Chase Item Evolving

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Ruven_BB, Jan 2, 2019.

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  1. Lianeb Augur

    Some one is upset they might get banned.

    You are arguing a point of stupidity. How about stop playing like you thought it was ok and trying to justify your actions
  2. Venedar Lorekeeper

    I wonder where people XP their "Bloodstained Shoulders". Could it been in: "Working Overtime" in Bixie Warfront? You will find this handy exploit guide if you search

    Sep 02/2015
    "Picked up one of these for my 105 rogue. chose to do Bixie Mission Working Overtime. Repeating only step 1 when I get moles. Level 1 done in first task and up to 23% into level 2. Each mole counts approx. 2%. you get 10 moles per flower click. 8 flowers. so 80 dark blue con moles every instance. Level 2 slightly less - instead of 16% per 10 moles I got 14-15%, but by the end of mission 2 I was 35% into level 3 already. In level 3 I get 12-13% per 10 moles. end of mission 3 I am 30% into level 4 and getting 11% per 10 moles. If you get the wrong step 1 ( no moles) just kill a few bixies so the 5 min wait timer isn't wasted time. End of mission 4 and I am 22% into level 5. getting 10% per 10 moles now. end of mission 5 and I am 1% into level 6. just keep cranking. obviously the higher levels take longer.

    end of mission 6 : 74% in level 6 (73% for the mission)

    I got to level 13. I was getting 48% per task. someone told me to drop my merc. I jumped to 78% per task. Merc does take away from it.

    level 16 without a merc I am getting 67% a task. so much better without a merc

    level 19, still getting 58% per mission. be done in another 10 minutes."

    Majority of people even some that got Burden of Truth(when CoTF already was out) used this mission to XP their chase loot.

    Now there is another mission. Not as good but better then nothing that serve similar purpose.

    As other people are mentioning above. To suddenly call this an exploit is absurd. People been dropping missions for various reasons for a long time.
  3. Spellfire Augur

    And here I thought it was ok to drop instance and get another one ...

    Producer's quote, October 27, 2014
  4. Lianeb Augur

    Your quoting an exploit that that was fixed by moving all the xp to the final hail so that you could flip the missions (thus acceptable)
    Every isnstance of using a mission or mob to gain xp that has been quoted in this thread has been patched or nerfed in some way to prevent it from happening. Why in the world would you think it is suddenly ok to do. Just because it wasn’t thought of by the developers to be used as a “mob generator” at the time of development.
  5. Drogba Augur

    pretty clear to me that their interest is in understanding what the ever-changing rules are, while demonstrating the absurdity of it. Must've gone right over your head.
  6. Forcallen Augur

    What I have or have not done doesn't invalidate the original point I made at all. This is just you grasping at straws now. Anything that is generally accepted as fair play by the population, that might have gone on for decades in some cases, at any point can just be tossed out the window and suddenly be considered a bannable exploit. Thats the part I take issue with. And this "well this is my stance now so its the law" falls eerily similar to the stance Dzarn took with necromancer scent of terris. He took issue with something and it was taken away ignoring multiple similar situations for both debuffs and other "spells verses AA situations" for other classes. The new randomly applied end all be all stance that goes against the grain suddenly and haphazardly is the concern.

    Cactus gate was an exploit, popping raid things down to spawn raid gear from a group mission was an exploit, dropping tasks and then looting to avoid a lockout is an exploit. Flipping an instance to kill the base trash and then repeating should not be. Nore should going back for older hunters, travelers or collects via flipping instances 5 years after the fact. But Ngreths new stance and explanation says this all could result in bans as each is an exploit.

    But no I won't be getting any ban as I haven't done any of this unless they retroactively go back and get me for instance flipping for collects, named or achievements, from years ago, in content from EoK or earlier because of this new stance. My concern is for the people doing it now who don't know that suddenly flipping ldon instances for traveler achievements could result in a ban. Or hunters in EoK or collects farther back.

    The producer of EQ only a few years ago said instance flipping was fine as long as you dropped the task before getting the end reward. And now suddenly that is changing basically because one instance was handled poorly.
    Tatanka, Yinla and Graves like this.
  7. Risiko Augur

    While I tend to believe that people that cheat know they are cheating, I have to admit that it's pretty hard to ignore the fact that the producer plainly stated it was acceptable game play in that quote.

    This is why I think that all MMO companies should have a written knowledge base on what is not acceptable for their games, and it should be maintained with change logs. That way, when the rules change (for any reason), the players can reference that document to see the changes, why they changed, and know for sure if what they are doing is allowed or not.

    Make the rules known with out question. Make it absolutely clear 100%. If you need to add more to it because of people finding ways to manipulate the rule, modify the rule to account for it. Then when people abuse the rules, ban them. There will be no question that what they did was not allowed, so there is no reason to not take harsh actions against them.
  8. Littlelegs Elder

    Welp. That's kind of the b*tch of of it. On the 1 hand, devs don't typically weigh in on this kind of thing because there are SO many variants and available "things" you can do in this game (which is understandable since players are sometimes smart, clever, devious or lucky in figuring out techniques). On the other, it is ok for players to ask the questions (which is also understandable since suspensions can total in the number of WEEKS you can't play that account if you're wrong).

    What was ok, then wasn't. And now new things come up that were and aren't. As multiple threads sorta dovetail together here you could ask*: Is split raiding ok and getting loot in a dz that that toon wasn't in? What if we dps past a mechanic (Illa and his crazy cocoons)? Since the adds despawn in this mission on completion did we exploit? I just one-shotted some old raid boss and avoided a DT (that may not have been a DT now anyway), did I somehow violate what was intended? I can duck/illusion through this door without being keyed! Campfires can bypass keying requirements?!?!?

    *some of these may have been previously and definitively addressed by SOE/DB employees and also not been contradicted by other SOE/DB employees

    There have been countless of these zany quirks over the huge lifespan of the game that are way too numerous to count. By my estimation it's a bit of a crapshoot. Sometimes, you're dodging a lockout and get April vacation 2011 or Cactusgate 2018. Sometimes you're combining abilities that "whoops!" shouldn't work like that, and it gets patched and no harm no foul. Often it's a bit in between. Circling back though, I'm quite confident that in this thread is the quote from a current DB dev saying you must never drop a dz or task under any circumstance whatsoever. EVER. I mean, he basically said that or roll the dice of fortune.

    In the end the players and devs are alike: We're all losers. Go Pats.
    Risiko likes this.
  9. Tucoh Augur

    Are they flipping it via some kind of packet sniffing or what? (I don't even know if that's possible, just shooting in the dark)
  10. Sancus Augur

    You seem to be operating on the false assumption that, because they changed how something worked, the previous behavior was an exploit.

    Heroic Adventures had no lockout timers for the first year that they were in game. That was the design intent. Players ended up doing specific ones repeatedly (DH), so after trying a few other solutions (like rebalancing the xp rewards), they added lockouts. After they added lockouts, people simply dropped the task before completion. That was discussed openly on this forum with developers. At no time did any developer state that was an exploit. They did decide they wanted to change the behavior, so they moved the XP reward to the end of the task. Collections, rares, item drops, etc. were still farmable, and that was the specifically stated intent. The mole mission for evolving XP is also still farmable since you dropped it anyways (it still is to this day).

    There's nothing wrong with the dev team deciding they don't want players to do a certain thing and then changing the game to prevent that thing from happening. Retroactively labelling players as exploiters for behavior that was stated to be allowed, though, is pretty ridiculous. Fundamentally, the task system does not work in the way developers have decided its intended to be used. The lockout is given at the end of the task, and so are the rewards (loot, currency, xp, etc.). The rest of the task is not the reward associated with the lockout, and previously it was perfectly fine to do those other parts of the task repeatedly. If getting anything from a task repeatedly is now an exploit, they should lock at the start. It makes no sense to allow us to drop a task and reget it, but for that to be considered an exploit.

    And I also have an issue with the argument that this is an exploit because people are using instances as mob generators. That necessarily means that if they're flipping an instance for another reason (say collections), they are not exploiting. I know people who flipped this mission to finish up their collection set from it - were they exploiting? If yes, which I think can be assumed from Ngreth's comments, there was an uncommunicated change in policy. If no, why not? You have to kill mobs in the instance to get to the point at which the collections spawn. The byproduct of farming collections is, therefore, repeatedly generating mobs. If suspensions come, how the hell are they going to figure out the intent of the person flipping instances? Having the exact same behavior be an exploit depending on your intent makes no sense.

    And no, I didn't flip this mission at all (not even collections, because I'm far too lazy to actually farm them, I just buy them). I think calling this an exploit, however, is arbitrary and capricious based on the last communication players have regarding flipping heroic adventure tasks.
    gotwar, Moege, Yinla and 2 others like this.
  11. Littlelegs Elder

    Oh those disgusting mission flippers. I mean, there's so many of them, though. Which one?
  12. Tatanka Joe Schmo

    That damn pinball wizard!! He's got crazy flipper fingers, I tells ya!!!
  13. ZigZag New Member


    Just get out into a zone and grind it out like a normal person, quit moaning
  14. svann Augur

    How do you think he does it?
    Tatanka and Risiko like this.
  15. Risiko Augur

    Attacking them instead of having a constructive conversation with them is just sad. Using a burner forum account to do it is even more sad.

    Why do people hide behind fake forum accounts anyway? Own what you say. If people don't like it, who cares. At least you're being real instead of hiding behind anonymity. I have more respect for people that have different opinions than myself but do it publicly than I do for people that do it anonymous.
  16. ZigZag New Member

    ;tell Antonius.Pfaffe , 1v1 me
  17. Risiko Augur

    I don't know why when I first read this, I was like is he calling me out during lunch? lol

    Hey. If you are Pfaffe, then my apologies. I was just referring to the fact that your forum account has made 2 posts ever. One in 2014 and then the one I replied to. If you are Pfaffe, then I respect your opinion.

    I still think that your reply to him was snarky and "nanny nanny boo boo"-ish. I'm not on either side of this fence on this topic. I just prefer to see people be constructive rather than attack each other.
  18. Tatanka Joe Schmo

    I don't know! ;)
    svann likes this.
  19. Intenso Augur

    what voa zone / mobs is leveling new evolve item :p?
  20. Ngreth Thergn Developer

    see next

    I had forgotten about this statement. So I was incorrect. I corrected the aforementioned post in this thread.

    My opinion differs, but my opinion doesn't matter.
    Barton, Nniki, Axxius and 2 others like this.
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