Possible fix for H2H damage?

The insane damage of H2H is gonna render all classic and kunark weapons useless, I hope the devs can come up with a solution for this.

I read that its impossible to change the code for H2H damage, however instead of changing the codes for the H2H damage, why not just introduce a cap on the skill instead? Rather than having melee class cap at 200 @ lv 50, just cap it lower like 120 (or whatever it is that makes the damage nearer to the classic damage values). Same goes for monks as well, they will probably have a slighly higher cap than other melee classes but not to the extent that gives them the insane damage that they can get in the beta server currently.

I kinda have to agree with what some other posters have said before. Why nerf the poor melee's? They already suck compared to casters. Why no just put in some augments that actually make weapons worth using?

Hmmm

That method would also impact live servers, so again it won't be done. Your solution would also lower damage for the other melee classes, and they already suffer substantially in damage compared to casters. Even if both those things are concerned, there is the issue of development costs to change and test this to ensure it has no adverse side effects, so that is another reason it won't be done.

Hmmm

Can't edit for some reason, so it should read " Even if both those things are ignored".

Again, who really cares if it effects live servers? 1-60 are e-z mode with mercs. a little damage nerf won't matter. Something needs to be done, either skill caps or simple nerfs. Debuffs for lower damage might work, so could simply removing h2h for all classes besides monks.. who knows what they will decide (if anything) but hopefully they will let us know.

Hmmm

They have already let us know, they have clearly stated they cannot change monk H2H or pets because live also uses that same data :

"Q: Will you be adjusting monk fist damage or pet damage on Ragefire?

Regrettably, no. Unarmed damage is tied very deeply to our combat code, and to reduce damage for the first few expansions on progression servers we would have to check for expansion unlocks every time any entity attempted any attack on any other entity on every server. The CPU increase when we tried it internally was startling.

As for pets, since they share data with live servers, we can't change their skills without also changing them on Live."

Page 1 of the following thread :
https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/...ire-poll-results-and-beta-information.220107/

Right, as my post stated "who cares what it effects on live, as it doesn't really matter"

The argument that it will effect live is what I am saying is silly. Effect live all the way forever, it doesn't matter nearly as much as it will for the progression server. Over 1.5 years, there will be a handful of 1-60 on live.. but there will be a plethora of people on the new TLP that will be effected.

Hmmm

They stated combat code, it may not just be player damage that is impacted. I have never had visibility of their code, so I have no way to determine how accurate that may be.

I understand the part of combat code cannot be changed, but capping of skills shouldnt affect the coding.

Another idea would be to introduce a debuff to characters who doesnt hold any weapons in their hand (aka H2H). The debuff should reduce the melee damage of the characters, till it is similar to the damage that a H2H would have in classic. Adding a H2H debuff would be easy, it will essentially be like adding buffs when u hold certain weapons, just doing it the opposite way.

And to implement the above idea is easy, u just need to add a permanent melee debuff to all characters from lv 30 - 50, and this debuff will go away whenever u have a weapon equiped. Easy to implement and does the job of reducing H2H to its classic damage. Its impact on live server would be minimun, since the debuff goes away at lv 51, and there isnt much lv 30-50 characters in live anyway. Even if there is, there are more than enough weapons in live which are better than the H2H damage. Furthermore, this debuff will only need to be implemented for a few months, until Kunark comes out.

To those who feel melee should be buffed, pls understand that the H2H damage is way too high as it is, its rendering all classic weapons nearly useless in this era.

Hmmm

The

Hmmm

1. The combat code will reference the tables that contain the skill caps. I believe that mob types/classes/templates will use those same tables, so changing the skill caps can potentially impact a lot of things.
2. It is ONLY monk hand to hand damage that is too high, not all melee classes used the same h2h table. So stop requesting changes to all melee skill caps and melee damage. The other melee classes already have low dps without nerfing their damage even further.
3. How do you know it is easy to develop? Do you have visibility of their code? I doubt it, so it is pure speculation on your part as to how easy it is.
4. Mage pets on their own, do more damage than ANY melee class except monks. If you add in the damage from the mage, then the combined damage output from mage and pet is greater than Monks. On Fippy, there were at least as many Mages as there were Monks.
5. Your "solution" does absolutely nothing to address the disparity in damage between casters and the other melee classes, indeed your "solution" would make the situation even worse.

Other classes do not use H2H, they should be using weapons anyway, so "nerfing" the H2H damage to them does nothing. This debuff will merely adjust the H2H damage of monks to what it should be in classic era. Its not even a nerf, its a fix to something that is broken and abused.

And like I mentioned, adding a debuff to all characters does not require a change of codes, so it will be much easier to implement. Just make it such that upon lv 30, all characters gets a melee debuff that goes away whenever a weapon is equiped. This debuff is removed once a character reaches lv 51.

Im addressing the damage of H2H in regards to classic damage and how it renders melee weapons ineffective in its current state. If u wish to talk about magi pets and how it is OPed compared to classic, u can make a new thread to come out with ur own ideas on how to fix that.

PS: The same debuff can be applied to magi pets, if u think about it. Though it might be harder to implement for pets, as they are not permanent unlike player characters.

Hmmm

I have no intention of creating my own thread on mage / caster damage, there have been enough "solutions" offered, just as there have been for changes to monk damage. There have been an over abundance of "solutions" offered.

Wouldn't your debuff suggestion result in the same effect they want to avoid? Namely the section:

Instead of checking for expansion unlocks now it is checking against whether players have the debuff.

Also I can't think of any ingame example where a buff/debuff on item equip is already in place so that would have to be created entirely from scratch, making it very unlikely. Worn haste is just a passive modifier to existing stat so not the same either.

Lowering the max skill cap for all classes is probably the most implementable solution but it may have internal issues we don't see, recalculating the skills for all stored character data across all servers could be no problem or it might be extremely resource intensive, the only ones that know are DGC.

As a developer myself, I'm SMH at the fact they haven't made combat settings like these extensible and able to be changed on a server-by-server basis.

When you consider a lot of this code is hitting 20 years old, mob tracking I believe was written in the mid 90s IIRC from a tank game, crying about fixing it without the resources to do so only results in grief for everyone just deal with it already.

QQ lock this thread

h2h doesn't need a nerf.

You can't just lower the skill caps as that also affects accuracy, thus it would lower dps much more than you believe

weapons need a buff somehow to bring them in line with h2h damage potential and spell/pet damage

I suggested new augments which SHOULD be an easy fix since BANE DAMAGE is already a thing in game, augments already a thing in game and bonus damage already a thing in game

So buffing all the weapons in classic would trivialize more content in classic. DBG needs to lower the h2h damage all the way around.

Then they need to lower spell and pet damage all the way around.

Or they bring weapons up to power. We need game balance not a larger break between melee and casters.

According to the parses in the other thread the 2H weapon from runnyeye is parsing about the same as H2H at level 50. So they don't need to do anything, and I doubt they will. Just make sure you get the sword from runnyeye if you are a melee.