Discussion in 'War Room (Powers, Artifacts, & Builds)' started by Oceanly, Feb 14, 2021.
For me Sorc is a great healer but people always put it low why is that
Because it's a free and popular powerset that is more complicated than most players think it is. So most new comers choose it and don't know how to use it at all which is a bigger problem than other powersets that you can just pick random powers and do fine. Plus, if it's about pure scoreboard numbers, a good sorcery rotation is going to have basically no npc healing ability so say a decent electric healer will out heal by millions while chaining npcs.
I've been sorcery for almost 10yrs and it's pretty embarrassing to watch some people use sorc. Then there's plenty that do very well with it. There's just multiple ways to play it that are set in stone and if you try to deviate too much, it won't work well.
As far as changes, stronger or hits more often watcher that only heals. 3 soul wells or 2 that tick faster. 10k 8plyr shield needs to be 5k. Bat form is great for terrible groups but I still refuse to use it lol
But in its defense, ibrarely hear people saying anything about it compared to years ago. It's like an old wives tale at this point that it's the worst. It excels in certain types of raids now compared to other powersets. Most of the people I play with consider water to be the worst/ most annoying to play with. And having had a few water healers try elites with us, hard time not agreeing. Those pools are annoying as all heck and their shields are pretty much useless now and most water users can not seem to work around that even tho it is plenty possible. Put a water healer in the FGSE Zues fight and let them try to solo. Not happening with shields and hots that place at their feet. But sorc can do it. Celestial can easily too. Electric, not as easy since nothing to chain link. Nature, well nature generally does well always
Sorcery healing is good, it just can fall short in certain scenarios where another healer power would have no issues.
The healing side is completely fine. For me, it's actually the pet system, supercharges and the dps side that has me feeling differently. Sorcery has always had a pet system since the beginning of its time on this game but I always felt it was completely unnecessary. The watcher was really all I felt it needed so I was actually hoping that the Fury and Guardian would be replaced with different powers after revamp.
I grew up as a 90s anime geek so when I thought of Sorcery in this game, I was thinking it would be like Aoko Aozaki's from (Melty Blood) because I grew up with that game. It's safe to say that my representation of Sorcery was based off of that. I of course, selected it as my first ever power in dcuo but I was very wrong when I found out it wasn't the cool destructive sorcery I thought it was but instead the manipulative, summoning type.
Pets, transforming enemies into animals, transforming yourself into creatures, grand summoning, applying curses...it wasn't what I thought it would be. Though, all those are definitely in the sorcery list I just prefer the destructive and flashy type over manipulative.
Example of my kind of Sorcery:
Have you tried Cursed Celestial?
You can do very well with sorc and use 0 pets/ pet powers. Not saying it isn't a pet class but you can totally ignore all that. But agree with above post, celestial is probably more what you were looking for
Some people likely use power intensive abilities like Shard of Life along with Orb of Arion and are out of power. Others probably rely on the wrong abilities for situations and expect different outcomes.
If they just put Circle to what it used to be, where going through it put the HoT on you, if would be a small change and likely make a big difference for players.
This is really spot on. Circle is a joke now, compared to what it used to be. That aside, it's a 450 base power cost power. Ritualistic Word - 300 base power cost. Shard of Life - 300 base power cost. Boon of Souls - 300 base power cost. Rejuv with the often recommended Orb of Arion- 750(!!) base power cost. Invocation of Renewal - 450 base power cost.
Then the pitfalls. If you spec Hybrid and don't pick the right weapon, you have almost zero power regen. If you were to also bring out a pet, Guardian for cheeky stuff or Watcher, even less power regen. You can really screw yourself up with Sorcery healing even before you get to the actual content.
When I came back to DCUO, I was furious whenever I'd switch to my Sorcery healer. No artifacts + all the downgrades that came with stats revamp meant I was constantly having a bad time. I've since made my peace, but it's only because I have some humbly leveled artifacts. Artifacts are a game changer for Sorcery (every power, really lol).
As Hellstroke points out, Sorcery is easy to learn but hard to master. My main character is a Sorcery Healer; in my opinion the DPS part of Sorcery is horrible. I dont use any of the circles or the wells; they are meant for 'stay-in-place' combat and there are few scenarios that allow that type of mechanic, let alone rely on players to actually "stay-in-place". Circles and wells require timing and luck; you could cast a circle in the right spot but your team decides to move away from that spot., wasting your power. I think many players get caught up in with how circles and wells look when you cast them and not use them strategically.
Sorcery is not very power-friendly. I have been on teams and watched as Sorcery Healers spam their heals until power-empty, then complain when face-planting season occurs. Spamming heals needlessly is never a good idea, especially if your powers/loadout is power-hungry. Power-Management is very important with Sorcery and it helps to have ways to obtain power without heavily relying on a controller.
What I would change: I would change the wells and have them move with the target for a certain amount of time. I would also add smaller circles and have them do the same thing as their larger siblings, except that they would move with the target as well. I would add more choices for the Arbiter of Destiny loadout, such as a Hawk, Dove, (haha) or Phoenix if it must be kept in a bird/flying animal theme.
what load do you use for healing
For healing I use:
Karmic Suspension (supercharge generator and help my grimorium artifact pet do more damage)
Ritualistic Ward (heals myself and 3 other people)
Boon of Souls (self + 3 player shield)
Rejuvenate (Priority Heal)
Invocation of Renewal (Secondary faster group heal)
Transcendence (Supercharge 8-man shield/heal over time)
By itself it is hard to maintain, but with artifacts this loadout is good for me:
Bottled City Soder (I put this in the first consumable slot so its part of my loadout) Rank 8 (highest rank you can get and my only fully ranked artifact)
Orb of Arion Rank 154
Purple Healing Ray 141
Grimorium Verum 160/Page of Destiny 130 (swap in/out as necessary)
I also use the white mods from the lair vendor; they help me out a lot! I also craft shields for my utility belt and keep my trinket pets there as well.
This is my own loadout through trial and error. I plan to use the Page of Destiny more once I get it to rank 140. The Purple Healing Ray lets me use Rejuvenate more often and I get a better healing pet from the Orb of Arion when I cast Rejuvenate, so I don't need to use the Watcher. Both Invocation of Renewal and Rejuvenate allow me to heal without having to be too close to the action or have to place down circles/wells and stay in or near them. The Grim I use with the DPS loadout when I am soloing or doing Event missions and older content.
My main issues lie with it’s range and hots from powers such as soul well. Sorcery has all the components to make it an excellent healer— they have decent bursts, a god-tier sc, and a pet that can help manage healing. But certain vital healing powers are often not used because the practicality of them is just not there for much of the content.
Prime example being circle. If they increased the range to that of water it would put sorcery in the running, especially since water can summon two at the same time, and that’s without their SC. Another being soul well. Soul wells heals in comparison to the cooldown are just not good. I feel that they either need to reduce the cooldown to allow us to have more soul wells out, or increasing the healing of it (my preferred option).
Another issue I have is with the “healing near the target” powers. We have 3-4 different powers that have that description which lower our overall range of healing, and so plugging them in the same loadout is just not a good idea imo.
I think the solution is relatively simple, although it might sound extensive- which is:
Increase the range of circle
Increasing the HoTs from Soul Well
Change at least 1-2 of the “heal near the target” powers to make it so we can afford to have our group spread out a little more.
I’ve only ever been a healer in this game, and at this point I’ve played them all extensively (except water), and the only thing Sorcery has going for it over other powers is their SC. Celestial has its amazing range, nature has the HoTs, water has the ability to reset cooldowns instantly on whatever power they choose, elec has amazing bursts.... I just think it’s time sorcery gets a buff.
For healing loadout, try this out. It's what I use to solo heal pretty much anything so far. (We do try to go with 2 heals so we can green spam elites but this is what I would use/ have used to solo heal them)
All OP/ elite gear/ maxed augs, all resto/ SP all into restos then 100 into might and power and 5 into dom, rest into health if you've still got more. Page of destiny/ purple healing ray/ orb of arion
Priority heal (use very rarely, basically treat it like a supercharger)
4 man heal (now 6)
Circle of protection
Invocation of renewal
No need for supercharges, spam the 4plyr heal. Will feed watcher and stack revivify. Can swap orb for EoG and put blossom sc into priority spot and play the same way as before, watcher picks up your slack.
Try to never use that priority heal. Only for emergency purposes or if someone important aka tank needs it. The ghost guy helps a bit but not really as helpful as you'd think.
I agree sorc needs some buffing but it's a powerset that tricks you into thinking supercharges are great. They are not. On either role. The spam bat is cool and all to have endless power but like your group would have to be just so terrible for it to make sense. Like we should never be in a position where endless spam healing is the answer. That means either the team is terrible or the healer is. That super shield is a 10k super. Throw it in the trash. And on dps side, grand summoning is cool and all but literally any of the other dps choices does better and I say this as a pet build/ source shard user
For your dps side, what are you using? It's actually a powerhouse using pets. Which in turn makes it terrible in a raid with a buff troll but at that point, you can run it as a full might build using trans/ strat/ solar amp like any powerset. Heat vision, vengeance or soul bolt depending on ST vs Aoe, and final ruin for St/ barrage for aoe then use either fury with offering or RSK and a supercharger. Personal preference is transmutation since it can't miss or neo venom if you have confidence you can do 15secs of uninterrupted dps.
If you want to keep using grim, you easily can too. I mostly use source shard/ grim/ solar amplifier. Offering/ fury/ godwave/ vengeance for st, soul bolt for aoe/ heat vision/ transmutation supercharge. Spam vengeance/ soul bolt and hit heat vision when ready, usually 4 taps of vengeance then I'll feed fury/ pop godwave (always feed then pop) hit heat vision and back to vengeance. Use orbital/ supply drop/ sidekick/ trinket pet. You can always have a trinket or side kick out on perfect rotation. No downtime so if source is 200, nothing is wasted.
Sorcery has definitely changed for the worst. It all started with that last power update, when Shard of Life had its cool down increased, the duration of Soul Wells were cut, even the Watcher suffered for a bit until it was buffed a few months ago, and Circle of Protection no longer applied a HoT unless you’re standing in it.
Some of sorcery’s necessary powers are very area restricted, like CoP and Shard of life. On top of that the watcher still runs out of power very fast, even with Purple Healing Ray resetting ritualistic word so you can use it twice, the Watcher never reaches max mana. Offering has an interesting interaction, as the Watcher can benefit from offering and gain a small percentage of your restoration but then you have to dedeicate a power slot to it and it doesn’t heal. I wouldn’t recommend replacing it with ritualistic word as it is your group heal and need to hit your group heal to proc two very good artifacts. (PoD and PHR)
Speaking of, these artifacts have greatly helped with sorcery healing. Page of Destiny when maxed can heal up to two additional allies. PHR restores power and resets the cooldown of your group heal, letting you spam it an additional time but powers should be functional on their own, without the aid of artifacts.
I really feel like they botched Sorcery in that last Powers update when they got rid of the 15 Power Points as well. It’s never felt the same and it’s become my least played healer. Sorcery, Water, and Nature feel weaker. Sorcery and Water don’t have good sustain and Nature seems like the new Electricity, just power hungry.
I’ve used this loadout. It’s viable, however I’m not a big fan of watcher. I find it doesn’t heal when I need it to and wastes power when I don’t. If I can’t have control over when I spit out heals I’m not a fan of it. Especially when I can put in an sc that allows me to heal as much as I want. You say there is no need for supercharges— you must not play with pugs very often and if you do you should know many like to ignore mechanics, often leading to taking massive damage. I’d personally swap out circle for shard if anything given that much of end game content requires you to be moving pretty constantly or spread out rendering circle useless. Sorcery can heal pretty much anything, there is no denying that, however I’ve seen plenty struggle in situations where almost every other healer does fine because there are just certain disadvantages with the power set that you can’t overlook.
I mostly only heal in elite runs these days so fair point. In elites, at least the tanks I run with, the tank doesn't move much so CoP works well and I love that I choose where it goes vs at my feet. Hated that about water.
On the occasions I do run pug groups, I just don't have power issues between sp and artis so the bat form is just not helpful to me. I barely need a troll in elites so in reg, a soda and supply drop can handle most things. If that doesn't work, then they're just too terrible, still ain't using that bat form. Now if we're going for a speed run or something odd then yeah sure.
Watcher, I don't love either but brings in some extra dps, he is a group heal, and I'm spamming my ritualistic word since it's stacking revivify anyway so why not let him feast. I literally sleep heal so I think he's doing most of the work anyway. I'll walk out to the kitchen if his power bar is full in easyish content.
Never been a fan of shard, it's not like anyone but the tank is in melee range anymore so set circle and forget works for me. Plus watcher is usually right on top of them. To each their own either way haha. As long as it gets the job done.
I think all powers including Sorcery should be looked into for revamps.
Sorcery was fine before the stats revamp. I don’t know why they even touched it, it was perfect.
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