Why i don't play pvp anymore

Maybe this feedback will help improve pvp ,maybe it won't but here it is in a nutshell. Its not fun or fair if you fight a person who takes no damage but kills you in 3 hits ,why would i want to play that? if you actually got a fair fight in pvp it would be fun and worth playing but if i have to go into almost every fight with 0 chance of winning because of cheap exploits,broken mechanics and hacking i want nothing to do with pvp.

Other than a few duels i have not played pvp in 4 years. Just today someone in front of the hang out police station in metro challenged me to a duel ,i have duel set to auto ignore but i still see the text and after 3 no goes the guy texts me and asks for a duel so i thought oh why not and sure enough as soon as the fight starts he just stands there and i hit him over and over and do 0 damage to him then he hits me 2 times and i'm dead. Not saying he was speed hacking but it sure looked like it to me. I never looked at his gear so it could have been that idk.

What i think would help pvp and i know the pvp lords who like having unfair advantages are not going to like this but they need to eliminate pvp gear all together and just have to fight for styles etc. but nothing that gives you an advantage. Everyone needs to be on the same playing field and have a chance at winning the fight. The fights need to be about skills not gear and the cheaters who hack need to be dealt with. Make it like the events where you are cr 34 and have the same stats and eliminate the roles that give people unfair advantages and make everyone dps.

Anyway just my 2 cents

They should never of had 2 sets of gear (PVE/PVP)
Back in the day it was common to run you dailies, maybe hit up a raid then PVP for the rest of the night. I honestly haven't done a single PVP match in maybe 2 years

At this point the devs have essentially said it's a dead horse. To me they should just remove it altogether give peeps the feats (IK not a popular thought) and tweak legends.

The Lord agrees that Pvp should be about skill but what the gear represents is commitment to Pvp. Pvp is not ment to be equal. It is to separate the weak from the strong. The highly skilled or the useless walking, talking sparring targets. You write this might be feedback to improve Pvp but it is threads and requests like this that killed and destroyed Pvp. If you were cr 296 and The Holy one is cr 31 and we went into a raid together and He starting crying "I'm just as skilled as you, maybe even better, why are you doing more damage than me " you would laugh at his Eminence.

My lord man...do you even read the stuff you write?
It was bad enough when you used to post pics when you were flexing (not impressed fyi) but now this?

PVP is ALL about skill - gear shouldn't mean jack spit. Fighting games like Tekken, MK, SF were all based on the SKILL of the player.
Sure you could get new titles or different looks but your toons stats stayed the EXACT same. What separates the good from the bad was that players ability...Making any difference by stats was the first of many mistakes they made.

Also it wasn't threads like this..It was terrible decisions by the dev team and having no clue what they actually wanted to do.
Everytime they tinkered with PVE it messed up more things in PVP and vice versa.

I can't speak for everybody, just myself and the people I know.

We played PvP. Players said that it was "broken" and "unbalanced", but we played matches anyways. It wasn't always fun. It wasn't always competitive. But, we still played.

Then we finished our full CR101 gear. Shortly after that, we realized there was no further rewards for playing. And, much like I stop playing the new Episodes after I finish getting everything available from them, I stopped PvPing because I had everything.

I won't start PvPing again until they release the CR102 suit. And since there have been no new PvP gear for over 2 years, I'm not anticipating any change in that any time soon.

While a balance pass would be great and is long past due, literally just adding in another PVP set once every 6 months would keep PVP ques popping. Make the stats something silly small like 5 extra stats one every piece and players will be queing PVP for the style and feat alone. The fact that Daybreak chooses to not even do this is simply sad.

The Lord of 5 reads everything he writes. When his favorite tv shows are in reruns or he is bored at work he looks up all his old writings he has graced the forums with all the way back to 2013. Again, Pvp is about skill. It would be shame to deny that fact. Higher tier Pvp gear is a sign of commitment. The decisions to change Pvp by the developers came at the request in large demand by low skilled peasants who cried how it was not fair that more experienced players who took the time to earn the highest gear were wiping the floor with them with ease. They complained it was not fair that they could not get the feat points in Pvp because they could not win. Every day complaints were being posted on the forums about this and in usual fashion they threatened to cancel their subscriptions. So clamps were made to Pvp were as a level 25 cr could que up and actually beat a 99 pvp cr only because certain powers are stronger than others as well as the boost they got. Since you have been a member on here since 2017 The Holy One would not expect you to know this but ignorance is bliss. The Lord has beaten up some of your favorite people who post on the forms over the years.

What's funny to me about this post, it sounds more like a complaint from someone who is either too lazy or simply unwilling to put in the work for an appropriate set of PVP gear. Because if you had an appropriate set of PVP gear, even within the lower tiers, there is no way you would be ineffective towards causing damage and lose to someone attacking you with only two to three moves in a duel. Or, is that an exaggeration on your part?

In order to truly fix PVP, the DEVS simply have to go back to the roots of what made it thrive in the first place. Those of us among the PVP community who come from such days all realize the sort of gimmicks and broken mechanics that have steered us away from such. As a result, it's absolutely destroyed in its current state. But, this supposed unfair gear advantage you're speaking of is the last of such problems. Especially, when stats are boosted or even sometimes clamped within Arenas. The stat margins between PVP tiers have also been minimized. There's already enough set in place towards such regard to make things more "fair."

I understand where you're coming from, though. To be honest, it's something I've pondered myself only in the sense of how to get more people involved in PVP given what we have left among our community. Instead of eliminating that extra gear grind for PVP altogether, I would rather propose a stat unification. Basically, slapping toughness onto PVE gear, providing a more linear progression of how we go about building our characters. I've known many PVE'ers who have said they avoid PVP because they hate the extra gear grind and would only play it more if that wasn't set in place.

Ultimately, in such a request, what should probably be realized is it's a slightly dangerous one. You're talking about something that strips away every ounce of work PVP players have put in to earn their stripes. You have to be cautious of what that could possibly do to the PVP community as a lot would feel robbed if such a change took place. Especially, to work in favor for players who were never truly a part of that aspect of the community. Too many of such changes are essentially what contributed to ruining PVP.

It's already bad enough that we haven't received any updates or content towards PVP since 2016. And, don't feed me that "PVP doesn't make them money" garbage, as it's nothing but an excuse, and entirely false. But, going back to the topic at hand, it's truly something I'm on the fence about due to the aforementioned. Having separate gear sets for both PVE and PVP are a typical MMO formula as it is. Why should DCUO become exempt? Because you want things easy due to the losses you've taken? Or, are you really trying to find a solution that works in favor of everybody? I would hope it's the latter.

Ive been on forma since 2011.
Main account banned due to flaming Spytle

You however wouldn't know that. Along with the other gibberish be you spout

I did put in the work and got my pvp cr up to 99 way back when but it was not fun and this post is not a complaint from a lazy player its a suggestion on how to make people want to play it again,i thought the guy who made the mortal kombat fighting game reference nailed it. MK is about the skill of the player all stats are the same and it works in not just MK but most successful fighting games.

Where's the skill in pvp when a guy can just lose 1000 fights ,get the the top pvp gear and than just be able to stand there laughing at someone who can't damage him at all and than when he feels like it can do 2 or 3 attacks and win. Is that really a win? People do not find that enjoyable,thats why pvp is dead. If pvp ever has a chance to be good again is has to be fair to everyone or no one is going to want to play it.

As I said before, I get where you're coming from. But, I would have to slightly disagree on that point towards MK as it's not within the same game category. We're talking about an MMO here, it follows a different kind of design towards how we engage against other players. That's why I asked you the question of why DCUO should be exempt when other MMO's out there follow the same kind of gear set model.

It's simply the kind of thing that makes this style of game what it is. So, in that sense, we should be comparing and contrasting other games of the like. Can you think of a PVE/PVP based MMO that currently does PVP better than DCUO and why it works so well for their community given how gear ties in? Let's drag that into the discussion.

Besides, the problems within PVP run so much deeper than a mere gear advantage. You ask where's the skill? It was never impossible to beat someone of a higher tier to begin with. Although, yes, it was challenging. So, I can assure you that's nowhere near the reason for why PVP is dead. The broken mechanics and lack of attentiveness to further develop it are far higher contributors as to why that is. Having the DEVS address those two aspects alone will get people to want to play again, including myself.

But, focusing strictly on the matter of gear, there was only one thing I had wished they had done way back when this all started. CR balanced queues, matching up strictly against players who are within your range or level. And, that would've worked tremendously if they had thought to do such then. Skill would've played a much bigger factor in such a setting. Too bad we're beyond a point that makes it a doable system to pull off today.

Still, I'm open to such an idea as you presented, just not entirely sure it's the right direction to go. We're walking a fine line here for what can be deemed as fair in this situation. Sure, I guess it's fair to have everyone reset to zero for the sake of putting everyone on an even playing field. But, is it fair for dedicated players to be stripped of everything they've earned just to work in the benefit of someone who wants the easy way out? Where's the real compromise in that split of the two sides?

As long as people have an unfair advantage be it gear ,tank,heal,speed hacking etc pvp will stay dead. I can understand why people with high pvp gear would be upset losing their advantage but if no one is playing all that gear is useless anyways. In the time i did play pvp i did have a few even matched fights where we were geared the same and both dps and those fights were fun win or lose because it was an even and fair fight and those i miss but sadly those fights were far and few between. If pvp was fixed i would probably play it again but in the state its in now i'm happy to just play pve.

Supposed gear and role advantages are not even the core issues as to why PVP is in the state that it's in. Let's pinpoint the real problems, address those. Yeah, speed-hacking is one thing to look at. It would be great if the DEVS were able to come upon a solution to shut that down for good, once and for all. But, you're still not answering the big questions that draw the disconnect between the two sides. PVP couldn't be fixed in the way you'd want it to unless that's figured out.

For instance, I can tell that we don't share the same mentality as competitors here in PVP. I've been in this since 2011 on an OG PVP server such as TKJ. I've been through all of the trenches and adversity. I never made excuses about players having better gear than me. I took on those challenges, trying to figure out how to beat such players in a disadvantaged position. At times, I was able to do just that. What supposedly wasn't fun for you, was the kind of thing I allowed myself to learn from and gained fulfillment once all of that was figured out.

Because there are those of us who willingly stepped up to the plate and took on every challenge to earn our stripes, it's hard to sympathize for the standpoint you're coming from. This is the mass majority of the PVP community we're talking about here. If we were able to do it, why couldn't you? Sounds like you wanted nothing but the easy way out. Taking away what we earned will not necessarily be the ultimate solution to fix PVP, as the problems are way deeper.

Look at the entire spectrum of everything that contributes towards the reason why PVP is in the state that it's in. Realize the differences in what placed major impact vs. what's more so considered minor. I assure you, gear advantage is closer to the minor end of that very spectrum. But, if there's one thing we do share in common here, though, we both want PVP to be fixed. How to go about fixing it should be well thought out, instead of making a decision that could be deemed as rather impulsive.

I have offered no solution only suggestions to help find a solution to fix pvp,gear,roles and hacking are only part of it but thats a good place to start imo. Maybe add the ability to trade pvp currency for quarks as well,i'm sure that would get more people playing pvp. Back in 2006 i played a little game called SvR 2006 online and yes there was people with game sharks cheating but most of the fights were fair because everyone had the same stats so it came down to your skills and how you used your move set and the fights were fun,i also played MK against people online and in arcades and again it was fun and fair and thats what pvp here needs fair fights that come down to skills not op gear,pvp gear should be eliminated and just give the players who farmed pvp gear marks or quarks.

Are you talking about WWE Smackdown vs. Raw??? If so, that's not an MMO and neither is Mortal Kombat. Where are your MMO comparisons that operate on the same kind of design within aspects of gear? You keep comparing these list of games in the Fighting category, that's not what DCUO is. And, you're still not acknowledging the real questions that need to be asked. Why should PVP gear be entirely eliminated when the majority of the PVP community had no problem building their way up to earn that gear? That's just how many MMO's work when regarding a PVP system.

So, again, I ask you, why should DCUO become exempt? Are you really thinking of everybody or are you just thinking of yourself? We need real solutions for that happy medium. And, what to do with excess marks is a whole other discussion. We should have quark conversion for every mark type if we're to be honest. But, again, that's a whole different topic.

Those are not mmos but the pvp in those games is a good example of whats needed here. "Why should PVP gear be entirely eliminated when the majority of the PVP community had no problem building their way up to earn that gear? That's just how many MMO's work when regarding a PVP system" I get it you started at launch and you like being able to lord over new players so you don't want to give up your precious advantage even if it means pvp staying dead. Unfair fights where 1 player has a huge advantage over another drives new players away and kills pvp. I still remember the grind to getting my cr99 pvp gear and most of my fights being losses because i could not do any damage to the other player,it was very frustrating,no fun at all and the only reason i kept on was because i wanted the gotham knight style at the time and as soon as i got it i quit pvp. I would bet that if pvp gear was eliminated more people would start playing it because most people who play pvp want to feel like they at least have a chance of winning the fight and idk any more ways to basically say the same thing over and over to you but the bottom line is pvp needs balance or no one is going to want to play it.

They have no plans for PvP because powers are not balanced. They won't be coming out with a new power because they can't even balance the ones they have. So that 100% means no new powers or PvP till that gets under control first. They are working on it now actually first tank roles now pets. I'm guessing healers next and trolls. Last would be dps because that's the one that will take the longest. But maybe it won't if they go down the list. It's still gonna take all year to get some balance going to get anything with PvP done or new powers

You're entirely missing the point. This was never about being able to "lord over new players" or a so called "precious advantage." A key word I mentioned to you was COMPROMISE. Where is that compromise if we're to completely strip PVP gear away and to say that's it? There is none. And, that's the answer we need to find. But, we can't get there if your approach completely overlooks that very important aspect.

You don't know any more ways to basically say the same thing over again? All you've done was repeat yourself completely evading the questions that need to be addressed. Did you really think I couldn't see that? Answer those questions with some real thought and you could've avoided talking in circles.

You can't sit there and say to strip all PVP gear because you supposedly couldn't damage or beat someone. Especially, when the majority of the PVP community took on those challenges. Again, this is an MMO, your list of games were not good examples as they don't fall into the same type of game model.

How can you even assure that more people would PVP if this were to happen anyway? Are you thinking of the appropriate way to go about it? Are you thinking of how this would effect those left within the actual PVP crowd? What about the aspects of change towards PVE gear in open world PVP if that's all we're left with? Every response of yours tells me you're not at all. And, I'm sorry, but that's not the way to go about this.

Again, gear is among the least of problems for why PVP is in the poor state that it's in. If you really believe there's no balance from that aspect alone, then you would never see low tier players beating high tiers in today's Arenas. The same thing applies towards duels. Remember how I said the stat margins between PVP tiers were minimized? That's the kind of thing that helped to bring a more balanced feel among each tier. Therefore, gear advantage doesn't hold the same weight as it used to.

Besides, even as the problems of PVP run much deeper and someone having slightly better gear than you seems too much of an obstacle, there's always Legends. Based on your sole issue, the style of PVP you want is already implemented in game. But, instead, you want to take away what the majority were willing to earn for reasons that seemingly make this only about you.

Why do you need your gear advantage so much if its not about lording over other players? PVP gear never should have existed in the 1st place anyways i'm getting tired of writing essays back and forth with you and quite frankly i don't care all that much about pvp anyways since as i said before i don't play pvp anymore, i really just created this thread to discuss how pvp could be improved and offered a few suggestions. I am not claiming to have all the answers but i do know people want fair fights in pvp not 1 sided squash matches where 1 player has no chance.

PvP gear is a double-edged sword. I understand that players want skill, not gear, to be the determining factor in match outcomes. And in a perfect world, that sounds the ideal way to do it. That's how most games that I would label as "PvP games" do it: Halo, Call of Duty, Fortnite, Street Fighter, etc.

However, there is slightly more at play in an MMO. When you look at a more traditional PvP game, something like Mortal Kombat, the game immediately has an expiration date. Playing with no rewards, with the "just for fun" mentality is great for a while. It can work for a few months. But it has a rapid drop-off in player interest as well. That is why so many of those games basically exist almost as seasons, releasing new versions every year. People get bored, quit playing the old one, then a new version comes out and they buy that one to start over again. In any given franchise, you will find the outlier, the one version that continues to be popular even outside of it's release year, like Call of Duty Black Ops III, or Street Fighter II Turbo, or Smackdown - Here Comes The Pain. Those games might suggest that it is possible for a pure fighting game to stay relative and popular long after it's release because they still get played. It's misleading though. Those games are the PvP equivalent of the enduring PvE games like StarCraft, Diablo 2, Warsong, and Final Fantasy VII; they still see gameplay clear to this day, but they are nowhere at all near as popular as they were at the time of their release. A really good PvP game will be the one that people go back to when the new release fails to deliver, but it will always gradually continue to taper off, no matter how good it is, because the gameplay experience never changes. At a certain point, players recognize that "just for fun" is not a good reason to keep playing something when they've already done everything there is to do.

MMOs are built on the shoulders of the idea of a persistent game, where a progression treadmill keeps going so all previous time continues to advance you. That's why mediocre games like World of Warcraft can have such an enduring presence in a genre that is otherwise dying. Once you've been playing the same game for 15 years, it's hard to just walk away from it, because that character reflects a combination of 15 years of work. Players don't want to quit because they feel like they will fall behind, and they want to keep playing so that they can get the next thing. MMOs are built on a progression mindset.

A zero-gear PvP system could work really well... short term. It would create a nuance of skill where players would test themselves. But eventually, once they find their place in the pecking order, they would be done with it, just like they do with any other zero-gear PvP system. It is the grind for the gear that keeps them playing even when the game stops being fun and starts feeling boring and repetitive (and that goes for PvP and PvE alike). Players are motivated by rewards, not challenges. PvP has to have rewards to keep players playing. And since an MMO isn't going to release a new version every year to try and sell the next incarnation, they have to find a way to breathe life into the old system.

That's the gear treadmill. That's why MMOs lean on it, while other non-persistant games don't have to. And honestly, it's the number one reason why PvP today is so barren. All the experienced players who like PvP finished their PvP gear years ago and have no reason to play... so they don't.

DCUO actually does have it's own no-gear system for PvP. It's called Legends PvP. And while Legends PvP was popular in the beginning, even offering players the chance to be Batman or Superman wasn't enough to keep them doing it when compared to the option of just earning gear and having progression. While gear does not provide the best PvP experience, gear is essential in order to get players to actually play the PvP, and having players queuing up and actively involved is very essential to the best PvP experience. Gear becomes a necessary evil in order to get folks in line.

The single biggest reason why PvP isn't more popular right now, I remain convinced, is that we haven't had a new PvP suit of gear in over 2 years. Every single time a new PvP suit is introduced, PvP sees a significant uptick in popularity while players grind the new stuff. We need new gear, at least one suit per year, or else it is never going to be popular again.