Mix it up a bit for new expansions

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by BarryGarry, Oct 2, 2023.

  1. Iven the Lunatic

    You are right but it was the same with TSS that increased the level cap from 70 to 75: It was more top heavy and offered six high level zones but only because it was a much bigger expansion at all with 14 base zones and 2-3 revamped zones (EC, WC, Highpass Hold).

    Ashengate: 70-80 (NPC levels)
    Frostcrypt: 74-79
    Direwind Cliffs: 65-78
    Icefall Glacier 61-79
    Valdeholm 62-81
    Vergalid Mines 66-78

    TSS got released in 2006 (!), so I think that it is doable to release a special catch-up/backbone expansion every 17 years where some players have to bite into the sour apple. The expansion could include an additional unlocked character slot (bonus item like keyrings and vaults) and a free heroic character so that the players could enjoy and level up a fresh toon from lvl 85/100 to 125. 25-40 levels beside/instead the usual 5 and everything is doable in one expansion !!! Norrath might be much more crowded for 1-3 years and it could be much fun seeing thousands of players starting fresh at the same time. Nobody should be bored or really disappointed then.

    What theme would be the right one for such an expansion ? Definitely classic EQ with a mix of revamped and 1-2 new zones including one or two cities just and only inside the expansion.


    Scenario 1:
    It would play in the past at the first ogre-dwarven war that happened on Faydwer. Many zones would have battlefields and war camps with dwarf, ogre, and orc slave warriors. Elven rebels are fighting against the (old) elven empire in east Faydwer (side story), and at the same time an army of thousands of ogres and orc slaves from the rakthokian ridge (Ranthok's Ridge) on Faydwer would march across the Hills of Shade to conquer the forge of Norrath, Kaladim ("OGRES ANTE PORTAS !").

    1. Kaladim (mines, arena, sporali farm), 2. Butcherblock Mountains, 3. Hills of Shade (war zone), 4. Lost dwarven mine with ghosts/skeletons/bats in BB, 5. Lesser Faydark (war zone), 6. Ranthok's Ridge (war zone), 7. Dagnor's Cauldron (war zone), 8. A sorcerer tower in the middle of Dagnor's Cauldron that is inhabitated by magicians, elementals and constructs, 9. Castle Mistmoore.

    Zone ..1: lvl ....80-89: T1 easy area ...80-83; T2 medium area ...83-86; T3 hard area .....86-89 - Kaladim
    Zone ..2: lvl ....85-94: T1 easy area ...85-88; T2 medium area ...88-91; T3 hard area .....91-94 - Butcherblock Mountains
    Zone ..3: lvl ....90-99: T1 easy area ...90-93; T2 medium area ...93-96; T3 hard area .....96-99 - Hills of Shade (war zone)
    Zone ..4: lvl ..95-104: T1 easy area ...95-98; T2 medium area ..98-101; T3 hard area .101-104 - Lost dwarven mine in BB
    Zone ..5: lvl 100-109: T1 easy area 100-103; T2 medium area 103-106; T3 hard area .106-109 - Lesser Faydark (war zone)
    Zone ..6: lvl 105-114: T1 easy area 105-108; T2 medium area .108-111; T3 hard area .111-114 - Ranthok's Ridge (war zone)
    Zone ..7: lvl 110-119: T1 easy area .110-113; T2 medium area .113-116; T3 hard area .116-119 - Dagnor's Cauldron (war zone)
    Zone ..8: lvl 115-124: T1 easy area .115-118; T2 medium area .118-121; T3 hard area 121-124 - Sorcerer tower in Dagnor's Cauldron
    Zone ..9: lvl 120-129: T1 easy area 120-123; T2 medium area .123-126; T3 hard area 126-129 - Castle Mistmoore


    Scenario 2:
    Qeynos, The Karanas, Everfrost Peaks.

    1. Qeynos (North+South+Sewers), 2. Qeynos Hills + Surefall Glade, 3. West Karana , 4. Blackburrow, 5. North Karana + East Karana, 6. South Karana, 7. Everfrost Peaks, 8. Infected Paw (gnolls), 9. Miragul's Laboratory in EFP.

    Zone ..1: lvl ....80-89: T1 easy area ...80-83; T2 medium area ...83-86; T3 hard area .....86-89 - Qeynos + Sewers
    Zone ..2: lvl ....85-94: T1 easy area ...85-88; T2 medium area ...88-91; T3 hard area .....91-94 - Qeynos Hills + Surefall Glade
    Zone ..3: lvl ....90-99: T1 easy area ...90-93; T2 medium area ...93-96; T3 hard area .....96-99 - West Karana
    Zone ..4: lvl ..95-104: T1 easy area ...95-98; T2 medium area ..98-101; T3 hard area .101-104 - Blackburrow
    Zone ..5: lvl 100-109: T1 easy area 100-103; T2 medium area 103-106; T3 hard area .106-109 - North Karana + East Karana
    Zone ..6: lvl 105-114: T1 easy area 105-108; T2 medium area .108-111; T3 hard area .111-114 - South Karana
    Zone ..7: lvl 110-119: T1 easy area .110-113; T2 medium area .113-116; T3 hard area .116-119 - Everfrost Peaks
    Zone ..8: lvl 115-124: T1 easy area .115-118; T2 medium area .118-121; T3 hard area 121-124 - Infected Paw (gnolls)
    Zone ..9: lvl 120-129: T1 easy area 120-123; T2 medium area .123-126; T3 hard area 126-129 - Miragul's Laboratory in EFP


    Scenario 3:
    Located around a once again revamped Freeport, that is 100% orientated in original Freeport, but with better graphics, shapes, and size. It would be also focused on seafarers, rogues, and pirates.

    1. Freeport (orig. NFP+WFP+EFP), 2. Freeport sewers (rogues, necros, critters), 3. Commonlands, 4. North Ro, 5. Nektulos Forest, 6. Befallen, 7. Ocean of Tears , 8. Timorous Deep , 9. Neriak (as a dungeon).

    Zone ..1: lvl ....80-89: T1 easy area ...80-83; T2 medium area ...83-86; T3 hard area .....86-89 - Freeport (outskirts, slums)
    Zone ..2: lvl ....85-94: T1 easy area ...85-88; T2 medium area ...88-91; T3 hard area .....91-94 - Freeport Sewers
    Zone ..3: lvl ....90-99: T1 easy area ...90-93; T2 medium area ...93-96; T3 hard area .....96-99 - Commonlands
    Zone ..4: lvl ..95-104: T1 easy area ...95-98; T2 medium area ..98-101; T3 hard area .101-104 - North Ro
    Zone ..5: lvl 100-109: T1 easy area 100-103; T2 medium area 103-106; T3 hard area .106-109 - Nektulos Forest
    Zone ..6: lvl 105-114: T1 easy area 105-108; T2 medium area .108-111; T3 hard area .111-114 - Befallen
    Zone ..7: lvl 110-119: T1 easy area .110-113; T2 medium area .113-116; T3 hard area .116-119 - Ocean of Tears
    Zone ..8: lvl 115-124: T1 easy area .115-118; T2 medium area .118-121; T3 hard area 121-124 - Timorous Deep
    Zone ..9: lvl 120-129: T1 easy area 120-123; T2 medium area .123-126; T3 hard area 126-129 - Neriak (dungeon)


    If these scenaries are to big for a new catch-up expansion, nine small new zones can be created instead. A catch-up expansion don't has to have big zones today, as the player crowd after lvl 85 is small. Nine zones of half size would be 4.5 catch-up zones and then two additional full size top end zones could be added for a sum of 5 suitable top end zones (lvl 113-129 mobs).

    9 zones of half size + 2 zones of full size = 11 zones, equal to the size of 6-7 full size zones.
    Bobbybick likes this.
  2. Windance Augur

    Really sounds like you want to play on the TLP instead of live.
    Szilent, Yinla, Ssdar and 2 others like this.
  3. Iven the Lunatic

    :rolleyes: It is not about me, it is about the game and I have learned to see it more from a dev perspective but also from that of a player: The best of two worlds.
  4. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    And the players who are in current level content don't want to get even fewer zones then we currently get.
    Yinla, Ssdar, Skuz and 2 others like this.
  5. Randomized Augur

    It is about you, because the idea is selfish and over all, bad for the game. Using TSS is a bad example, and heres why: TSS had a reason to gather thousands of players together. There was an incentive to start over at level 1 with all your buddies. You got a new playable race unique to that area and that expansions.

    The devs hard work for that expansion paid off.

    Whats the incentive for a 120 player to go back and do level 95 content in the new expansion that yields 0 experience, and gear thats 20 levels and 6 expansions behind?

    There isnt any. Even for people leveling up from 90-125, the only incentive they have is less traveling while leveling. And it takes the other 40 zones from 100-120 and renders them useless (just like TSS did)

    Essentially it's a waste of dev time/resources
  6. Iven the Lunatic

    If it is selfish to have ideas, being creative, and to make suggestions, then I am selfish ! :D

    TSS is a very good example because the new level 1 is heroic level 85 and level 100. TSS is so much more than only a catch-up expansion and to start a drakkin; it is the most popular expansion ever ! I would call such expansions the backbone of EQ. A continuative expansion which does continue where TSS (level wise) has ended, is just a logical and in my eyes a necessary step. At least a step that would immensely support the game and heroic characters for many coming years. It won't be an easy expansion and would require more than seven zones but it would once again paid off hard dev work. The studio budget should be doubled for such an important key expansion and more devs hired !

    You do ignore the fact that not every player is a slug that does only play one main character and then waits a half year until the next expansion does get released. Many players do create and play new characters constantly and have fun in that. The replay factor is very important for a game which is why also old and lower level content does matter.
  7. Zunnoab Augur

    Just throw default Hero's Forge graphics on for equipment for those models? Or are you talking about the pre-Luclin models? Even if that's what you mean, just make it so Luclin models + Hero's Forge graphics are used for the race/class combinations with issues.

    I know "just use" is probably way more simple sounding than the reality of how the game works, but it's hardly insurmountable without making all new models.
  8. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    I am talking the pre luclin models though I am not sure that the luclin models have all graphics such as trolls/ogres supporting cloth armor types.
  9. Zunnoab Augur

    They don't (for example Vah Shir have no cloth armor without Hero's Forge), but the Hero's Forge stuff works (I think, I haven't seen every combination).
  10. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    TSS also had 14 zones and introduced a new race that justified having content for all levels. The new expansion is looking to fewer zones and it doesn't need to be reduced any further. There already is plenty of content for lower level players and we don't need to sacrifice high level content to make lower level content.
    Skuz likes this.
  11. Waring_McMarrin Augur


    I don't think that the developers would want to add a feature that was dependent everyone using the luclin models and players having purchased heroes forge for a character and using it
  12. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I want to see the "Missing zones" added to EQ from classic, but I would be okay with them appearing as part of a high level expansion & having a low level version for the TLP thrown in for shiggles.

    And when are we getting the Demi-Plane of Debauchery? Demi-Plane of Greed? on my bucket list
    Yinla likes this.
  13. Fenthen Living rent free in your headspace

    That ended in TSS my friend. It isn't coming back, especially when all we get is 6-7 zones a year.
  14. Zunnoab Augur

    I was meaning to imply if they did do that functionally that's how they could do it. Not that they would make people buy Hero's Forge.

    I know I am biased since I started playing just over 20 years ago, long after Luclin models were out. But I remember the switch to DirectX 9 (and the fun with mobs falling through walls and such that went along with it). I don't even know what version was used at launch, and now the transition to DirectX 11 is underway.

    I'm not saying I think they will do this, but if they do I highly doubt "people won't have their old model choice honored for certain race/class combinations" would factor into the decision.
  15. Soulbanshee Augur

    [IMG]
    MyShadower, Ssdar, Skuz and 1 other person like this.
  16. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    It isn't just the players who choose one of the race/class combinations that doesn't have a supported armor type for the model but everyone who is still using the old graphics.
  17. Svann2 The Magnificent

    Please fasten your seatbelts
    Skuz likes this.
  18. Zunnoab Augur

    The Luclin models are over two decades old now. I'm not seeing how a few race/class combinations forcing the Luclin models selectively per player is a huge deal. I'm not saying the game is coded in a way to make that something easy to do, but hypothetically selectively forcing Luclin models plus Hero's Forge is a workaround.

    And honestly, Hero's Forge being a separate paid feature per character is so silly as is.
  19. Nennius Curmudgeon

    I am going to choose to be hopeful. Really, I am. Honest. Oh crap!
  20. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    The devs are not going to release new race/class combinations if the racial models don't support the required armor type graphics. It doesn't matter if you force the people using the new combinations to use luclin models as the graphics problem will still be an issue for everyone who is using the old models.

    This isn't about how it impacts everyone, not just the people who would use a new combination.