Test Discussion Ally: Poison Ivy

That’s why you have options that’s the problem now with this game to much trying to have everything play the same. It’s the original off set of dc. This game once had powersets that played completely different and had benefits of that.
I would love to see an ally that focuses on powersets like one more in the future.
This game needs to knock off that everything for everyone mindset.
I don’t find that static ally useful at all for me but it’s a perfect concept for Electric healers and prec users so I love it cause I have options I don’t have to use it.

and what exactly will change in the game for the tank? passive skill is related to the shield ... not a single rotation of a single tank will change even by a small drop ... the only thing that will change is once again the DPS will receive an additional source of damage without touching a finger on a finger ... how is this different from situations with EoG for the nerf of which you voted with two hands (with EoG DPS at least had to be grouped, but here you don’t even need it, it’s enough to force the tank to pump the legendary ally ...)...)...

Tanks already have debuff options so right off the bat your argument in moot.

Actually it doesn’t make anything moot. We have options the devs want to make money. Sorry but get use to powersets having ally’s that appear make for them. Get use to it.

EoG is completely broken fundamentally, as I stated most mmos tanks have more utility. I run with elites I have a high understanding of the game I’m not saying you don’t but giving people options isn’t bad. They will be cases where Superman and or lex is better options.

LOL You're all over the place with this conversation. Focus.

Where exactly did I say that I was against having Allies made for specific powersets? As it is now on test, the Toxic Touch ability would only serve to benefit tanks. Nature isn't a tank powerset.

I’m directly on point you can choose to tlisten or not I don’t care. The ally works best for Tanks and Nature Dps. That doesn’t change nothing about what I said. I love this entire trend same as Static one passive benefits prec dps more the other electric healers that is how you make a ally that will sell. You coming at me dude ways when by design with the last two allies it lines up with a trend. If they want to profit they will keep this ally as Is with what ever y’all trying to push it will do the opposite. I’m buying this ally day 1, like I said you have options.

If they wanted to turn a profit they could scrap Toxic Touch and replace it with an ability for healers. How many healing allies do we have now compared to tank allies?

We have very limited options for healing honestly healing is currently the easiest role it’s already overly handicapped artifacts like purple healing ray and page that make it easy. But either way removing a defensive debuff is a loss of profit players will spend more on a defensive debuff on shields then giving healers a really unneeded passive.

I really wish the “nature” specific passive was geared towards healing, like the static ally. Considering nature doesn’t really have any great supercharges to work with and the healing goes completely against the current meta we’re in, I’d really have liked to see it get something for that role.

8 man shield

The way you've come at this so aggressively has proven my point. Of course you'll level it day 1, every elite tank player on the server will level it day 1, that's exactly my point and you've proven it for me.

I understand exactly why you want this ally, I'd take it too, it's usefulness in terms of buffing damage through no effort makes it a nonsense not to do so.

We disagree though as to whether ultimately it's a good thing to be doing this, which is fine.

Proxy if you took my comments as aggressive that wasn’t the case, I just don’t want to lose out on rare wins we get. You ask for bananas you might end up getting pears we have seen it for years. This is a good ally and useful. I don’t want to risk it asking for it to be changed into something nobody asking for.

K

its the same case for nature dps is in a pretty bad place atm more so then the healing side this helps that a lot.

With respect we just going to agree to disagree. Imo this is one of the best Allie’s I’ve seen done and we asking for a healing passive for an already overly easy role. No need to mess something good up for something that doesn’t need it. Let them add a healing passive on another ally.

Nature dps still has a prec side and it still does good dmg. Nature might definitely needs help, but I’m personally always going to prioritize support roles over dps (with things like this) when there is only one of each per raid and they carry a huge responsibility throughout the content.

By aggressive I just meant the way you were approaching it with a level of certain fervor, I didn't mean it in the negative sense of aggression. There was nothing wrong with your aggressive approach, just that it was; and ironically demonstrated my point, while probably intending to do the opposite.

That same fervor, of course, would be demonstrated by all other players in the game, including myself (from a selfish perspective), who would level this ally day 1 in its current state, especially if you're a tank player, you'd be silly not to do so, which is once again my point.

That's exactly why you're concerned about "losing it", normally I'd share that concern myself if I didn't have other bigger concerns overriding it.

That's why I said I understand why you desire this ally, it makes perfect sense to do so and it provides a robust alternative to those times you either don't want to use Superman or can't use a breakout to even benefit from his use.

Most scenarios don't actually require that Superman shield so what will happen is the tanks mandatory combination of Superman and Lex Luthor will shift to Lex Luthor and Poison Ivy in almost all scenarios, Lex, won't be removed, which is part of the problem that I have.

This doesn't really provide "options or choice" it just shifts the meta to something new, while making its predecessor obsolete, it's selling the ally through virtue of power creep, rather than by providing a legitimate alternative option. Poison Ivy would just be that much better.

We can talk about players have "options" all we like, but we are both elite players and we both know that isn't entirely true, it's a linguistic strategy we often fall back on, but know is only really true in normal content and those options diminish significantly so if not entirely once you enter elite or elite+ type content and elite groups make this fact well known through their behavior in game. That's why you see all the elite players bar less than a handful using the same equipment and those that don't typically aren't your top performers.

I think the passive on this ally is great, probably too great, from the perspective of a damage dealer, imagine the DPS comp players getting their hands on this "LF tank with poison ivy for DPS comp".

I just have concerns about how it feeds more into the damage mentality in the same way that controllers have become walking damage buffs, healers have become EOG super healing damage buffs, now tanks are to become walking talking "defense debuff" damage buffs.

It's not the right approach. if you want damage dealers to improve their damage then give the damage dealers direct buffs. I think the implication that support players are somehow there to simply "supplement damage players" is an unhealthy one and feeds in to the unhealthy perception that they're not there to "support the instance", they're just there to support the damage output, they're not quite the same thing.

Honestly we agree very often here, I will say everything you said is spot on the fear is again something else is asked for and we don't get anything like what were asking for, its happened to many times before...

Oh I agree, the last thing anyone wants is for it to be changed, if it even is changed, to something completely worthless, that's the exact opposite of what it currently is.

People will ask for it but they will not ban the most needed role for not having it. It all depends on how significant 10% less defense actually is, especially since its not 100% uptime. I say leave it as is.