Even if it internally had no cool down and you could stack it upon itself, it still has the cool down of the tank cleanse move, so that's not entirely true now is it, all its really done is turn most other tank power cleanses into shatter restraints and given ice a bit of a bonus. I hardly see that as game breaking, but yeah, keep the hyperbole up.
Joe, please stop reminding us that this place exists. This is Ground Zero, the cess-pool breeding ground of bad ideas and questionable intentions. For the love of g*d one guy here just suggested people are commenting to be in a video of... a.. dcuo.. player...
It is comparable to artifact swapping though, that's not a tangent. Literally every time a artifact is swapped to avoid the mechanics of an artifact (like losing stacks) or to gain an effect or stats to stack with the next, it's unintended. Yet he has videos encouraging it. While then saying this one power, for one powerset, for one role, should be a priority to fix....because oh no EXPLOIT lol. As to the duo purpose. If ya want damage and use it as a DPS, you use the channel. If you want a straight instant HoT as a Tank, and avoid the mobility issue and awareness that impedes you as a Tank, you cancel it. Only in a hybrid situation, youd want both damage and healing so you use the channel. Again there are so many healing abilities in this game where you activate the power and it instantly starts a HoT without needing to stay in an animation for 5 to 6 seconds. I understand it doesn't compare to other channel type moves, but it does compare to other HoTs. Tanking is far different than healing. Iconic drain for instance, can be used through a whole channel (which is far shorter) but a healer doesn't have to worry about grabbing adds, lunging or blocking a boss, or moving to the other side of the room to grab another boss and/or adds, lunge or block....especially if they have a tank in the group they don't even have to worry about avoiding most things.
The point about artifact swapping is the irrelevance to the move being adjusted, if you have an issue with a specific artifact then raise it as a separate issue in itself, but an artifact being an issue doesn't mean you get to keep your broken fire move, it just means there might be something else that needs to be fixed. This is pretty much the same as anything, if you were doing damage in any ability and you decide to jump cancel or block cancel it, then that's when that damage should also end, when you cancel something you've stopped the move and that needs to be a clearly defined rule, that means the affects stop at that point whether that be healing or damage and that's what this fix is doing. If there are other moves that are broken discuss them, but let's not pretend like this move wasn't breaking rules, it was, there are rules around everything in this game and yes there are outliers that probably need to be fixed in a heap of powers and once they get to them there's almost certainly going to be people feeling exactly like you do, take one other example.. just wait until they get to gadgets suppressor turret not behaving like other pets, you won't be alone.
The point about artifact swapping isn't in defense of both getting fixed (afterall I'm a huge supporter of eliminating swapping for the exploits.) It's about his judgement. It's about his hypocrisy dealing with exploits. He literally makes money defending and showcasing artifact swapping on his channel. He was one of the first to publicly show how to do it for crying out loud. So to sit here and pretend that's its all about exploits and what needs to be fixed, yeah, his perspective is beyond ridiculous. Now, you could say I'm a hypocrite for wanting artifacts fixed but not this. However, I've laid out how I see it as a duo function role specific power. IF IT GAVE BOTH DAMAGE AND HEALING WHEN CANCELLED I'd say it needs to be fixed. But, it doesn't. I seen it as a channel for DPS and an instant HoT for tanks. Was it intended that way, I dunno, but it's been this way for a very very long time. I just thought it was an awesome, unique fire specific power, and more importantly a viable option for tanking, because no channel move is good for tanking.
The problem here is you’re trying to separate the healing aspect from the channeling aspect from the damage and no where in the power set does it state that the healing isn’t part of the channeling aspect of the power… you can say other abilities have an hot aspect to them that doesn’t keep you in animation for 5 or 6 seconds .. the problem here is those are not abilities that are designed to be channels this ability is … other healing abilities that are channels cease the minute you cancel .. that’s the reality… the developers made rules about abilities .. if it’s a channeling ability and you cancel It any benefits or effects from that ability cease immediately. You can’t seperate the heal from the damage aspect since there is nothing that clearly indicates that only the damage ends when the animation is canceled and not the healing … and it’s clear the devs don’t agree with that thinking either that is why it’s being fixed cause it was working improperly.
OK. But at the same time it says when the burning PI is applied, it heals. That part is a secondary effect, not the primary. I apply burning with a separate move, and target the burning enemy to get the heals. No where does it say, must use channel for heals. The first description discusses the ability as a channeling damage move. It's OK, I separate the two based on role. Seems logical to me. If yall didn't see it that way, then we will never agree, and that's OK too. Edit: I wanted to be sure so I checked it now. It does say first part recieve heals while channeling. But bottom part says additional health to burning enemies, which doesn't say while channeling.
I get where youre coming from but the thing is it should be assumed that since it’s a channeling ability all benefits cease once the channel ends .. is there any other abilities out there that are channels that serve a dual purpose ? I’m asking cause I truly don’t know. I get why you wanna keep it i know the heal can be used in a life or death situation especially if a healer goes down .. I’ve used it and have seen how strong the heal is… its a very strong heal .. if you think fire needs a stronger oh sh*t hot I would argue for that .. but as far as this ability goes its not working as intended and I’m guessing has just been an over site for years .. trust me if atomic had something working in a way it shouldn’t i would agree it needs to be fixed wouldn’t even argue it .. if its breaking rules the devs have set forth I’m fine with it being fixed .. that goes for earth which is my second favorite tank power in the game and ice which is my third .. I don’t want thinks being broken … cause it creates issues like this
Artifact swapping isn't an exploit and people need to get over it, you're allowed to swap your gear, period, so I don't care what he's showcasing on his videos, he's doing nothing wrong. As for this move, to repeat again, it was never supposed to be an "instant HoT" as you put it, so it has been fixed, it was breaking rules, you obviously just never realized it was. It's not even like it's critical to fire tanking, I'd almost be sympathetic and say, yeah let's leave it there if fire tanks were heavily reliant on it, but they're clearly not, as presented by the evidence.
Well that's what I meant way earlier in this thread. I would be all for a HoT move over this. Afterall, thats what Fire tanks were using it for, not the damage. This change, fix, however one sees it, makes the power obsolete for tanking now. And that's the thing, I don't want to see another power be useless. Will I still use it on my DPS ST loadout, sure. But, I'll never use it for tank.
Proxy, are we gonna get into semantics? Yes, being able to physically change out artifacts for different bosses, content, scenarios, roles, etc is intended. Swapping during combat before an effect runs out, to gain another effect to stack on the previous, or to prevent the scripted mechanic of an artifact bypassing the intended effect drop is an exploit. (Like avoiding stacks dropping.) Two different things here. Stop playing. We had this discussion in the other thread and that's where that belongs. However in this thread, this context, one person here wants to pick and choose which exploit they support.
How do u know it wasn't intended do you even know how many powers have abilities tht are not in the description? 1 example atomic density is a shield supercharge generator it givs you supercharge every time it gets hit. Do u want more examples? Also earlier u said mimimi superman exploit isn't game breaking and group breakout has a 18 secs cooldown so its ok I bet you say the same about lazarus and other stuff as long as it suites you I cnt count all these fire AH tanks tht tanked swe+ solo with it even the casuals because its so game breaking
You can still use the move if you want the heal, you just can't cancel it anymore and get it for free, even if we take your argument that artifact effects should drop upon the removal of the artifact you've basically just countered your own argument and lost your original position as a result, so I assume you now accept this change is the correct one? I'm sorry I'm just not seeing the issue here and I'm not sure attacking ObsidianChill for supposed double standards or attacking other game issues is lending any credit to your position that you want this to somehow be reversed.
Not at all, I'm telling you that raising other issues, even if we agree or not that they're issues isn't a defense against this change. You're basically saying "You can't change this, because that's also broken and if you're going to leave that broken, you need to therefore leave this broken". It is quite literally the dumbest argument any one can ever run against something.
No what Im sayn is u ddnt know it wasn't intended n at the same time defend other stuff which u hv much more proof of it beeing broken. If u wanna talk about game breaking stuff thn start talkn about lazarus
What’s wild about this whole thing is it isn’t even a core fire power. It almost never goes on loadouts. Nor is it even close to necessary. The reality is a 20% buff to it is huge especially with someone who knows how use it effectively. They are slowly making changes to the powers to correct actual broken things. what fire really needs is a better set of super charges instead of always using PP/dash and the ability to cancel ah with a simple block without worrying about being stuck in it. A bunch of powers have taken way worse hits than this over the years to their core mechs. This is barely worth the time to write it.
Ok so I don’t know fire all that well since my fire character is an alt I rarely use … this by no means I don’t understand the rules of channel abilities game wise which this obviously was breaking those rules … you might not agree but apparently the devs do. With that said and why I’m saying I really don’t understand fire all that much is .. I’m curious maybe since so many fire tanks complain (rightfully so I’m guessing) about the shields afforded to wire being weak and useless … (and again i don’t know if this would be at all game breaking) maybe ask for the useless shield to have a HoT aspect to it … i don’t know if that would make fire unbalanced it might I don’t use it enough to make that determination .. but it doesn’t seem like it would break any rules the devs have set the way absorb heat is. Obviously this isn’t the thread to argue that but you could always make one and have it be argued for or against.
You're not listening to me, I said it doesn't matter what else is broken, it's irrelevant to the discussion about whether or not Absorb Heat was broken. The facts of the matter are, Absorb Heat was broken, it was providing you with heals even after you had cancelled it, you were cheesing a move to get free heals knowing you didn't have to do the channel, despite that clearly being the intent of the power and worse yet, I think all the fire players knew it was broken. It has been fixed, there's no "ifs or buts" here, Absorb Heat was broken, it has been fixed, end of story. If you have any other broken moves, powers, allies, artifacts, whatever you're welcome to discuss those, but they're entirely irrelevant.
So I just tested density and yup it is generating a small amount of super charge each time it is getting hit I’ve tested a few other shields in other power sets and they aren’t doing it so it appears to be an unintended benefit in the density shield and if it is truly unintended it should definitely get fixed … And yes you should definitely make a list and give examples of things that seem to be doing stuff that isn’t listed in the description … I’m all ears for other examples. I don’t understand the point you’re making … does this give fire a pass to break the rules of Channel abilities ? If Superman is truly working the way you are saying it is then it needs to be brought up as well in the proper threads
