Yup correct. Just wanted opinions. Seems its a duration issue for us. As our discs end and all we have to rely on is knifeplay it plummets. Our wizards do great obviously. Problem is bards arent always available for every melee group, which kills duration.
If an event is going to last for 12 minutes, you can burn immediately and have the same burn available for the finish.
Trash before Tita: /3 Combined: A praetor august magio in 508s, 273511k @538408 -- Rogue + pets 21639k@(44161 in 490s) -- Berserker + pets 18411k@(37269 in 494s) -- Wizard 17016k@(34446 in 494s) -- Wizard 16809k@(34096 in 493s) -- Rogue + pets 15896k@(32708 in 486s) -- Berserker + pets 14309k@(29626 in 483s) -- Beastlord + pets 14211k@(29121 in 488s) -- Magician + pets 14148k@(29292 in 483s) -- Beastlord 11849k@(24084 in 492s) -- Beastlord + pets 11527k@(23865 in 483s) Tita burn: /3 Praetor Captain Tita Aragus in 262s, 632223k @2413064 -- Wizard 44663k@(197623 in 226s) -- Wizard 42919k@(181862 in 236s) -- Necromancer 34680k@(145715 in 238s) -- Wizard 30761k@(139190 in 221s) -- Berserker 30472k@(126438 in 241s) -- Necromancer + pets 28679k@(123086 in 233s) -- Ranger 28428k@(118451 in 240s) -- Magician + pets 28245k@(115758 in 244s) -- Wizard 24611k@(101699 in 242s) -- Berserker + pets 24072k@(99062 in 243s)
keep in mind those raid are still melee unfriendly... if we get a bixie 1, DH2 or neriak 1-2 like fight next expac, melee will skyrocket again due to superior AoE abilities (if your guild can manage AoE'ing).
Disregard anything i said, the boost on test may make melee feel better, but a wizard that wants to embarrass you will: Wizard told you, '/GU Combined: A praetor august magio in 739s, 116292k @157364sdps --- #1 Wizard 116292k@157364sdps (157364dps in 739s) Wizard told you, '/GU Combined: A praetor august magio in 505s, 94364k @186859sdps --- #1 Wizard 94364k@186859sdps (186859dps in 505s)
Comparative burn parse: /3 Praetor Vitio in 97s, 425027k @4381726 -- Wizard 30993k@(340585 in 91s) -- Wizard 29030k@(319012 in 91s) -- Wizard 26627k@(286314 in 93s) -- Wizard 25102k@(278912 in 90s) -- Krixis + pets 22442k@(246614 in 91s) -- Rogue + pets 18752k@(203824 in 92s) -- Wizard 18366k@(211102 in 87s) -- Wizard 17968k@(213908 in 84s) -- Magician + pets 16336k@(173787 in 94s) -- Beastlord 13566k@(149073 in 91s)
Depends if you have a bst or not Krixis. Sad truth of melee dps if you lack a bard/shaman/bst you wont compete with or without the changes on test.
Praetor Vitio on 8/16/2015 Krixis - 241 --- Received Auspice of the Hunter - 1 --- Received Bard Epic - 1 --- Received Fierce Eye - 1 --- Received Fury - 1 --- Received Quick Time - 1 --- Received Shaman Epic - 1 Produced by GamParse v1.5.1.3
Actually, if i am going to see 1 parse, i want to see the best because you have a better chance, slight as it might be, of making more accurate logical inferences from it. The OP is claiming to be in a top 5 (and he may be) and claims to know his class but those total damage numbers are low for a top 5, even top 10 guild; there is clearly something off. Personally, if i was going to make a post like his, i would make sure that my sample size was large enough by posting multiple parses for the same events.
The real issue is you are comparing wizards to anyone. They are the only class that has ever been top tiered burst dps and top tiered sustained dps at the same time without some sort of fix addressing it, its been like 2-3 yrs now. It seems this will continue as is as the solution on test says lets make a few other classes try and copy that format.
There is no "average" fight. Every event has different BS that gets in the way. #1 has mobs running away due to tanks getting emote, #3 has a huge kick in the junk for melee, #4 slows melee all of the time due to traps. Vitio makes melee run away or reposition a lot. On the whole nothing slows down casters but there are lots of mechanics that either interrupt melee or flat out disallow it. Until that's taken out of the picture it's not an apples-to-apples comparison about theoretical potential. HOWEVER given that these mechanics are in place it's obvious to anyone who raids that there is a disparity and the theory has no actual bearing on the outcome. How to fix/correct the disparity is probably a bigger debate but some folks are being a bit dishonest in here and claiming that melee are "competitive". They're not. That's why that patch is on test right now.
Arx 1 is one that rogues should be able to compete on fairly easily w/ and w/o using burns till Tita. I am usually able to place in the top 3, beating or in between several wizards. I can post a complete parse or break down for you this afternoon if you wish. The 1st off raid rogues can dominate. I win this one weekly. Arx 2 depends on emotes, how you do the event, and if purple decides you need to die. Last night, he just ran over a 1 rounded two rogues w.o us touching him. Arx 3 is bad. Arx 4 is rng heavy as others have said. If you get a perfect run you can compete as a rogue. Off2 is not really competitive. The fight has to be sub 100 secs and even then wizards will blow rogues away. If it goes longer necros and magicians will creep above. Arx 5 is rng heavy again and not great due to lack a rear arc at some points. Depends on tanks and healers I have found. I get summoned by Lys and 1 rounded a lot due to tank deaths even when using escape proactively.
I think this thread should be replaced by a thread that deals with how to fairly and accurately judge a class's dps ability, because you're already not adding in situational things like assassinate, ethereals vs raid/group mobs, and while you are adding in dps, you're not really making a fair calculation out of it. My half proposal would be to deal with optimal group setups for melee and casters, but through a large variety of raids, and if you can somehow prove that you're being fair to it all and not just skewing a parse for your benefit which full group does more dps.(i.e. telling the caster/melee group that you're doing this so they do badly, or whatever). But even then there's so many situational things you're missing. It's too hard to do beyond giving a gut feeling, but obviously at this point pre patch casters have it better. Since you're already waiting on an improvement, try to make headway in this whole fair parsing scenario.
I think its a little silly to be trying to balance by class burn DPS and total DPS around marathon events like Arx 1. It seems even more silly to do so while a LOT of class changes are going on. I mean really, last patch you had caster gains with the critical damage % stack update. this up coming patch you have the core melee gaining damage (check out test patch notes Here) Rumor has it there also going to update a bunch of other stuff. But like anything they(developers) need TIME to code it, debug it, test it on there end, re code it, re debug it re test it on there end, put it in test, debug it again,test again, fine tune it, then release it. Play styles will most likely change, a lot. Additionally, On arx 1, my guild burns the 2nd wave of trash down, the boss is easy and annoying due to her mitigation. better to use the full burns on trash that doesn't mitigate and take longer on the boss. Our rogues that try on this event parse top 3 every time for trash, with other melee being up there. It's not a caster friendly event with the 'Low' HP trash mobs that have to be cast on while in melee range. TL : DR version: Sit down and shut up for a month while changes get made. Learn your class better
you need to talk to your necros then. granted, they need a ~60 sec ramp-up time to burn (wich mean vitio is almost dead at that point), but they still totally out-perform anyone on sustain (200k+ on TDS5?). Side question, those wizard parses... do they get a 2nd black wolf? ( from the necro group probably) paragons? QMs? maybe even a 2nd iog?
TDS5 is 2 main mobs at once for a sustained period. Its like showing 30-60 second parses of AE events for burst classes and claiming its the norm of them. Its not a good comparison or example to use. No class has been allowed to regularly win or be in the top 3 at burst. While also then able to regularly still be winning or be in the top three 3 minutes into a fight. While also then able to regularly win or be top three in every scenario related to grouping and or trash in raids. Except one class. That now is being used as the model for everyone else instead of being addressed like it was when any other class fit into those criteria of being one of the best at everything.
As a rogue I have trouble pretty often during burns because I cannot see through all of the swarm pets and stuff, I try to watch the target ring but it doesn't take long and you cannot even see the mob anymore. They also push the mob all over the place so not only can you not see it when it gets moved out of range but you completely lose the rear arc part of backstabbing. Casters on the other hand don't have to deal with the mob moving around like this at all. This just ruins the game for me as a pure melee. Please get rid of swarm pet push and give us the ability to hide them.
