Best way to bail from bad groups?

Say you need a break. It's honest- you do, you were getting frustrated and fed up and not having fun.
Remarkably enough, it's neither lying nor being offensive. Imagine that, social skills, online!

Make sure you give some warning, like "When we finish this task, I need to take a break for a while," or "I'll wait one more spawn round before I leave for a while," and ask in /gu (since you said it was a guild group) who wants to rep you. Get up, get a drink, walk around, change your visual focal point for a bit- it helps when you've been doing something for a while that was annoying you. Then come back to EQ, if you want to. Or don't.

So I am guessing you're in a non-raiding, grouping guild, if a tank was having that much issue with two healers (as a little raid gear goes a long way in survivability for a tank). As Tulisin mentioned, using your pet would have been a good idea. It is actually possible to do it without being rude, but at that point, it requires a little investment on your part. Do a compare in achievements to see what their AA count is like, while they're medding their endurance back after dying. Ask them about their gear, their augs. If it's clear they're well below what the zone would require tell them they're extremely brave, crazy, or both for trying to tank while so undergeared for this zone, and ask them if they have a bow for the named. I don't know which named you were camping, but remember, not all AEs and effects of named mobs even hit a pet, so you may have a significant advantage over a real tank, too. Before engaging a named, ask them if Fortitude/Deflection and Last Stand/Mantle are up or if they need to wait. Ask if they've bought No Time To Bleed yet (if they're a warrior), and talk about what an awesome new ability it is, or how great the SK epic is and why, or the paladin Penitence line. it gives people an easy out to ask what you mean if they don't know already.

I'll grant you, these options mean that *you* must be decently informed on what classes can do, but what I did notice is that you didn't say the tank's aggro was terrible and that others kept dying, but rather that the tank died. This speaks to either a deficiency in gear (simplest answer), or a lack of knowledge about defensive abilities. Both of those can be remedied fairly swiftly, usually.

Well, he said mercs. Mercs are... special.

One weekend morning back when Kunark was the most recent expansion, I woke up early and joined a group in LoIO around 6am. After a while, the monk said "Gotta go, bye!" and a minute later sent me a /tell that soandso screwed up and he was forming a new group. Our old group had broken up, so I joined. Every time something went wrong throughout the day, the monk would "Gotta go, bye!" leave, and reform the group without the screwup. In those days, there were about 125 people in the zone, so refilling the group was easy.

I was dismayed when the monk would bail over a minor screwup, or when it was just a fluke problem, I couldn't keep the group together myself with people disbanding when the monk left, and with the monk poaching groupmates, so I went along.

Finally, at 8:25pm, I remember because I looked at the clock, I made an error. "Gotta go, bye!" said the monk. I just laughed and laughed. Then I went and got the first decent meal I'd had all day.

This sounds like a hidden pet nerf post!

I see what you did there.

Tell them it's possible that two Cleric mercs both on reactive causes them both to use the same AI which might have a flaw in it. Let's try one reactive and one balanced. Make sure the tank has all of their best stuff up before tackling the named. Be sure to tell the tank that if they are getting pwned by the named that the group can try again with your Earth pet tanking and see if that goes better.

Realize the exp rate of the group is immaterial. Uber players, which I assume you are one given your 'tude, will be max AA in a couple of weeks if they aren't already. It doesn't really make a dimes worth of difference if you do some slow AAing now or AA fast and begin throwing away exp sooner.

Having joined a group you are as responsible for its success as anyone else. If you are not inclined to group with any of the group's members in the future you aren't required to. But, don't be that guy/gal who invites someone out and in 5 minutes says, "This isn't going well, see you around." in the middle of a restaurant. Pretend to be classy even if you deep down you aren't feeling very classy atm.

The universe isn't going to end if I don't get 10+ AA an hour and bazaar loot every single time I group.

My first reaction to this was as follows:

1. Type /gu Guys, I'm too stuck up to be in this guild.
2. Hit Enter.
3. Target self.
4. Type /disband
5. Hit Enter.
6. Type /guildremove
7. Hit Enter.

I have had days where a group I know does great and has killed a named a million times before can just have a bad night and die.

If they are both the same level and rank of merc then having them both set as reactive, it can be possibly be an issue if they are both are reacting at the same time. I would have one on during the pull and the other passive then one turned to reactive once the mob is in camp to have them not be in sync with each other; it really should only be an issue for named though; or having one set to Balanced or Efficient is another solution.

Qest, I've had that happen albeit not that long, but I think normally it wasn't just a single goof up but a series of annoyances and the screw up before the leaving was just the last straw. I myself usually just vent to a friend if a group is annoying me; I am too lazy to try and make a new group every time lol.

The best way to get out of a bad group is just to say you need a break or want to go do something else. Intentionally going AFK or acting like you can't play will do more damage to your reputation than just bailing.

Your bad group mate sounds like an app to your raid guild to me, so why not find out what gear and AA's he has and suggest improvements? You also could provide feedback to his sponsor. When I was one of those under-geared people, the guild posted what tasks I needed help with, and guildies started volunteering to help me get the progression done.

If the problem is a single played, call them out, repeatedly. They need to understand it is their issue and that they need to seek assistance.

Rather than bailing, suggest that the offending person finds a replacement for themselves, one who is better.

If you really do want to leave the group instead of making it better, help them along with a line like "Its not me, its you" and then drop.

You don't really seem to want to help your guild mates get better, so have the courage to say what you really mean.

Or, you could just help them get to be as awesome as you, so you have more opportunities to join strong groups because you laid the foundations instead of asking the forums how to dog out of a guild group.

Seriously? It's a game. It's supposed to be fun. He doesn't owe it to anyone to spend hours playing a game, and feeling miserable.

A bad internet connection could be getting your guildie killed, too. I die frequently when my internet connection drops and I can't tank.

I don't think that EQ is on the same level of being a game as Fable or Diablo where my discontinuation of play affects only myself. It also is not on the same level as a football or baseball team in the middle of a game. Class goes a long way though. Good sportsmanship goes a long way. A pick up group is one thing, but a guild group is your team.

There's always someone better. How would you prefer to be ditched by your team. That's probably how you should treat them.

I get it. But we are talking about Mykaylla's guildmates. If they are in Mykaylla's guild, presumably there is something about those players that likens them to the guild. If Mykaylla thinks they are capable of more than what they are giving, isn't it in the guild's best interest to figure out how they can be helped to be better? Like Aesya stated, a guild is your team. If you aren't interested in helping your guildmates, how can you expect to receive the help you need?

As a group geared tank, 4 deaths in 2 hours isn't particularly bad, I'd say it's fairly normal when trying to camp gear that provides upgrades. EQ is hard on us, that's just how it is.

Why do you care anyway since your pet can tank it?

Since you had moloed that named before, I assume when the tank died you took over tanking with your earth pet, and took down the named?

It is common in non-raiding guilds for a mage pet to tank better than a group geared warrior/paladin/SK. As a Berserker, I have been outtanked by a necro pet. Did you suggest to your group that on low health the tank should back off the mob and let your pet tank it?

... tell them you've got to see a doctor because there's a crack in your butt... /q

works for me.

Heck, a mage earth pet with the T3 or T4 pet earring will outtank every group-geared tank, T1 raid geared tank and come very close to T2 raid geared tanks. Also help that pet are immune to multiple magic detrimental spell... best example I can think of is Burntbark in evantil ; pets are immune to the 60k stun-DD he do every other round...

SK-war-pally have it waaaaaaay harder than any of us.

Honesty and integrity.

Honesty is key about leaving a bad group, or communicating period. Just say it like it is, sorry, watching XXX try to tank is giving me a headache, I need to go do something else. If the tank was doing bad, believe me he knew he was, and probably wouldn't be too offended for someone to admit they are getting a migraine watching them. As far as the altruistic notions of be the hero go, I don't care who it is, guildy, brother, wife, no one deserves to be forced to dedicate time to help gear a tank up. That is up to them, primarily. That is the curse/fun of a tank, we have to get the best in slot for every slot.

Help if you want, but believe me it will show if you do NOT want to be there. If grouping is your bag, which it might not be given that you are a mage, chances are good you will be watching I_just_learned_taunt tank at times. Of course also keep in mind that merc healers are exceptionally bad at dealing with spike damage of any kind, so they can eat tanks badly played and/or geared quite easily. It wasn't necessarily the tank's fault, but the results were what they were regardless.

I want to address the concept of outtanking someone or something being used though, because I find it extremely silly. I keep seeing people saying that a merc tank or a pet will tank circles around someone, or that a pet tank is so much better than a player tank with group gear (or even raid gear.) These people who hold this ideal I would be scared to group with, because they surely don't understand the role of a tank.

I am not a tank. I haven't been since Avatar of War and original ToV were end game. I do know that as an enchanter, that the tank plays a much more important role than just being someone to stand still in one spot and absorb damage. That's only a portion of what a tank should be doing. There are a few things that I think are being missed when you consider a pet or mercenary.

I. A tank must be alert
Tanks must be aware of every nearby mob. When a mob wanders into camp the tank should be the first to notice (the enchanter/bard should be out pulling, though they too must be alert.) A DPS should be free in most sense to sit around playing gems until a mob comes into camp, unless they are filling one of the other major roles of the group. A tank though must be alert at all times he is at the keys. He should know where the nearby mobs are, where the group members are, and even know that telltale sound of a mob 'walking' near them.

II. A tank must have increased knowledge of:
1. NPCs
Tanks must be aware not just of mobs, but of what mobs can do. He must know which ones are gaters. Which ones have AE's. Which ones have cones. He should know if it's a belly caster or not. He must know how to turn the mob away from the group. Which brings it to more knowledge, a tank must know his group and what they are capable of and not. He should know that the cleric can heal and from how far. That the caster can nuke or not based on distance from the mob, and how much aggro that caster can produce. He must know which ones need to be shielded and which ones can take a hit. He must know if he needs to turn the mob away from them, which means he also needs to know where they are at all times. He must know how to turn the mob away from the rogues/beserkers, and how to position the mob so a beserker who has just blinded or rooted himself can still hit the mob.
2. Detrimental Effects
He must know all effects of the mobs that you are fighting and remember any new unique ones. That is if a mob has an AE the tank should have looked it up if you have fought it before, to find out how far away that AE reaches. If it's 100' he must know how to move the mob away from the group (something a pet is notably ignorant of.) He must know to keep the frontal AE cones turned away from the group, especially the healer. He also should know which mobs have knockbacks, stuns, and fears and if the cleric and the rest of the group gets feared he should know which disciplines to use to survive/how to summon kite the mob around till the cleric can heal again.
3. PC's and Spells
He must also then know all of the major spell effects of each class. He should be able to tell you at a glance which mobs is mezzed, which is charmed, which is rooted, which is being mem blurred, etc. No other class really has to worry about this as much. If the mob is flashing Beguiler's Banishment he should know that not only does he need to be closer than the DPSers in order to get hit instead of them, he also must save his aggro abilities/taunt for when that mem blur goes off. (not a bad idea for other classes as well but a necessity for tanks.) This also means he must know how to break mez/taunt creatures in order to keep them from steam rolling a healer when they are able to be fought again.

III. Positioning
I've covered this a bit already.. but this is the most important part of tanking. Something that a merc/pet cannot do well. A good mage/necro/beastlord yes, can in a way control positioning... but having boxed a pet class for quite some time now.. I know that when an event needs you to 'pull' a named through a trap to trigger a hp lock... a tank is much better at it. Tanks must know where the mob needs to be, how pet push works, how to counter it when possible, and how to turn a mob so that those in the group can still do the most damage. He must know not just the mobs position but also his own, and those of everyone in the group. He must know who is closer, and why that is important. He must know how to find max aggro range for when needed, and how to teach others to do the same. He must know what abilities can move the mob and how they work and look.

That's just 3 things that a tank needs that a merc/pet cannot provide. Sure they can sometimes take hits better. There are certain fights I'd much rather have an earth pet on, than a poorly geared group paladin.. but there are also certain fights that I cannot see being done without raid gear on every caster, unless there is a real tank in them. (Heck there are fights my chanter could tank if he had the right resists, that doesn't make me want to invite another chanter to do the tanking.)

I do know that I'd take a PC tank in almost every instance over an earth pet. I'd also take a PC tank in almost every instance over my merc (sometimes if I am being lazy I would rather have my merc out to pick up my charm breaks, his reaction time is better than any humans). If a guild member asks though? I also put him up and invite them. Even if we have to pull out an earth pet and have him sit to the side while we do some particularly nasty named.

All things aside though, nothing out tanks a real player who puts effort into his class. Real tanks are much more than a wall that you throw mobs out. Knowledge and intuition must be present in any good player.

A well played and well geared tank can out tank a pet, but the pet can do it with much more safety, with much less worry about a bad round, with less Oh Crap skills, and with much, much, much less effort and work. Tanks have to keep their gear and augs up along with AAs and information. They work far harder to get to where they are than anyone and they usually work harder than anyone to stay where they are.

If you don't have any interest in helping people, that's your business. Just be open about that when you join the guild so they can make sure they want people like you in their organization. If you are not open about it, then the fault lies entirely with you.