Obviously I expect this thread to become heated and possibly locked very soon after starting it, however since so many topics within the last few months have focused on "Lore" for reasoning supporting or damning particular subject matters, I feel a need to get this out. From a lore standard, I can say that SOE has never really logically followed their own lore whatsoever. As Old Devs move on to bigger and better things and "New" Devs replace and bring in their own "vision" of what EQ is supposed to be, I can clearly state that we will never see SOE stand behind and support the Lore reasons for anything done with this game. I was originally against the whole idea of a Wood Elf Beastlord, still am against it, as it does not really fit into the aspect of the game Lore. To begin let's address the aspect of Beastlords in general: From the very conception of the Beastlord class, SOE violated the whole aspect of Lore for the class which has recently had so much contention in the forums * Beastlords were introduced to Norrath via the Vah Shir in the Shadows of Luclin expansion. * Beastlords are a combination of Shaman and Monk, by the original defining outline. -- When compared to other starting races that offered the Beastlord class, there was support for those races having the class available. Iksar (offered both Monk and Shaman class from their conception) Barbarians (had access to Human monk training via Qeynos) Ogres/Trolls (both being brutish races could have easily captured human monks and tortured them into the partial training needed to implement the class). Vah Shir (did not have Monks, had been seperated from mainstream Norrath for generations, so where the heck does the Lore fit for them - it doesn't) -- I take offense to the fact that the race that should/would be considered possibly the most Agile of all the races DOES NOT have the Monk class as a starting option. Thus could not have been the founding race for the class to be presented into the game. The better racial option was the Iksar. -- Now with the addition of Froglok Monks, the Froglok Race is capable of housing Froglok Beastlords (EDIT: Now I half expect to start seeing the call for Froglok Beastlords running around with giant Frog pets [since Mosquito pets would only become food for their Froglok masters] from the PoP expansion). This would be no different than having ALL Classes being able to start in Crescent Reach regardless of Race choice, so Drakkin are the perfect option to have every Race/Class combination, yet when presented with Lore to support that reasoning SOE just ignores anything remotely logical. There was a time when Faction also played a great deal with the aspects of Lore in this game, yet now even that is replaced in ways where city guards will ignore racially hated characters who obscenely outpower them. * Iksar by nature absolutely HATE everyone that is not one of their own or has earned their trust (and I mean actually earned, not using the Iksar illusion mask from Field of Scale for its faction modifier). -- Yet I can walk right up to the gates with a Lvl 100 Drakkin Pally (completely negative faction), sit right between the guards and not get attacked because the mobs refuse to agro, because the character so obscenely outpowers the guards. -- The reason this is an aspect of Lore is since the Drakkin are Humans touched by Dragon's Blood, the very connection to being one of Veeshans prodigy and Iksars abhorent hatred for everything Veeshan. -- Maybe SOE should raise ALL city guards to level 100, make them over in power accordingly (respective type difference that Luclin Raid mobs had in comparrison to old EQ raid mobs - basically meaning IF you want into a starting city and DO NOT have the faction you might want to bring a raid) and put them back to work. Most recently SOE tried to re-evaluate the aspect of Faction and how it played into the Lore of today's game. They required players to perform a series of quest to learn the Alaran Language, so as to be able to request higher tasks and events, to interact with the NPC's, and yet the very following expansion they blew this out of the water as well. So back to the point I made, I really just don't expect SOE to ever follow or present a sound Lore basis anymore. Those of us who enjoy the aspects of Lore and get upset when it gets so screwed over (and yes I am one of those in this category), really need to just accept the fact that SOE doesn't understand how to present, follow, or upkeep aspects of Lore in the game. So I have just learned to accept whatever crap they decide to try ramming down our throats in the name of "keeping in line with EQ Lore".
Meh, they munged this one up when they introduced the taskmasters. Suddenly Kunark was covered with level 50 nonaggro Iksar, some of which used to be aggressive before the workover. Iksar NPCs also used to be immune to charm, that got dropped post Kunark as well. And Iksar PCs can wear plate now, what's up with that? Actually, the taskmasters were silly in so many regards. My favorite was having the Vah Shir taskmaster in Toxx forest give my Erudite paladin (massive racial enemy) a task to go into Kerra Isle and kill Kerrans.
It's like complaining that nobody on FV roleplays. (Did you know that the main reason for playing on that server is supposed to be roleplaying? )
I personally love the lore in EQ. I am sorry that apparently the only lore in EQ that you follow is the WE BL section.
Lore stopped being interesting in this game after PoP. But at the same time, a lot of things stopped being interesting after PoP.
Thank you.... definitely a point in the same realm of thought. I rather enjoyed the chain and leather appearances. Since Iksar have been able to wear Plate for as long as they have now, SOE should definitely have fixed the Jaundiced Bone Breastplate so that Iksar Shaman can Wear it and the entire line (at least they should have made it clickable by an Iksar Shaman by now).
You want lore for Wood Elf Beastlord? LF Wood Elf Beastlords A god (Tunare) granted wood elf Gwelian the powers. Gwelian then went and taught other wood elves. So are you saying Tunare isn't powerful enough to upend things? Not only is she a god, but she's allied with Karana, Erollisi Marr and Rodcet Nife, who all might have agreed to help her. Bristlebane would probably help just for fun. After all, think of all the extra mischief another class brings to Norrath. Tunare is enemies with Bertoxxulous, so any good, neutral or evil god might help just to stick it to Bertoxxulous. Now, I know nothing of EQ lore. So, please, let me know if a god or group of gods can't do this.
From how I read your comment, it seems to me, you decided to turn off your eyes once you got to the section concerning W.E. Beastlords, and ignored the other aspects of my post. But hey thats ok because at least you weren't disrespectful about it, unlike some others. Clearly though you and others missed the remainder of the post and the purpose. Yes I have an issue with the W.E. Beastlord pet, but, NO this thread wasn't started about that. It truly is about the Lore aspect. If you did not notice, I made a comment about how Frogloks now have a legitimate Lore claim for the Beastlord class. While I think it would be funny as all heck to see a Froglok Beastlord with a Mosquito pet (because of the potential "Oh my pet is my food supply" joke) I could see the Devs giving a Froglok Beast control of giant frogs from the PoP era. As a side note I would also like it if SOE would create a PoP era Frog styled mount (with a huge bounce to indicate it hopping).
It easily seemed like over 80% of your post was your issue with the WE BL. When such a large segment of a length post is like this, you have to expect people to react that way.
Ok maybe everyone missed this comment but: No where am I talking about the friggin pet as being the reason. My reasoning still remains the same, the accessibility to the training is not commonly there, NO MONK OR SHAMAN CLASS found within the Wood Elf racial archtype. End of story, while the pet does bother me (personally) on concept I can deal with it from the points reguritated by Fanra. That is fine about being granted the powers, but it still does not address the lack of training. There is a difference between having the power being given to you to do something and having built the skill over years of training to implement that power. 80% really??? I think that seriously is a gross misintreptation. I could see 50% possibly, but not for the reasons everyone else keeps harping on about the stupid pet issue. Like I said above its all about the issue of class training.
I'd like to hear the lore as to why WE Beastlords and Gukta Monks cannot start in their own cities. Tunare taken up residence in Crescent Reach now, as she granted WE's their powers?
Its the same misinterpretation as saying that because there are WE BLs and faction plays a lesser role in the game that EQ is now "Loreless" There is a ton of amazing lore still being implemented in modern day EQ. It is nowhere close to being "loreless".
Where does it say that for something to fit into the accurate definition of "lore", then that race must have both parent classes available for the race? Ogres can be SK, but not necros. Trolls can be SK, but not necros. Half elf can be Paladins, but not clerics. This has been going on from the begining of EQ. Is this any different than a Vah Shir, Ogre, Troll, whoever else not having access to both parent classes of their hybrid?
The lore that makes rats and bats drop defiant gear loots is just fine though. That's all that matters.
Whereas I'm sure you could automate raising the level of the guards, it's probably not work most devs would describe as "fun". With limited resources, I'm not surprised that they concentrate on new content and not on revamping old content. Although given the massacre of the city guards I saw in Crescent Reach the day that Heroic Characters went live, maybe they should have beefed those wardens up.
And Cobalt Breastplate and Blood Ember Breastplate and Blazing Vambraces. I still feel like a jerk for looting an open rot on those vambraces on my Iksar SK without realizing the racial restriction... the helm and bracer aren't restricted at all =/ If I recall the whole lore justification for restricting plate from Iksar was because it chafed their scales... So why could they wear chain? I'd think that'd be even worse.
