Munitions vs. HL - Quick Comparison

After playing both powers I decided to run some test using very basic loadouts and compare them.

What I did beyond just using basic loadout I kept my toon precision mods when I switched back to Munitions for a short time. I also did not use Killer Instinct to activate BF, instead I used survival.

Here is my rotation for Munitions with stats.

Precision 4700
Might 8400

Munitions Test:
Loadout: Rocket Launcher, ChainGun, RailGun and Survival
Rotation A: Survival
Rotation B: Rocket, Launcher, ChainGun, and RailGun
Rotation Test: Rotation A, Rotation B until test time ran out
Testing Time: 3 Minutes
Number of Test: 20
Average DPS for Tests: 3,756
Average Critical Hit %: 31%

HL Test:
Loadout: Fan (do not need anything else)
Rotation: Fan infinite range combo (Fan, Light Blast, Impact, Ram, MiniGun)
Test Time: 3 Minutes
Number of Test: 20
Average Critical Hit %: 26%


Average DPS for Tests: 3,236

Simply swapping over to Munitions without any changes to mods, not buffing the toon with Killer Instinct, or using a more optimal loadout my damage out is roughly 500 more damage per a second than a HL toon that is using the most common HL rotation. Adding to the hurt is that without getting any critical attack increase from KI Munitions critical % was between 29-33% regularly and HL the highest I got was 28% with ranges from 23-28%.

I used these two powerset as BF and HL AM should be similar for buffs and should almost produce similar damage out without anything else, in fact, I thought HL would be stronger as using Inspiration would take you out of the AM. Therefore, HL is far inferior to Munitions.

This is crazy and needs some looking into developers. The fact that I did not use KI and did not change my mods for this test clearly shows that HL is not on even playing field with Munitions, Quantum, and Mental.

Please take a look into this.

I've noticed in my tests that the HL critical hit % is surprisingly low compared to the other powers.

With Mental, for example, I pushed 33-37% crit chance on my test server guy last night. Nothing lower than 33%, mostly in the 35% range. With HL I never saw anything above 29%, most of the parses were in the 23-25% range.

Have you tried incorporating Inspiration at the start of the Light rotation for the Precision and Critical Attack Chance buffs?
SpikeQuake can be useful prior to the initial cast of Fan to apply Dazing for a little extra damage and power return.

I actually did a few tests yesterday, all over 30 secs, with inspiration clipped with chompers and without. "With" does increase the crit percentage but not by a huge amount, increases from the average 25% to a measily 28% max. I still think HL should get the Inspiration Buff if the full animations are used, cause right now the only way to possibly attempt to keep up with Mental and Quantum is to clip the Infinite Chain together asap.

Ahh, remember the days when HL, Celestial and Rage were meant to have a very slight advantage over all other powers due to their Combos?

[quote="MEBegnalsFan, post: 3271403, member: 325679" 'snip'.[/quote]

Your testing is accurate. HL DPS is perhaps the worst DPS power at the moment. It seems to have happened after GU47 as before that I was able to keep up with quantum and munitions. Post GU 47, the developers unknowingly and unintentionally messed up with the power and it hits like a pillow in the game.

I went to the extent of removing all my mods and selling the exobytes on the broker because it is not a power worth DPSing with anymore. It is shockingly bad and even the word bad sounds better in comparison to the manner in which the power plays out.

its simple there 2 tiers in damage and the tiers are far apart ! Munition , Quantum , Mental , Earth , Celestial and Sorcery ! ( and soon to be Fire ! Then there everyone else

MUNITIONS

LIGHT

Add to your list Gadgets and Rage as both can stay up there with the right loadout and with a skilled player. The 2nd tier of powers are Ice, Nature, Electric, HL and than there is Fire.

The 2nd tier powerset do 40-60% less damage on average.

I did a real live comparison with HL and Munitions in the new T7 duos using those same loadouts.

Test Info:
Instance: T7 League Hall duo
Number of runs: 2 runs for each various comparisons
Powersets Test 1: HL vs Ice
Powersets Test 2: HL vs EMP Gadget
Powersets Test 3: Munitions vs Ice
Powersets Test 4: Muntions vs. EMP Gadget
Ice toon might: 9500
Gadget toon might: 9800
My HL / Munition toon Hal: Same rotation and stats as my initial post.

Test 1:
HL vs. Ice
Ice DPS with Syn VI vs. HL DPS with VII mods, I barely outpaced his damage, 5-10K total. The Ice DPS also had issues around power, so he had to use WM until his soda got off cool down. If the Ice DPS had power throughout the instance and had VII mods I estimated that Ice is about 5-10% stronger in damage than HL.

HL vs. Gadget EMP loadout
I got killed. My damage out was about 30% less on the a the run where the Gadget player messed up and miss Battle Display on his rotation on each boss. The second run he did even more damage out; I would say that EMP Gadget DPS does about 50-60% more damage.

Munitions vs. Ice
Keep in mind I'm not using KI to buff my Munitions toon and I'm keeping SP and mods towards precision. Munitions out damaged Ice by an average of 15%. That is crazy considering I'm not optimizing anything with my Munitions toon loadout or mods / SP for might based damage.

Munitions vs. Gadget EMP loadout
A bit behind but not like a HL toon. I would say 10-12%, which I believe could be made up with KI, proper mods, and using Splosion when appropriate.

Here is something I have notice: Sorcery, Earth, Mental, Gadgets, Quantum, Celestial, Rage, and Munitions have all been updated or introduced in 2015. All of these powersets can produce really good damage. Actually Mental damage has been proven to be OP due how much of a damage boost MT gets from the three prior powers, maybe that will be adjusted after Fire becomes the next OP power. Since the latest hotfixes, all of these powersets, other than Mental, produce very similar damage out. This makes these powersets, dare I say it, balanced.

Now let's look at the powersets that have not had any AM updates in 2015; HL, Nature, Electric, Ice and Fire. All of these powersets produce lower damage as they have not received the 2015 AM treatment. The 2015 AM treatment boost damage of 2014 AM powers by 40%-60%. This means in 2015 we should see HL, Ice, Fire (we know it is coming), Electric, and Nature get an update to the AM. Now that GU47 has launched, all powers have AM, and 8 of the 13 powersets are close in damage and one on its way, that leave 4 powersets left to adjust and make balance.

With all of this said, I'm happy to see so many powersets are able to reach top in the Scoreboard for DPS. I hope that by GU50 all powers damage out will be similar.

Here is to 2015 DUCO powerset AM balancing. Hoping to be a HL DPS again in the near future, until that time, I'm troll for hire if you need one.

Being a long time HL player I know the benefits of Inspiration vs. AM. There is no gain and the gain is for a very short time frame. I normally use Chomper instead with GH for a Might base DOT prior to going into the AM, so I know how to get some extra damage out as a HL player.

As I stated I was doing base non-buffed Munitions BF AM with minimial effort vs. HL Normal Range AM without any added bonuses damage to compare two powersets that both get a boost in damage and that do continious smaller ticks to get its damage out. The difference between Munition Range AM with BF and HL AM combo was quite surprising. First, with HL there are the Hold and tap of Squre comapred to simply holding down L2 and going Square, Triangle and Circle when I was Munitions. With HL, there is a higher % I will mess up the AM, though unlikely as I have it pat down, but the probability is still there. With Munitions, it was simply hold down L2 and do the rotation I mentioned.

Comparing the complexity of the two and the fact that I am speced for HL AM and not Munition AM I thought HL would do better damage or kept up, not get beat like it did. There is definitely a balance issue here and it needs to be corrected. Hopefully soon.

I do have to state this. HL AM boosted ticks ranged from 700-1200 non-critical with crits hitting in the maybe 3K range. Munitions tick ranged from 1,300-2,100 range for non-crit hits and the crits often exceeded 5K.

i agree i just made this post talking about hopfully gu 49 will do more then just fire !
https://forums.daybreakgames.com/dc...u-47-updated-3-powers-how-about-gu-49.253097/

we are on the right path ! and yes im hoping they can do more then 1 power per update ! if u look mental was a slight adjustment very simple !i really don't believe its alot to do now the am are in place ! just buffing the powers !

I really hope that devs can adjust HL in gu49. . We have posted many threads , provided proof , what els do they need?

money

I'll pay

Nice post sir!

Now, let's see if something will be done finally.

That is if a green name even acknowledges the issue....


IA ARMY

Don't think so , this thread is number 12! That have been made

Just a little wishful thinking...


IA ARMY

Am with u too :/

So I kinda gave up on dps and respect to have the following loadout: chompers, fan, claw, chainsaw, lightweight.

Chainsaw is the biggest letdown ever. Feels like I'm hitting with foam instead of HARDLIGHT constructs. Is there anything ****** like to make my light hard?

But in other news trolling is fun. "Choo choo b!tches" is now my favorite thing to say when doing last ngn boss.

We know uv been saying this in every hl thread -___-

Maybe biggest HL letdown and appropriately so but munitions has mini nuke.