Bad luck counter broken !?!

I'm atleast 21 + bosses in regular and elite alert which is bs

The expectations are pretty natural ones though when it comes to playing an MMO, especially when characters have actual slots for items on their inventory page which were programmed to be there (and to remain empty for weeks on end without the use of replays). Most MMO's have end game gear for players to obtain, or better yet, optional items they can sell, or in total vanity, items that let them put off a kind of "peacock strut" when in open zones, either through a style or a pet or a title. Players can return over and over to the zone to farm these items, either to sell or to enhance their look. The best MMO's have a farmable resource, like a particular metal or animal hide which can then be used to craft the very best items in the game. (Incidentally, players can usually sell these items as well).

Occasionally, MMO's will stick a stat enhancement or affinity item in a dungeon for players to farm with the hopes of maxing their stats. In those situations, the drop rate is determined by the number of players that enter the instance, so there is motivation to get your build in synch with your buddies so maybe you can turn a recommended four-man run into a three-man run to up your chances. Really good players even create solo builds to significantly up their odds.

Best of all, it's free to stay logged into the content experimenting with load-outs and pushing yourself or your group toward maximum efficiency. Here, progress is measured by a stat that will become obsolete in a matter of weeks anyway, but there, by a more lasting enhancement, server rep as a crafter, or title / style / pet hunting that sets the player apart. It's base psychology in action.

I agree that there is a casino type psychology at work here, but it is one that ultimately up-ends itself in the following ways:

#1 The "futility window" is very short, meaning what is obtained today is pretty much out of date in a few weeks. We especially saw this as we attempted to get CR120 drops just last month. It is no different than going to the grocery store and moving the milk jug in the front (which expires in six days) so you can grab the jug in the back (with a 10 day expiration date). We both know of players in our league who don't bother logging in at every release now -- and let's be honest -- why should they? The gear differential can easily be made up by pushing the current DLC to the back shelf, and grabbing the next one with a longer expiration date.

#2 Over time, the "futility window" comes to be seen as what is being purchased by replays, not the gear or the stats. In the end, this causes players to play less, not more. If you think about how often and how hard Helios farmed content in the search for "Blood Bat" wings, then the difference between the types of reasons players log in becomes very apparent. The casino psychology works better when the odds of winning something with staying power is the reward.

#3 With casino style stat & gear chase, the older content (which a solo player can't simply log in and farm for fun without finding a group) becomes mostly irrelevant. The proverbial jackpot is a can that keeps getting kicked down the road. At year five in Guild Wars, I was still heading back to some of the first dungeons in the game because what dropped there was still relevant to my play & to in-game economics. At year five in DCUO, I barely remember what Outer Caverns looks like --- and honestly, I have no reason to ever go back there. I do like the 12 piece of relevant content window and think it's a step in the right direction for easing that issue, but still that's way too many releases that simply fall to the wayside every three months imho. Their programing time and resources are worth more than 12 weeks of play I think.

#4 The loot system doesn't reward talent or skill and higher CR players often exist simply based on luck alone. The DPS that totally drug your group down can emerge with 2 drops in one run, while those who carried him / her through the content can see 2 drops over an 8 week window. It's casino psychology, I get it -- but it works against gamer psychology, where the belief is that those who work harder and put tin the effort are justly rewarded. Maybe not in that run, but they can feel as though they'll get theirs in due time. In this game, maybe they will and maybe they won't... I haven't finished a set since before LaW. No matter though, because here in DCUO, Leroy Jenkins can get his in a couple of runs and it doesn't feel good to think that they only way to catch him is to buy replays.

At any rate, if the loot and gear philosophy is going to be "you probably won't be maxing stats unless you are lucky," then I believe it works against gamer psychology, not for it. Gamers like the reward for working toward something, it's like crack cocaine to them, and I think given the nature of requiring replays to work a random loot table, I believe player frustration will snowball into a no-win scenario for gamers and developers alike.

I hope I'm wrong.

So would it be fair to say that if you want a rare gear drop from the Elite alert, you should avoid playing any raids from Ep 14 and up or the normal Ep 16 alert until you get what you want?

If that is the case than it took my toon DirtyWonder 24 bosses to get a piece of gear. I did DC regular and elite the day it dropped last Wednesday. I did DC regular, elite and BS on Thursday. I did DC regular Friday and Saturday and the last boss on Saturday finally dropped a piece of gear. and I did not get a piece of rare gear until the 24th boss. I thought DC reg, elite and BS were all separate. Now that we can confirm that they all count my drop rate % when from a good 6% per a boss down to 4%.

Looks like we can state that rare drop is around 4% and increases as such per a boss. Unless developers want to provide to players the actual % we start with and the % increase that we get when we get zero rare gear from a boss.

This is counter intuitive. I like the bad luck counter, but it only needs to be in the content that is part of end game progression.

You should sticky this at the top of Gotham City.

For the record, the system is working better than before - there has been a noticeable difference, at least for me.

How many boss fights before we are guarnteed a piece of rare gear.

Well me and my league replayed elite 20 times over the past holiday weekend, and I received the 123 waist, back and another back I believe that I put on my tank side. So that's three pieces of gear total out of 20 replays, I just don't understand.

Why would 112 gear drop in a raid and new elite content if you can get the 112 out of the duo?

Why is there no new synthectic mods after all this time?

Lastly I farm, because I really don't like putting generic mods in my toons, but buying total recovery kits every month for three roles is a bit much. What yalll think?

i have not received a drop for awhile now and think it should be looked into i believe i should've got atleast one drop with the amount of times i ran the elite alert. i have not had a rare gear choice in the elite alert yet. i'm going to see again tonight and reset a few more times to see i get a elite piece instead of 112cr item level. then ill be close 2 10 elite runs without a drop and to make things clear the last four times i ran elite that was the only thing i ran i havent ran the anything else the past 2 days that would skewer my chances.

Thank you for the clarification and that you and the team took the time to fully confirm it was working and to improve our understanding of the system.

And let me just add that me and my league really enjoy this game very much and we support DCUO heavy every month buying replays, total recovery kits, scanners, booster gold bundles and so on cause we want our toons to be competitive and strong.

So if the gear is rare that's fine but, when I see someone that only ran the elite 10 times and receives all four pieces and I ran it twenty times and only receive three pieces and two of the are the same that is an issue.

My league mate received 3 elite waist and a reminder we ran this twenty times, its just not understandable.

Probably not without merit to keep the number quiet. As was pointed out in another thread, once you publicly announce the number, everyone will start mathematically measure the rarity drops against it. Leads to a nitpicking fest ala "I ran the elite alert 27 times, shouldn't that round up on the rare drop reset". Could get very annoying and out of hand very quick.

Also, if the Devs decide to change the number (for very good reason), it would turn into a massive community vote which would stonewall any progress that might have been intended.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to know the number but I understand the obnoxious nagging potential against the Devs is extremely high. They have enough important work on their hands at the moment.

Inquiring minds want to know: Why?

Well I don't care about the numbers of rare drops just would like it to be a little bit more fair especially when you spending real money you know.

I am okay with it, but I am good with Vendor Gear. Normally I use the Vendor Gear for my DPS Spec, and dropped gear for my controller spec. Sometimes one is higher, sometimes the other is higher, but both are always high enough to run things with my friends.

Well over the weekend i did not play any other instances except for DC elite...like 10 straight runs without a drop. Explain that to me please.