
Plat farmers simply go to the best possible option. If you nerf a plat farm (eg aqua goblins in butcherblock) they just go the nest best thing. If you nerf hgs and igs they won't quit, they will move. Now you have those same rmters wrecking some new area on top of the giant spots being nerfed into useless, resulting in even less content for decent players.
Requiring being in group upon drop doesn't merely hurt loot right sellers. It hurts people who share rotting drops. It hurts people who have out of group characters. It destroys the ability to properly direct loot when a raid is filling and people have alts. All of that before even touching perfectly liked reasons for loot right sales, eg we had some silk rot in a fire instance yesterday and some lucky young lad got a mold for less than the price of good ornate (which funds my emeralds), everyone ends up happy.
Selling spots isn't 100% viable.. and makes it much more of a deterrent for both the buyer and the seller. Majority of buyers aren't going to sit in a group for hours waiting for drops to happen.
Making it harder for gearing guildies....acceptable side affect.
I suppose we have different definitions of acceptable, and that's fine.
If people aren't willing to sit in a group for hours waiting for drops to happen, how do you expect they will obtain these items? That's kind of exactly how it works if you make it so they can't be obtained without being in the group. This doesn't seem particularly well considered.
The bottom line is botting is against the rules, the rules should be enforced, and if you ask me the penalties should be harsher.
Charm gating a spawn clearly camped by someone else should be considered griefing and punished accordingly, but DBG will not get involved in these types of disputes because (almost in their own words) the playerbase itself cannot be trusted to act responsibly and like adults in these matters and will stoop to lying and deceit in order to obtain camps for themselves. There's no good answer here. A subset of people who play Everquest just can't find it within themselves to act like adults and with common courtesy and this has always been the case.
Spawns and plat farms being camped is fundamentally how the Classic game works, and altering that requires a sea change in how things operate. Some people want that to happen and some people don't, but there really isn't a correct answer to that problem.
Do yourself a favor. Over the next week, make a note of every time you see a nodrop item go to someone outside its group at time of kill.
Unless you are a sub 50 non raider on mangler my very strong guess is there will be far more "good" occurances than "bad" ones.
IMHO, lock it all down. Make everything no trade, except tradeskill drops. Then make all tradeskill items attuneable. Make the corpse require having to be in group/raid at the time of death to loot the item.
Basically go earn it or forget it...
Allow players to take justice in their own hands.. and have zero rules....(unless you are hacking the game)
Separate names with a comma.