Across the board classes have these crazy disc timers of all diff times... I feel it is time to streamline these to 5, 10 and 20 min. From a purely logistical view this makes sense.. it would help in class balancing.. something they have said they will be doing in 2022. It also adds some QoL to many classes and it wouldn't break the game or skew a classes current dps in the slightest It would just give each class a chance to give their all on almost every raid event. Or help the new player learn disc management faster. What are peoples thoughts? Monks come to mind... with some crazy timers.. Wizards and manaburn seems an overly long timer.. (tbh I don't know much about manaburn though) zerkers have one really long timer (which made sense at one point but it does not any longer) This is just a really good time to do this. There are only a couple classes that are way ahead of everyone else and I don't think this would affect them at all.
I actually like the concept of choosing the best time to use your burns throughout a raid night. Being able to just go all out on every event with no regard for timers actually takes away an element of playing strategically.
Agreed. Watching someone play who possesses a mastery of their class is like poetry in motion. That Bard who somehow manages to beat out 90% of the DPS classes, or the Zerker who pulls DPS out of their boot, or the Cleric who performs 30% of all the healing on a raid in a field of 20 priests, or the Shaman who makes the top 10 DPS parse, top 10 healing parse, and their group is also in the top 10 DPS parse. These are not happenstance events. The numbers help indicate the level of mastery and synergy a group or raid can muster. I've seen a raid of 36 with one Bard out-DPS a full raid of 54 with 5 Bards. HOWWWW? They're just fantastic players. Mastery includes knowing your burn timers, putting in the work to learn your teammates' timers, timing, synergies, and knowing where and when to use which burn. The timers are quirky - I'll give you that. But they're also part of EverQuest's identity. It's easy to attain 75% of a character's potential in EverQuest. It's HARD to get that last 25%. In fact, I'd go so far as to say 75% of the game exists in that final 25%.
There is no real reason that Zerkers should have a burn that's on a 26 minute timer. Anything over 20 minutes should probably be adjusted at this point, class wide. Maybe I've been playing for to long but, rotating discs/burns to optimize per event, isn't hard and takes almost no strategy, it's certainly not poetry, although it sounds nice to say! The reality is, it's far from it. Personally, I think the best "win", when it comes to parsing is, when you can beat someone or multiple people and utilize your full arsenal of discs/burns. That being said, being top overall on the sustained in my opinion, is always the goal. Just curious, who doesn't wait for most burns to be up at this point, outside of racing? From a DPS perspective, it's all about the parse, don't most raid leaders know that? Why take the fun away from someone, to save 5-10 minutes?
I will wait on Mana and Tranquil but not on burns, we try to order the events to prevent waiting on the big stuff. Our time between events tonight was pretty quick even doing loot, and atrocious lag and things didn't seem rushed for us.
This... is not true nor practical in todays raid game.. You need the best of what every class can give you, to limit a class to playing at half their capacity or 3/4 their capacity is zero fun. If your not having fun what is the point of playing an old, half broke game??
Limiting? Half broke? Sounds like you're upset. EverQuest requires more of its players to attain their full potential. Oops, I guess. I'm not against simplifying/consolidating/standardizing burn timers. But the context you use in your post is hardly reason to change it.
I'll add one facet context to Zolav. The playerbase is only getting older. I'm not yet 40, but most of the people I play with are retired or past retirement age at least. During my weekly raids, I manage a couple cast/click rotations and every week I get at least one person who sends me a tell with something to the effect of, "Hey, I'm sorry, I might miss my turn tonight. I'm just getting old." I see three ways to adjust: 1. Make easier events that don't need every player at 90%+ competency. (Assuming playing current expansion.) 2. The classes become a little easy to squeeze out 90%+ performance. 3. Accept that fewer and fewer players will be able to progress in current content. Personally, I enjoy the complex raids (as long as it doesn't come down to a one-person fail for the whole raid). And I certainly don't want fewer people in current content. So, if I had to choose, it would be to take some of the edge of the learning curve.
Right on.. then add some positive spice to the thread.. it would be appreciated But lets be clear.. just because you didn't agree with a couple of reasons I posted doesn't mean they are not vaild /shrug
There really isn't a change to a learning curve by standardizing burn timers... I mean lets take Rogue's for example.. As far as I know they have the easiest disc timers to manage.. but you can CLEARLY see a competence level from one rogue to the next. We have had some max AA and well geared rogues that were just terrible. So the whole "eq is about planning and blah blah" goes right out the window with my observation above. I am very good at my class, the only thing standardizing timers would be accomplishing for me is making the QOL better and the game more enjoyable for many classes and many people and of course myself, it wouldn't change game play at all. If your a melee you still have to move well, get on targets fast... not die like a boob... if your a caster you still have to weave your stuff correctly. You still have to manage 5 min timers with10 min timers with 20 min timers if those stack..
The best time to use your burns? Bruh this is 2022... the best time to use your burns is every time they are available. with that statement it is fair to assume you haven't raided in a long long time.
I agree. This wouldn’t be something that gave anyone an advantage. It would make things more consistent. It’s annoying that most classes will says burns are up to start raid while a few still have 5 minutes left. Some of these timers may have made sense at some point, but should be made more current. The devs also need to understand that most classes are still using burn discs that are were made pre-level 100. Pretty sad.
What a ridiculous idea. So if you're doing a trivially easy farm event, and you know it's going to be followed by a very difficult event, you just go ahead and mash all your cooldowns on the trivial event since they're up? Or maybe your implication here is just "all raids are ez lol doesn't matter what you do" which I guess might be true for some content. We're about to hit Underfoot on Mangler. Choosing when to use your burns from one event to the next is a real strategic point, sorry if that goes above your head.
Not really, event to event holding off burns isn't really strategic planning as there's no timer acting as fixed constraint. Phase to phase burning of an event would be a better example, but very few people want to do an event that exceeds 25 minutes. There shouldn't be any cooldowns longer than 8 minutes, and an NPC should be available in raids to automatically reset cooldowns.
I didn't say I disagreed. If all timers were standardized (5m, 10m, 20m) then it becomes easier to coordinate. As I said earlier I am not against this. Alas, you may rest easy. You're not in any danger of being overthrown here. Those who stomp these halls hardly ever listen to my suggestions, anyway.
If your guild raids 24/7 then yeah, there's no timing constraint in between events. If you're like every guild that actually exists, then your raiding hours fall into a particular window of time. Sitting around for 30 minutes after an easy event because everyone needlessly burned all their stuff isn't really a great option for real guilds.
If it's easy event, then not using burns isn't going to increase anyone's enjoyment. You're just advocating for bad game design. A good portion of players want to perform their best each event, not just coast through a "school" zone. It's really not an engaging strategy. It's just a binary choice made at the beginning of the night by the raid schedulers.
Haha, not sure why your so salty.. I find it amusing! Thank you for that chuckle I like to be the best I can every time I sit at the keyboard, every event.. every parse. We clearly have two diff styles of play and I wanna play every event with everything my class has to offer maybe... well maybe that concept of playing your class to the best of your ability is something you cannot grasp, sorry if that goes above your head! But to clarify I am not referring to a quick event followed by a hard event.. I can totally see the intelligence of holding a big burn if it wont be up in time.. I am more referring to getting timers across the board to a more manageable place, many guilds wipe.. then have to wait a long time for timers to be back up again JUST to have a shot at winning.. its not all about easy events.. and simple timers.. it is more about quality of play.
Hey fair enough, you're right actually I was a bit rude. Apologies for that. I just don't think "hit all burns at all times when available" is correct strategy for MOST raid nights. If you're just farming trivial content then yeah, who cares, just burn 'em if you got 'em. But at least in my experience, that's rarely the optimal choice. Choosing what to use on which event is a big part of optimizing performance imo.
