Considering going for Cleric on Agnarr. However not sure on the race. How important would snare be from the Regent Symbol of Innoruuk be on such a server? Or would snare casters be popular enough that I can go with just about any other cleric race? Note, having the ability would just be a bonus, and by no means dictate me choose an Innoruuk Cleric over anything else, I'm just looking for opinions from others to help me decide which race to go with. For that matter, any opinions of other races would also be appreciated as well.
Dwarf clerics are cool because they drink a lot and have awesome beards. But barring that, Dark Elf is the clear choice for extra abilities. The snare clicky is great for groups that are missing snare, also good for solo fear kiting. And Dark Elf gets hide as well, which is even more valuable on a cleric than most other dark elves. Really nice to be able to afk in certain places with hide where other clerics can't. Also you won't screw up your home faction on any raids (Innoruuk doesn't care if you kill him, Tunare kinda does) and Dark Elves can wear all the top tier early expansion items. Dwarves can't wear Vulak robe.
Speaking as somebody who has played a cleric on both ragefire and phinny... just pick whatever race you like best. The DE snare ability is rarely relevant, as 90% of the time you're grouping with somebody that can snare. I rolled a DE on both servers just because I like to min/max, but realistically... I can't think of a single time that the snare clicky would have prevented me or my group from dying. I only ever had to click it a handful of times, and even then, it was just for convenience. Hide is nice, but again, never really necessary. In summary, play what you want. It's surprising how much of a difference that the appearance of your character plays in your gaming immersion.
This. I used to fret constantly about things like .. that race has 10 more stats here, or 5 less there .. in the end having 10-20 more stat points in any attribute won't make that much of difference in my opinion. Casting the right spell at the right time, making the right decisions in critical situations are way more important. Take those things into consideration and then decide ... do I really wanna spend my time playing a race I really don't like the looks of just cause it's the supposedly best min/max? Or should I really go for those badass erudite paladin looks for instance and know that in the grand scheme of things a few lesser stats here or there will hardly make a difference between life and death (like maybe in one encounter a month or even then?).
A lot of newer players like to hype up the snare clicky, but the reality is you'll barely ever use it and wonder why you actually dedicated your entire race choice on getting it. My advice would be to pick whatever race you like the best or think you'd enjoy the most. My short opinion on possible cleric races: Dark Elf - Probably the most popular choice. Good starting area, balanced stats, definitely a strong choice if you like the look of a dark elf. Erudite - Probably the least popular choice, or one of them. Starts in a pretty bad area of Norrath, but if you have a pre-made group of friends who all roll an erudite you can find some damn good camps. Gnome - Let's be real, you either love gnomes or hate them. Gnome clerics are a super fun choice if you ask me. Downside is they get the least starting wisdom of any of the race choices for clerics. Human - I am personally not a fan of Humans. Why play a fantasy game and choose a human?? That being said, they have almost an ideal starting point and very balanced stats. You'll easily find a group and get things started on the right foot. Halfling - What's that? You want even MORE exp!? Well then roll up that pie loving midget and get yourself a good old exp bonus. Downside is Rivervale isn't the greatest starting point, but it's not horrible. You can easily run to the commonlands if you'd like, or group up with some other halfings and eventually go the runnyeye route. High Elf - Want to be an elf, but not an evil elf? High elves have a nice starting area as well. They are a little stuck up if you ask me though! Dwarf - Wanna do a barrel role? Want to be nice a stout but still look down on gnomes (they are still VERY puntable by dwarves). Well then look no further than a dwarf.
Gnomes (ebil ones) can get clicky disease cloud! SO GREAT for agro! Mana free super taunt and long disease dot. If you duel an enchanter or bard, it is super handy to keep them from being able to mez you too. Also gnomes is awesome...and gnomes eventually get clockwork armor (clicky invis for a cleric is nice).....also gnomes is awesome and akanon is awesome and gnomes is the best in the world.
If you think you will play solo or duo with a non snare class, the snare clicky is extremely useful. I used it constantly in classic and Kunark camping gear and krono solo and with my enchanter. In Velious I got the Sap Encrusted Branch from Tunare and the neck has become a rarely used item since, but I still carry and use it occasionally. It is nice to be able to click it when you want it rather than hope for a proc. Some might say the idea of soloing with a cleric is silly. In classic we are very powerful and can do a great deal on our own with good play. If all you are doing is knocking over the PH and his two buddies rather than trying to clear as much trash as possible we are entirely capable of profitable solo play.
Thanks people! Dark Elf Cleric too common for me so I would go Human Innoruuk for the necklace. The bertox neck is nice if I was soloing, but I will have constant groups, the only concern is not sure if anyone will be playing a snare caster. But as I Said, I am not going to base my decision on that necklace, it's just a bonus clicky. I've narrowed it down with your help though! Halfling for the bonus XP, Human for the clicky neck snare, Erudite for the rarity and Gnome because Tinkering -and- can still get the dwarf brell alcohol necklace. I look forward to any further discussion about clerics, you guys are helping me narrow it down!
Dwarf is a great choice for cleric because of the starting str. You get to wear all that plate and loot everything.
I considered Dwarf as it was my very first cleric I ever created. But in the end the extra strength isn't enough bonus for me to use at this time, I do plan on running two accounts and I do plan on a cleric on each account down the line, I may revisit the Dwarf then. One of the bonuses I like about Halflings is I believe they can both hide and sneak. Very nice combo to have in many situations. Again, thanks for the replies folks.
Fifteen years ago or so a DE Cleric was my guild main and I can say the stats and racial helped more than the snare as I do not remember using it ever. But I do remember using hide a good bit, long as someone is around to confirm success and not running out of manna by the hair the extra stats gave. So yeah they are pretty good hard to go wrong
I made my cleric a dark elf originally for this reason. It was hardly useful at all in almost all situations. Play whatever race makes you happy. This. Helps more in Classic through Velious but sneak is so nice.
Being a cleric and having gate changes this a bit, but origin point is a consideration for me (a big one on non gaters). Being a gater, it comes down to how close do you eventually want to be to the PoK book? Some cleric starter locations are 2 zones away and a run to the PoK book. Best cleric origin is Froglok as the PoK book is right there, but that means race-changing or not rolling until LoY. Pre baz being able to get to Commonlands easily is nice. Inny humans can easily faction themselves into being kill on sight in West Freeport though... and I am not a fan of the NPC placement for the good clerics in Freeport. So I won't do human clerics any more. I'm okay with gnomes, but not very fond of Ak Anon... so I will probably go high elf this time. GFaY is so self-contained on a fresh progression server and saving travel time is nice if your playtime is in short bits. If you know you are happy to bind in commonlands and later Nexus then PoK then this may not impact your thinking at all. I've done the snare necklace a few times, never really justified the bother. I always think it will be really handy and then don't really use it.
In what way is rolling a DE contributing to best min/max potential? DE is 3rd at best. From a min/max perspective Halfling or Dwarf is the undeniable BEST possible pick when starting and stats actually matter... Halfing (Compared to Dark Elf):10 more STR (3rd best), 10 more STA (T-2nd best), 5 more AGI (Best until LoY), 3 less WIS (3rd worst until LoY, but also only 3 less than 2nd best), same hide, +5% exp bonus, sneak. The only real downside is the starting location that kind of sucks until Planes of Power. As stated by others, the snare clicky is largely irrelevant. Dwarf (Compared to Dark Elf): 30 more STR (Best), 25 more STA (Best), 20 less AGI (T-Worst), same Wisdom. Starting location is a huge plus, easy access to docks, not evil, able to easily move between hot exp locations on both Faydwer and Antonica. Quick table and some calculations I threw together to fit my narrative: Rank = Ranking (1st - 7th) within race group for cleric class, ties are counted as the same rank <Stat> MBL = Margin behind leader, the total number of stat points LESS than the class stat leader Rank Tot = Total of all stat rankings added together (more is bad) MBL Tot = Total of all margin behind leader numbers added together (more is bad) I guess you can argue on the stat weights here, with AGI being a huge factor in that as it is hard to come by on plate pieces, but the Dwarf is by far the most "stat rich" of all the clerics, and by far my favorite (reason for it being my cleric race on Phinny!). Does the +5% exp bonus make up for the loss of some starting stats? I think so, especially since it is eternal. I suppose you can race change after the min/max period is important.
Halfling sneak is a good point - you can always be indifferent to vendors / quest givers. But that's the only thing it's really useful. Dwarves get the cool forward roll when they run and jump. Gnomes get tinkering. One thing about those 3 races though, they're all short. I know that's kinda obvious, but it changes your perspective when playing (at least in 1st person). In hilly terrain, you can get more line of sight issues when casting. And getting up the steps in Kael is a nightmare! Another point to mention - high elves can get the Tunare quest bracer in Velious. It's not got the same usefulness or longevity as the snare neck, but it's not a bad bonus. They also get a lot of wisdom, but then, if you're raiding current content, it's not hard to max by Velious or so, whatever your starting stat is.
Wow, who brought the nerd out, eh Guzzle? J/K, no disrespect, that's awesome comparisons. I never actually thought of doing that sort of thing to compare the races. Puts Halflings in the lead for stats and ability usefulness (hide/sneak/XPBonus) tied with Erudite for the rareity. You've helped me narrow it down to two races, thank you! =)
Strength is literally worthless when doing a min/max comparison for a cleric on a TLP, would not count that. Do you know how many weight reduction bags are available? The additional damage at the low levels does not make a difference because we are min/maxing for max level where it won't matter at that point. The amount of mana per wisdom you get when your wisdom is under 200 is huge. High Elves get 12 more wisdom than anyone else, which is massive in classic. The extra stamina dwarves get just does not compete with this additional mana, especially when High elves have far more starting agility. It's not even remotely debatable. The min/max best cleric race to start with is High Elf. They blow everyone else out of the water in classic. Halfing xp bonus means nothing because once again, min/max is for max level, where the xp bonus is worthless. The argument for halfling being the best would be reasonable in kunark, however, when wisdom becomes trivial to cap.
Assuming you raid in Luclin and PoP, stats are an afterthought for a cleric as it basically comes down to resists, focuses and max mana. All of which are generally wrapped up into the same items. Do you really want to make a decision on a race purely because it gives you a marginal upper hand for the first few months of the server? That being said, Halfling XP bonus can get you max level a bit faster for the three times you need to level (1-50, 51-60, 61-65). Does nothing for AA I'm told. Sneak/hide is nice but it's not going to change the meta end game at all for a cleric. Same can be said of a clicky snare. The only thing that'll matter for clerics of any race is if they have the appropriate gear and if they can reliably show up, count to 3 and press a button.
