Please remove vendor sellback for Apparitional Cloak Fastener

Then those people need to either leave or be removed. If the rules are established, then there is no reason to argue over it during raids, and the if the people in charge of the guild have decided a way that you don't like, you are fully capable of leaving the guild and finding another with rules that fit yours.

There is no need for a consensus, just for there to have been rules set. After the rules are set people are fully capable to either accept them, disagree with them and discuss changes outside of raids, or leave the raid group or guild. After the rules are set, then people arguing over them during a raid should be warned once, then kicked if it happens again.

And if that's not the problem, then people are being toxic. Once the management has made a decision, be angry in a way that doesn't negatively affect the guild or expect to be forced to find a new one. No one person is greater than the guild.

(I believe we are in agreement, I was just adding to your statement.)

Well said!

Wait a minute, I thought magicians were the most important people in any guild? Has thoust been mistaken???

but we can bid DKP and get 141 raid coin. . that is 7 raids free coin!

While I understand both arguments in this thread, I agree rules set place by leadership is crucial. The raid force is an open raid force and the most laid back group I've ever raided with. Lots of great people mostly playing alts. They don't want those who need an upgrade to lose out over dishonest, selfish people. Besides EQ servers are a community, so if someone was being deceitful on intentions and rule infractions, folks should inform the officers leading the events. Not everyone has the time to invest in the chase cloak despite it's elite final outcome. If DP Games were to get involved game wide perhaps lower the return substantially or get rid of it. I remember a professor who told our class years ago about him and his siblings fighting over toys as children. His mother would just throw them in the trash. These kind of arguments in game are why we don't receive nice things and in certain cases lead to class nerfs on some abilities.

I don't see anything that points to people either being dishonest or selfish. I do see people being cheap. I just do not see how a person who need the cloak drop as an upgrade would not pay or offer more than someone is just going to be selling it for 30% of the cost for another drop. There is no justification to make any changes. These are not things that Darkpaw needs to be solving. These are issues within the raid group. People who don't have the problem should not be punished because others are incapable of working things out reasonably.

The parent throwing away the toys was a demonstration of power. In this case, the people doing that would need to be the raid/guild leaders. They would need to do something like, say that if people argue over the cloak drop and refuse to accept the rule we made, then no one gets it and it will just rot on the mob. Darkpaw getting involved is like the Police or government coming and taking the kids toys away because they were fighting over them.

I think more items should sell back.

How your guild/raid group handle the decision is up to however you organize leadership etc but there is a benefit to always having a fall back of trading in for currency. Removing that option only makes the decision for you so if your guild currently wants no sell backs then just adopt that rule.

Anyone who cares that much about the cloak being t2 vs t1 should just work on the evolve really, the aug slots alone help it surpass raid drops quicker.

Less rot loot is always a good thing.

I don't believe most people are being dishonest or selfish, just a few because every open raid force will have one or two. In fact, I don't think anyone in this particular raid force is, just the disagreements or concerns should not be discussed during raid time. Yes, most people will always hope for an item for 1 dkp or even more in an inflated dkp system. I also believe it's a raid guild issue too, not for DP games. I didn't clarify about the toys, it's for sure the raid leadership's decision to destroy it should it become a habitual problem. DP games should have anticipated this back with the TBM expansion though. I do believe it was a nice gesture by DP Games though. There are plenty of raid leadership options like setting a certain points minimum for novelty item, or limit per player character until everyone has won a rot cloak for vendoring. If someone claims it's an upgrade for slot and they aren't wearing it next raid, boot them because it's obvious they used deceit to get cheap raid coins. A simple /inspect would confirm this. Personally, I'm all for folks spending their points as they see fit, however I'm not leading the raids and respect the rules set by the leadership. Folks should know the raid rules before joining, imho.

I suppose it could be an issue for raids that /roll for everything. IMO people shouldnt be rolling need for stuff to sell, but then its up to the raid or raidleader to make the final ruling on it.

I raid with 3 different loot systems (dkp, /rand, loot council) and none of them have an issue with this. I'm trying to figure out what people in the original post are crying about.

You misspelled Shadowknight.