I love DCUO so can you remove the stat clamp already?

This is going to sound brutal, but really, so what if they're tedious?

You're coming in to a game 13 years after the fact and not expecting a level of tedium because its more than a decade old, sounds like misplaced expectations.

It's pretty easy to get to an acceptable level of SP, the tedium aspect really doesn't even come in to play until you're further in the tail end.

"tedium and ease' also aren't as exclusive from each other as you want to allege.

So yeah, sorry, not sorry, my answer is "tedious, so what".

Time for me is also the greatest issue. And it isn't to be confused with "making everything trivial" or "being handed things", it's about striking a better balance between reward and time spent. With a sprinkle of trying to mitigate absolute disaster runs (targeted adjustments + added loot/time)... yes this happens....like what has been mentioned before, on average, what took x amount of players to reasonably finish, now takes ~ 3x the amount of competently built players to finish the content. Ideally, in a high population, better taught/funneled game, sure...this isn't as big of a deal and over time the player base will learn and adapt and overcome .... but I'm not certain that we are in that scenario.

This is an older game, several of the platforms have seemingly declining player bases and going the Free to Play model absolutely requires an influx of consistent new to intermediate players to progress and reach end game to be competitive and possibly spend some more money. Solutions that make this a reality is actually beneficial to all. The time it now takes to progress accross the 700+ SP and many years worth of content is much greater than before. The hope is you eventually get into End Game where you will either have invested a very large amount of time to obtain resources or coupled that with real money to purchase the various end game items.

So with that in mind what is the way to keep a healthy flow of players going and keep people enjoying content. I don't really know much about the game breaking because in my several years of playing I haven't personally felt that much. Honestly, the new UI and buggy menus on console are more game breaking then clamp/non clamp related things that I've ran into, but I digress.

That being said, I think there should be some loosening in the higher tiers of content on the clamp. Higher geared players should gain some more marginal stat benefits over at level and under geared ones, in order to try and push finish times a bit lower on average. We play 3 end game episodes and by the time the third one is about to rotate out we are well above its relevant CR at that point and it doesn't seem to be too game breaking from my personal sample size anyway. This isn't dismissing where these bugs occur, I'm just saying besides scarecrow in Arkham or a couple run ins with Brother Eye, I haven't felt anything too egregious in the past.

The other thing that would make the time invested more "fun" or worth it would be a rewards pass on most of the content. With completion times in hand, they can set some better rewards in terms of drops or marks output per time spent. If they are going to nerf stuff and go in one direction, it ruins the entire argument of an economy because you need to also balance it by buffing up the missions that pay too little in order to have said economy. It doesn't only have to be about marks either, as someone has stated in the past, you can even throw in some more collections or bump up the percentages of certain drops a little, ease up on early end game elite renown requirements, more spotlights etc.

There are many ways you can make older content more attractive. This keeps the clamp and the integrity of having new players experience the game like intended at level, while aiding their progression and feeling more like they are getting what they put in, in terms of rewards. This would also have a positive effect on End Game players running more EEG because it would actually be more profitable now for them to do so, thus increasing the overall available pool of players to help with all the feat gathering and queue times in EEG. (But in all honesty, that mountain of feats will be a slog regardless of clamp)

Time for Reward is the play here in my opinion. Boosted/Balanced rewards, comprehensive instance targeting and some higher tier clamp reduction to help boost finish times and allow end game players some more marginal benefits over the field. This can help those who want to feel a bit more powerful in the most recent EEG and have a larger practical impact on the group in the content they run. While simultaneously improving the overall progression curve of newer players while holding at level integrity. And yes we get the stat piercing, but overall, content still takes too long and the realities of the success vs failure scale is now much more dependent on higher group competency. I want a large, ready and able player base as well, but as explained above, in an idealistic situation that scale might look different, but as it stands, it's my opinion that the scale need be tilted a little.

You can't give it just to them. You have to give it to everybody. And it's not like it wouldn't be a lot of work, not too mention potential for bugs, glitches and exploits. Is it worth it, just to please a vocal minority of people, who clearly need to touch grass? I doubt it.

Which means there are enough people to fill the queue and the instance atcually happens. As opposed to splitting it into two queues and hoping it all works out for the best, which it wasn't, which is why we're where we are now.

Actually... Racists do.

THE MORAL OF THE STORY: Much like this instance...
THE PROBLEM DOESN'T LIE WITH THE TARGET, BUT THE ++++++' +++++++++ LAUGHING.




I'll give you a B for effort, tho... Tells ya what: B+ since I pity ya so much.

Once again, exactly on point. I can't comprehend how so many are hounding against your perspective, even if I'm not here with any agenda myself. I still can understand all sides of the dice.

Idk man, I still just think we should let ppl get their (old) SP however they want to. Catch up on their own pace, even if it's "easy". But maybe that's just me. I don't necessarily want a change, but it doesn't affect me either way if there happened to be one sometime along the line. In my eyes, anything to keep people on the game works at this point. Then again, it might just be the difference in server population dictating my views on the matter.

Indubitably, dear Watson!

I don't follow.

You seemed to have missed the point. You said that people rarely feat hunt, yet adding an option for unclamped so people can feat hunt will destroy the queues?

Yes, potentially, because not just "feat hunters" will use them. I don't know how many ways I can put this. If you give the players an easy way to steamroll content - they will. If you teach players: "Rush to end game (farming solos, short raids, whatever), get t6 gear, THEN go back and get easy feats and forget about EEG afterwards, except for USn for marks." - that's how large portion of playerbase will play it. And that's not a speculation - that's what always happened in the past. That's how it was years ago: get carried - get gear - go back and steamroll lower tiers - try playing EG raids, realize you suck and rage quit.

If you don't believe people will choose the path of least resistance, even if it hurts the game, the community and themselves in the long run - I don't know what to tell you.

Yeah but, there would be no loot. Thus they would have to go back and get said loot regardless.

Like - what kind of loot? How many EG players care about loot from EEG? And if by loot you mean rare drops for feats - well, then you'll have the same problem as now - you'll need to relentlessly grind those raids, clamped, at the mercy of RNG. Why not cut to the chase and ask for those feats now as well? Why are those feats OK to require effort?

At least with some feats, if you're good enough - you can get them every time, clamped or not. Counter feats are guaranteed after you reach a number. You can run something hundreds of times and not get the rare drop you need. Let's just ask for the "option" to not have to do that, why don't we.

This has been said countless times by many different people...

How is it still a question, and how is this not making sense?

The loot table PRIOR to the clamp, which is the SAME EXACT loot table options at the BOTTOM of the CURRENT loot table in EEG content.

Notice that gear isn't scaled?

That's all that would drop.

There would be a cap. You either get unscaled gear or a single source mark per boss. Other items normally include base items.

It's asking for exactly as it was before.

I'll let someone else argue over feats. I'm not concerned with them, but I do feel like they should be less time consuming. One way or another.

Expecting? No. Playing a game and thinking to myself, "man I sure enjoy this game, ya know what I think would smooth this particular rough edge I've noticed?" (insert the pitch I made here). At the end of the day I'll do what I've been doing the entire time this thread has been going on, playing the game and getting what I can done.

I like to discuss the things I'm enjoying, funny that. There is no screeching, entitlement, or anything else of the sort happening. There are a lot of old feats that are tedious and I have an idea how I feel they could be improved upon. Whether you agree with that or not makes no difference to me, just as I'm sure my opinion on the matter means nothing to you. We're just two people shouting into the ether on the slimmest of chances that the devs might read what we have to say and take some inspiration from that.

what type of pathetically say I want to go get some SP so I run unclamped once I get the seats I need I have no reason to go back because everything I needed I got.

In which case you're telling me it's going to be any different than pre-clamp when half the continent was dead because nobody ran it because nobody wanted anything from it?

You're telling me history won't repeat itself when we've already seen what happens?

And for so many people complaining in this thread saying they don't want to spend the time like 15 minutes in a raid you need to really play a different genre of game we're trying to take the MMOs genre and shorten it to a single player experience for your own personal enjoyment.

If you guys don't have the time to collect seats or run a raid I think you need to go do something else that's less time consuming for you. I don't have as much time to play as I did in 2011 and I'm okay with that. I'll let the new players coming up with more free time than I do have their fun rather than trying to adjust the game around my adult life. And short change players out of their experience, just so you don't feel like you're in a middle-aged gamer crisis

Because nobody is asking to not actually play the game.
That's an orange.

We're talking about apples.

Feat hunters don't really use ques to hunt for feats... They use LFG for the specific ones, at the very least.

Why do you make the assumption that they'll forget about EEG?

The problem with EEG being played isn't "People like steamrolling old bosses"... its the E.

It's old.
The trick to ensure that people still play old content:

1) Make it rewarding..
The thing that killed ques prior to the clamp was taking away marks... There was a diminished reward...
That's why rare drops are a good orange.

2) Make sure that people like playing them...

How about we don't make the old content, that has already been played for years, the same relative grind that it was years ago...

Sure, they gave back the reward but stifled the fun of playing a character that you've built for years.
That's the bad apple.

The clamp was a fix that targeted the wrong symptom and created a new side-effect.
And, sure, it's a side-effect that some people don't mind.

But, once again... OPTIONS.

Obviously why would we give you rewards for trivialized content and you're arguing vehemently for it?

The old system is gone and it isn't coming back, if you're so good at this game you can just find a group of people and knock these feats out. And is getting a group together is too hard and takes too long then you need to look to a different genre cuz this ain't it chief.

You keep saying optional stack clamp realizing it's not optional if everybody wants one so they can go knock these feets out. You must be really oblivious to human nature if you think players will not take the path of least resistance. And you truly expect players to give a rat's *** about any other person's experience when the pre-clip days clearly showed that players did not care about their fellow players experience as long as they got what they wanted.

This is ridiculous on how players are asking for an easy mode knowing it's going to affect the queues. Like once people go get their feet they're never going to go back so why would I waste developer resources making an anti-client version that will only be seen really once and even then it's trivialized, wasting my time even creating the content.


If you want your feats as bad as you do you wouldn't be sitting here on the forum begging for a trivialized version which they clearly haven't budged on. If you don't have these feats then maybe you aren't good enough to obtain them maybe you're relying on pure stats to overpower and nothing more? Maybe just maybe you aren't as good as you think you are,

Who is "we"?

Nobody is calling it "trivialized" but you.

Sure... Of course, this was true before the clamp.
Once again... I have most feats already... Feats aren't the main focus.

Why are you adamant against something that "everybody wants"??

The strength that you earn isn't "easy" mode.... It's "this is the level that I built to" mode.

I, for one, have all the feats I need already.

*sigh*

I'm done trying to deal with that pompous hattery. Have fun smelling your own flatulence.

We were talking about new players, correct? How would they level up by just getting SP and not gear or marks?